Ben Affleck’s growing distaste for playing Batman after Batman V Superman: Dawn Of Justice and Justice League was one of the worst-kept secrets in show business, to the point where nobody was surprised whatsoever when he was finally able to hand off the role to someone else—Robert Pattinson in director Matt Reeves’ The Batman. After finally taking off the cape and the humorously ill-fitting Bruce Wayne suits that didn’t have room for his massive bat-muscles, Affleck even dished a very small amount of dirt about why he had grown tired of playing the Caped Crusader. Then, with Affleck out, we even heard that Warner Bros. was going to bring back Michael Keaton’s Batman from the 1989 Tim Burton movie as a “Nick Fury-like” character who would mentor future DC heroes—starting with an appearance in the Flash movie, assuming it ever actually gets made.
But now, according to Vanity Fair, Ben Affleck’s Batman will also be in that Flash movie, which is going to deal with some alternate timelines and multiverse madness. (Sorry, did we say multiverse madness? We definitely didn’t mean to reference any other superhero movies.) The movie, directed by Andy Muschietti, is reportedly going to be an adaptation of the Flashpoint storyline in the comics, which was about The Flash accidentally changing history and dealing with the dark repercussions of his behavior. That’s probably how Keaton’s Batman will get involved, but at this point we don’t know if any other Batmen will appear. It seems unlikely, given how much George Clooney regrets the role, Val Klmer’s health problems, and the fact that Kevin Conroy already did this exact thing for The CW’s Crisis On Infinite Earths, but stranger things have happened. You know, like Ben Affleck deciding to play Batman again.
The Vanity Fair story actually digs into why Affleck is coming back and why his Batman in particular is important to this story, with Muschietti noting that both Bruce Wayne and Barry Allen (the Flash, spoiler alert) lost their mothers when they were young, which is “one of the emotional vessels of the movie.” Now we just sit back and wait for the Flash movie to get made someday.
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Naturally all these Batmen will be friends as all of their mothers are named Martha.I’ve probably said this before, but a key problem with Affleck’s Batman is that we don’t know we are never told what made him a murderous psychopath and, even after he allegedly learned the value of human life, continued to be a murderous psychopath.Outside of an Easter Egg reference to Death in the Family, we are never told what made him more aggressive. This should be a big fucking deal that Batman is killing people and the BvS never seemed interested in asking what made him this way. Hell, if you have no idea who Batman and Robin were, you’d probably assume that Robin costume was something Batman used to wear.And, even though it’s stupid as hell and makes no sense, I get the intent of “Save Martha!”. It’s Bruce realizing the value of human life. But that falls flat since right after that scene he murders a bunch of people, even incinerating a man alive.Affleck’s Batman starts BvS as a murderous psychopath with no explanation and ends the movie as a murderous psychopath who will only spare your life if your mother’s name is Martha.
It’s almost like Snyder either doesn’t understand or actively disdains the concept of heroism.
It’s also ironic that Snyder thought he needed to explain why Superman doesn’t kill (Even though he still killed that warlord at the start of BvS.) by having him kill Zod but never bothers to explain why Batman kills.
Zack Snyder is like the guy who read All-star Batman and Robin and thinks the warped Frank Miller version is the real version of the character. If he had Affleck scream “I’m the Goddamn Batman!!!” I could at least enjoy the Snyder Batman, rather than get angry that the man who was in charge of him had no comprehension of Batman.
Don’t you read Ayn Rand?Self-sacrifice is for chumps. Self-interest is where it’s at.
And yet Man of Steel and BvS exists.
I remember all the horrible arguments about Batflek’s terrible behavior. “Batman killed when he originally appeared! In 1939! In a continuity that hasn’t existed for nearly eighty years!” I think my favorite was “letting criminals live is UNREALISTIC!”Yeeeeeah, a rich dude who trained himself to be the greatest detective, scientist, inventor, martial artist, who can fly a fighter plane in the middle of a cityscape (powerlines? WHAT powerlines?) and pilot a mech suit to kill aliens is believable enough, sure but sparing the lives of CRIMINALS? Waaaaart?
The whole concept of Batman v Superman as a movie is relentlessly dumb.If Superman wanted to, he could kill Batman 50 times before Batman could process one thought in his “world’s greatest detective” brain.For that alone, they had to intentionally have Superman ‘hold back’ or the movie would be over right after the opening theme. That does not start you out on good footing for making a film.Still, the warehouse scene might be the best h2h combat scene in the entire filmography.
Batman beating Superman is probably the thing I have the least problem with, he’s always pretty much been a deus ex machina.It’s never explicitly stated that he has super powers, but Batman is basically intelligent to the point of omniscient— he basically has God-level intelligence and foresight when needed by whatever story.
“he basically has God-level intelligence and foresight when needed by whatever story.”See, thats where the movie failed terribly, though. Remember the scene when Superman takes out the Batmobile? He could’ve ended Batman right there if he wanted to, and apparently Batman’s mighty intellect didn’t see that coming.
