Obi-Wan Kenobi writer says they all take canon “very, very seriously”
Fans concerned about the Obi-Wan/Leia relationship can breathe easy, says executive producer Joby Howard
Aux News Obi-Wan Kenobi
Calm down, Star Wars fans: Obi-Wan Kenobi is going to address all your grievances. A series featuring some of the most major characters in the franchise during a previously unexplored time period was bound to shake things up, but writer and executive producer Joby Harold promised Entertainment Weekly that all the pieces will fit into the Star Wars puzzle in the end.
One of the major complaints about the show so far is that Obi-Wan’s (Ewan McGregor) bond with young Leia (Vivien Lyra Blair) flies in the face of older Leia’s (Carrie Fisher) iconic message in A New Hope, where she seems to introduce herself and ask for Obi-Wan’s help.
“We talked about it a lot,” Harold said of this critical piece of Star Wars lore. “And we’re looking forward to the show airing in its entirety so that hopefully all questions are answered fully. So it’s tricky to field some of those questions mid-process. But yes, all I can say is we’re very cognizant of that, and of canon. And it’s a massive team, Lucasfilm, so we’re all very aware of all the choices that are being made.”
Does young Leia hit her head and forget all her youthful adventures? Is she mind wiped? (Sorry, that’s Men In Black.) Only time will tell. But the Leia/Obi-Wan relationship isn’t the only bit of muddled canon: fans also raised eyebrows when Reva (Moses Ingram) appears to kill the Grand Inquisitor (Rupert Friend), a character who plays a crucial role in the animated series Star Wars Rebels (which takes place years after Obi-Wan).
“It will be so much easier to speak to these things once we’ve aired everything,” Harold reiterated to EW. “But as I said before, we very much take canon very, very seriously. And there are many, many people behind the scenes who prioritize that. So we have it in mind, and by the time everything has concluded, all things should be in place.”
So instead of complaining about disrupted canon, now’s the time to theorize just how these elements will fall into place by the end of Obi-Wan. Who’s got money on a Men In Black mind wipe?
182 Comments
“So instead of complaining about disrupted canon, now’s the time to theorize just how these elements will fall into place by the end of Obi-Wan.”
Can we complain about how terribly boring the Leia/Obi-Wan runaround is instead?
yeah they’re gonna jedi mind trick leia. called it.
Bail Organa has a history of wiping minds to preserve continuity. He’s gonna become a repeat offender.
And replace everything with a memory of her mother she tells Luke about?
Oh jeez that’s probably it. Guess they aren’t familiar with how a similar thing went down with Doctor Who fans?
She’s figured out that Obi-Wan knew her mother. It’s likely that he inevitably tells Leia about her.
honestly…i hadn’t considered it but that would add a little more to it.
1) Not how mind tricks work.2) Erasing her memories aren’t necessary at all, nothing has violated OT continuity, only fan preconceptions. 3) It wouldn’t even make sense in-story to want to erase her memories.
Counterpoint:1) Not every single Jedi power has been depicted 2) Leia/Obi Wan’s adventure hasn’t broken canon, but it has bent it considerably. Other aspects of the show have broken canon.3) I don’t really care either way and I genuinely don’t think Leia will have her memory tampered with FWIW.
I don’t understand why people think Leia not mentioning her adventures with Obi-Wan in ANH somehow violates continuity or canon.She’s recording a message while stormtroopers have boarded her vessel and loads the message into Artoo seconds before she is stunned. Why do people think it’s necessary she spells out every interaction she ever had with him?
1) doesn’t matter2) okay3) why not
I totally agree that I don’t see the fact that Leia knew Obi Wan as a child as an issue for A New Hope. It could be that she formally introduced herself in her hologram because she knows that it’s been a few decades since Obi Wan has seen her and may not realize who he’s talking to.
OR… “Leia, don’t tell anyone”Leia: “OK”
Like when Superman kissed Lois Lane and she forgot everything…that might be weird.
Especially since Christopher Reeve is dead and Superman is DC.
Let’s be honest, George Lucas pretty much tossed continuity and canon into a blender in the prequels. The guy contradicted damn near every line uttered about the past in one way or another.
Yeah, after you have Anakin building C-3PO (and 3P0 living on the moisture farm before!) and being best friends with R2 continuity stopped mattering a long time ago.
Yeah still waiting on how Leia knew her mother was beautiful, kind and sad in Return of the Jedi, when she died 2 minutes after giving birth to her in Revenge of the Sith.
She has a really good memory. Except for about Kenobi.
She remembers he’s Ben Kenobi even though without a prior meeting she would have no reason to know about his alias.
I don’t understand why Leia in ANH is considered to have “forgotten” Kenobi, just because she doesn’t say “years ago you helped my father in the Clone Wars…and also saved me from a bad guy. Remember that? Oh fun times. We go way back. Let me go into every detail about our relationship in this holographic message.”Just because she doesn’t mention a thing that happened doesn’t mean she “forgot” it. She was recording that message as stormtroopers were attacking her ship. She is shown loading the message into Artoo seconds before stormtroopers stun her.Maybe she omitted some info in the interest of expediency?
Because no one would ever lead with “you knew my dad” when you personally knew someone and they had saved your ass. You would say “I need your help once again.” This is particularly true given that she recorded the message while under attack – you wouldn’t waste time reminding someone you directly knew that they also knew your dad.
Except she was sent by her dad to specifically recruit Kenobi…so why exactly WOULDN’T she tell him in the message “my dad is asking for your help” when that’s exactly the case? She is relaying her father’s request. He sent her as an emissary to recruit him to help the cause. Why would she spend a bunch of time going into their shared history, when the meat of the message is “my dad needs your help”?This just seems like a continuity error people made up in their heads.
Yup. There are laborious workarounds for all of it in order to kinda make sense, but to get worked up about how maybe Obi-Wan met Leia as a kid or maybe encountered Vader in between Ep3 and 4 is kinda odd considering the mental gymnastics necessary to square the prequels with literally EVERYTHING WE KNEW about that era from the OT. Not the least of which that Obi-Wan just has to be a compulsive liar, even when he’s coming clean to Luke in RoTJ.
I honestly can forgive changes to canon a lot more easily than I can forgive inept screenwriting. I didn’t really care about the changes the PT made to what the OT had established; but the plotting, characterization, and dialogue were all so bad. The Mando, Fett, and Kenobi shows are all doing the same damn thing, where the basic narrative just is utterly inept.
I actually find it a lot more fitting that Obi Wan met Vader between eps 3 and 4. Vader comes off as way too calm for that being the very next time he sees the guy who cut all his limbs off and threw him into lava.
Vader does seem way too calm if that’s the first time they’ve ever met each other since he became a cyborg.BUT, there’s this exchange:“When I left I was but a learner, now I am the master.”“Only a master of evil, Darth.”In my pre-prequel head canon, I assumed that the lightsaber duel over a lava pit and Anakin’s transformation into Vader would occur at the end of the *second* movie, with Anakin having been introduced as a young adult around Luke’s age in the first movie and having two full movies to complete the transformation. And then I pictured the third movie revolving around Obi-Wan and Yoda trying to keep the Skywalker twins and their mom safe, with a fully formed Vader chasing them around the galaxy. And maybe Obi-Wan owns Vader again while he’s in the suit, thus prompting the “I was but a learner” thing.So my issue is not so much that they are meeting between Ep. 3 and 4, but that it’s occurring a bit late in the timeline. And having Vader easily win that rematch makes the insecure “Now I am the master” bit from ANH feel off.I guess they may still do another rematch where Obi-Wan wins, but it’s still been so long since Anakin became a Sith and left Obi-wan’s apprenticeship that I don’t see how he could consider himself a “learner” at this stage.
I’d always assumed 20 years of time and extreme Jedi-like meditation could do that. I kinda like the concept of a character who can harness anger and hate in such a focused manner, while still remaining totally, scarily calm.
So you’re saying it depends on a certain point of view.