But, this Batman didn’t even have average human intelligence. He got duped by a Lex Luthor whose super-schemes revolved around getting people to drink pee. He didn’t even steal lots of pies like in that DC dictionary.
Not to nitpick, but it was cakes. 40 cakes. That’s as many as four tens. And that’s terrible.
Ha! No, that was a terrible mistake on my part – I actually own the thing. I appreciate the correction.
Lex Luthor also has this weird variable intelligence thing going on. Comics are weird. Who doesn’t like pee though, that was Snyder’s Oscar moment.
In fact, I don’t think Batman ever figures out Lex Luthor was manipulating him the whole time.
The whole concept of Batman v Superman as a movie is relentlessly dumb.Eh, I think it’s doable, the people writing the script and directing just need to love comics.Even suited and kryptonited, Bats is no match for Superman, even if he can resist for quite some time – but he has more than enough tools to be a moral or general victor outside of a punch up. It just requires a lot of planning, which he excels at.Outside of TDKR, there’s a great example in one of the comics where Bataman contains a mind-controlled Superman by asking Catwoman to kidnap and threaten Lois Lane – because he knows that Clark loves Lois THAT much and he also knows Catwoman’s just amoral enough to make that threat both credible and safe.That should have been the movie: Batman waging psychological warfare on Superman to either wear him down for an easier takedown or to test if he’s the real deal. But you’d have to grab someone who actually enjoys and gets the things they’re trying to adapt.
Your argument makes absolutely zero sense. The whole point of the movie was that it wasn’t a real 1v1 fight. I don’t understand what you are trying to argue here.
You’re actually right—the whole premise of the movie ended up being how easily manipulated the “world’s greatest detective” was.
This white woman should really stop pretending she speaks for Muslims, nonwhites, and the LGBT and then blocking those people when they disagree with her.
I like how Snyder uses the word “deconstruct” instead of “change,” because a multisyllabic word sounds more smarter. I also like how his “deconstructions” make the characters more generic rather than more distinctive.You’ll notice that I was deconstructing the word “like” in that paragraph.
Him killing people was jarring— that’s like the one thing Batman doesn’t do, it’s the line he won’t cross that all his antagonists try to get him to cross, DAMMIT! I can forgive the one kill by Superman, because, eh, it’s not a hugely defining characteristic he has, and it was one guy as powerful as he was with no out left in the story. But Batman, geez, why? I should’ve prefaced this by saying, I know there’s stories where he has done this, but as mentioned in the OP, it would be nice to know WHY.
On the positive side, Affleck did well with the awful material he got and now at long last we can see an Affleck Batman not shackled to Zack Snyder.
Batman #452: “Actually, in my universe my mother’s name is Stephanie.”Batman #86 to Batman #109: “I don’t trust this guy.”
To be fair, we really don’t need more Batman origin stories.
Not an origin story per se, just what turned him into The Punisher with Bat Ears
The Snyder Batman is that way because Snyder is a hack.What you’re listing is very interesting, and well beyond the writing skills of Snyder.
But, Barry’s mom wasn’t named Martha. How can Bruce Wayne possibly relate?
“I lost my mother at a young age.”“WHY DID YOU SAY THAT TRAGIC MOTIVATION?”
Barry: Her name was Marti.Bruce: Eh, close enough.
You know, the CW shows are (sometimes deeply) flawed in many ways, but nothing the DC movie-verse has produced is as good as Legends of Tomorrow, and most of the other shows have at least a season or two that is better than the best of their films. Do they really think it’s wise to invite direct comparisons to the major TV event? Other than Keaton’s Batman, do we really need a “Crisis, but for expensive versions of the characters that you don’t really like”?
I feel Doom Patrol is on par with Legends of Tomorrow.
Stargirl had a solid first season, too. The DC Universe stuff is probably even better than the CW in terms of average quality across the four live-action things it’s done, but I was limiting myself to highlight the crisis similarities, which they weren’t really a part of except in a stock footage sense.
Stargirl was WAAAAY better than i ever hoped it would be. I had low expectations, but i’d put it just behind Legends of Tomorrow in the current CW lineup.
so seems like it would make just as much sense for cavill’s superman to come back for the exact same reason, right?
Cavill as Superman has been such a wasted opportunity. Great casting, bad scripts.
Given how nice Cavill’s home PC build is, I have trouble calling the whole thing wasted.
It’s one thing I was gladly proven wrong about after seeing him play Geralt.
I am not a big fan of either Affleck or spandex-based films, but I actually liked his Batman, all things considered. No accounting for taste I guess.
I felt like his Batman actually LOOKED the most like “Batman”of any incarnation, ever. Basically the Arkham Knights batsuit, which I loved. And he had the bulk of Dark Knight Returns Batman, which is a great look too.Also, i feel like Clooney has a pretty good sense of humor about his Batman movie, and i wouldn’t rule it out that he wouldn’t at least consider it.