I thought that was covered. That her Force abilities gave her the ability to view those images, and she didn’t realize they were from her as a newborn instead of a toddler.
My headcanon is that she “remembers” her mother because of the Force. We already know the Force can allow people to see visions (past, present. and future). Why wouldn’t it allow a child to “see” a memory of her mother, especially with all the Force related energy flowing between Anakin and Padme during the birth. Leia being a young child doesn’t fully understand and simply believes she somehow remembers her mother
Nah. It goes all the way back to the OT.
No he didn’t. The prequels were additive; nothing was contradicted, only clarified. Also retcons began with The Empire tries Back. Vader’s ID was retconned, Vader’s relationship to Obi-Wan was retcon when he merged with Luke’s dad as the same character, defeating the Empire at the end of ANH was retconned, and so on.
I wish they’d take screenwriting seriously. The writing in this show is… not quite as bad as the other live-action SW shows, but it’s pretty bad.
imho this has the worst writing so far.How did Obi-Wan get away from Reva in that rooftop chase? Offscreen teleportation!How did Vader not sense Leia or Obi-Wan hiding behind a door 20 feet away even though he can sense when Luke is even on the same planet as he is? Who knows!?
I can forgive some stuff like that if the overall storytelling is good, but it’s just so consistently clumsy. In the last episode I couldn’t go more than 2 minutes without facepalming or going “wait what?”
Yep, same as the ballistic weapons in space from TLJ: I’m an old fan, I had all the EU books up through Vector Prime, I can dig stuff like inertial dampeners and space wizards, but holy crap some things are just a bridge too far.
Cosign that right there. This show is cringe.
Last episode had some genuinely dumb WTF moments. Prior to that, the occasional lapses were relatively minor.
Planting your dirty palm into the side of your dirty face.
All SW content has played fast and loose with who can sense what and where and when. This isn’t remotely new. As for Leia, there’s no reason Vader should be able to detect her.
Offscreen teleportation is not usually part of Star Wars.I can get behind that for Leia but he detects Obi-Wan on the Death Star so there’s no reason he shouldn’t sense him 20 feet down the street.
Counterpoint. Obi Wan force has been diminished in this series. And Darth Vader may have stronger force senses in ANH after years of hunting Jedi. Reva can senses Leia is bullshit tho.
He absolutely does detect Obi Wan. Remember that point where he stops, turns and practically stares right in the direction of where Obi Wan was hiding? And then he starts killing random villagers mercilessly? Yeah, he was doing that to draw Obi Wan out. Sure he could have just gone in and brought him into the street, but he didn’t. He wanted to coax a reaction out of Obi Wan, and he did – fear and retreat. And then, he went in for the kill. There have been some pretty weird beats in this show but that isn’t really one of them.
Exactly. Watch the scene again. It’s extremely clear that he can sense Obi Wan’s general presence (if not the exact room he’s hiding in.) It’s literally what catalyzes him into starting to murder people.
Agreed, he knew Obi wan was there and was baiting him. I even said that out loud to my wife the moment he killed the first innocent bystander.
Thanks! I mean, it’s not a subjective opinion. It has nothing to do if you liked the show or the episode or the scene.Vader is walking through the street. Obi Wan senses him, reacts. Vader’s walking, looking around, walking….Then Vader literally stops in his tracks. Pauses and cocks his head. And then immediately starts killing people.That moment of stopping and reacting? That’s him sensing Obi Wan! It’s not hard folks!
🙂
He did not, he just walked away instead of walking toward him.
He absolutely detects Obi Wan “twenty feet down the street.” Either you were napping or your viewing comprehension is lacking.
So he detected Obi-Wan and then just…walked away?That doesn’t make any sense.
I literally don’t know what scene you’re talking about. However, in the actual show, Vader, senses Kenobi, pauses, and then starts murdering people to bait him into coming out. He doesn’t “walk away” from anything. I have no clue what you’re referring to.
Yeah that’s not what happened at all: Vader rolled in with the Inquisitors and starts killing people but there’s no indication that he senses anyone.The fact that we can’t even agree on that means the writing was lousy. That’s not even getting into how Reva got in front of Leia.