So reading between the lines, Affleck’s Batman likely sacrifices himself, and this will be a final send off for Affleck and a passing of the torch back to Keaton?Despite being clearly over the role in Justice League, I liked Affleck in BvS even if the movie around him was weak. But I am stoked to have Keaton back.
The theme I think is multiverse. So Affleck is the Batman tied to Flash but then we also meet Keaton as Batman and that’s how we establish a multiverse where all the movies matter. After that, it’s basically a get out of jail free card for Warner brothers. A solo Joker movie matters as much as a wonder woman movie and so on.
I don’t think the producers would be dumb enough to kill off Affleck’s Batman now that he’s on the hook again.
I disagree. I think it’s a Han Solo situation where he only agreed to come back just to give the character a proper send off. I think Affleck still isn’t crazy about the commitment and doesn’t want to overshadow Robert Pattinson in the Batman.
To be fair, Keaton’s Batman did ask already ask us if we wanted to get nuts.
To be fair, Keaton’s Batman did ask already ask us if we wanted to get nuts.
from the 1989 Tim Burton movie as a “Nick Fury-like” character who would mentor future DC heroes—They should have him as Old Bruce helping Terry McGinnis as Batman.
Why have they not done a Batman Beyond movie?
With Keaton and a multiverse, maybe they can now.
Is Ezra Miller still playing Flash, or they haven’t said yet?
Still playing Flash. They recently released a short or something with him in it.
CGI Adam West or GTFO.
I mean, they already had Burt Ward in “Crisis on Infinite Earths.”
Oh, they did?? Clearly, I need to watch this asap.
It was like 10 seconds, but it was nifty.
I’ll be really honest here. The version of Batman in the Justice League movie is probably my favorite live-action version of the character. I actually like Ben Affleck the fact that he was able to not only have scenes where he was worried, scared, and full of guilt, but also lots of scenes of him being snarky as well made him feel more like an actual character instead of just a parody of the Frank Miller version. I know filmmakers are obsessed with making Bats moody and angsty and grimdark, but Snarky Bats is best Bats.
All the pain you see in JL was genuinely Affleck’s. He thought he was done with the movie and can focus on his personal issues and projects but then he was called back for unneeded reshoots. It’s one reason he wanted to stop playing the character.
Which is hilariously why a lot of the Snyder fans despise that movie. Any scene where Affleck’s Batman was an actual character and not some gritty murder Miller Batman was a source of fury to them. (I frequent DC fan pages on Facebook and the stuff those Snyder people feel is baffling)
I don’t think Affleck is the best Batman, but I do think he’s the best Bruce Wayne.
My favorite version of this trope is actually from the 2010s TMNT series. While it was fun having Brandon Routh and Tom Welling revisit Superman for Crisis on Infinite Earths, I think the TMNT crossover does the best to be true to the spirit of all incarnations of the material. They managed to use the opportunity to do more than merely spoof one version of the characters, instead they reminded me why I liked giving different stories a chance. It would be really nice if Keaton and Afflec weren’t just mere cameo tokens to remind us we’re seeing a different world, but actually had independent relevance to the plot.
From what I understand, Flashpoint is pretty complicated and might be kind of tough to do all in one movie. Maybe if they had someone in charge of their overall story arc and had set things up over the course of multiple coherent movies it could work out pretty decently.
I was thinking as a joke that it would be funny with all of the Martha crap, it’ll be funny if one or more Batmen get a chance to run afoul of the Martha Wayne that became her world’s Joker. And then remembered that was from Flashpoint anyway, so maybe we’ll get to watch Affleck’s Batman brutally murder the psychotic alternate timeline doppleganger of his dead mother! This is all assuming the movie ever actually gets made, but I suppose it New Mutants finally achieved that goal more or less, this can too.
Makes sense that the first Flash story they figured they’d tell is the one where the hero makes an incredibly selfish, stupid choice that negatively affects the entire world around him, and all the other heroes become dArK aNd eDgY.
Not like Flash is known as a light-hearted hero with a super colorful and goofy rogues gallery. We wouldn’t want that! Not in our DC Cinematic Universe!
Yes, because if history has taught us anything, it’s that movies are contractually obligated to make nothing but 100% faithful comic book adaptations all the time!
Someone get Burt Ward on the phone!
“Good news, we’ve talked with Pattinson’s people, and he’s available, so we can work his Batman into the film too.”“Oh, cool. We are still going to have the Flash in this movie, right?”“Hm? Oh, yeah, of course. Harry Alvin, the Clash, love that character.”
With this news and The Snyder Cut coming out, I’m even more optimistic that Snyder will actually get to wrap up his story with a Justice League movie about Darkseid, with Affleck taking part.
That is so cool.
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