No, it means you watched it wrong. The scene is as clear as day (others in this thread have said as much, as well.) Pay attention next time, don’t blame the show for your own failings.
Huh, others in the thread have agreed with me too, so I’m gonna say that you’re watching it wrong.“Pay attention next time, don’t blame the show for your own failings.”Show is pretty badly written and edited = my failings.Maybe learn how to have a polite conversation without slinging low key insults at people you disagree with, it’ll make you a more pleasant person to talk to.
Watch the scene, you colossal idiot. This isn’t a matter of opinion or interpretation. Is that polite enough for you?
No, you’re being a real douchbag about friggen Star Wars so I’m gonna go ahead and report/dismiss at this point.
Learn how to talk like a civilized person.
As for Leia, there’s no reason Vader should be able to detect her.This is actually a good point. Out of the characters we’ve seen in the show, only Obi-Wan (who can resist telepathy) & Bail (who Vader has not encountered) even know that she’s Vader’s child. Vader himself really has no reason to think Leia matters at all in the current circumstances except as live bait to lure out Kenobi.
Indeed. And let’s not forget Vader literally hung out with Leia repeatedly during ANH and never “sensed” anything about her. (Granted, it was written before their relationship had even been established, but it’s far from the only time Force users have been unable to casually sense each other.)
“Vader himself really has no reason to think Leia matters at all in the current circumstances except as live bait to lure out Kenobi.”
In what galaxy does it make sense that he wouldn’t be able to feel a) A BLOOD RELATIVE or b) someone who is force-sensitive?
Reminder: Vader’s and the inquisitors’ JOB is Jedi-hunting.
I don’t think anyone is saying this is a new thing. Because it “isn’t new” doesn’t mean we have to agree with it.
Yes, you do have to “agree with it.” Since SW canon has NEVER been consistent about how and when Force users can sense each other.Sometimes they can, sometimes they can’t at all. Sometimes there in the same room with each other and nothing. Sometimes they can across great distances. There’s literally no internal logic or consistency to it, it has always been dependent on the whims of the story.So to hold this show to a higher standard than every other piece of the franchise is bullshit.
“Yes, you do have to “agree with it.””
Wow, come back with an even MORE lazy reply, please.
I don’t want to make excuses for sloppy writing, but I have a sense of hearing, but sometimes, there are noises that I miss that someone else hears, and when they mention it, I pick up on it. I think that the ability for users to sense things using the force is like that. Some events like the blowing up of a planet, are hard for a Jedi to miss, but the presence of another user of the force is probably a bit more subtle and require more concentration to detect.
I just think it’s purposefully vague, which I think makes the force more interesting and more mysterious. I don’t think it should be an exact science.Does that sometimes create storytelling issues? Sure. But it’s been that way since the beginning and we just have to go with it. It’s baked into the concept.
“As for Leia, there’s no reason Vader should be able to detect her.”He shouldn’t be able to sense her because she is of his bloodline or because she’s force-sensitive? Which is the reason he SHOULDN’T be able to detect her?
Vader never detects her when she’s a Senator, either. Not when she’s standing right in front of him, either. He NEVER senses Leia in the Force in the OT, and only finds out about her by reading Luke’s thoughts.
Why not? Half of Leia’s genes are HIS Midichlorians. You know how many people in the Galaxy have high Midichlorian counts? Fewer than that, yep.
My favorite so far it the roadblock barrier that Obi-Wan and Leia easily could have walked around to get away, but blasted the panel anyway. So ok, maybe they did that to get in the vehicle and drive thru. NOPE! They just walk thru. But stuff like that is minor dumb details (though the show is littered with them). There’s still plenty of major stuff. Basically all of episode 4’s plot is just lazy and dumb, from the planning of the break in, to the execution of the break in, to the deus ex machina save, and finally to Reva saying she placed a tracker.And I really want to like this series too. I’m not putting a final grade on it, two episodes left and all, but they got some work to do to save it.
How did Vader not sense Leia or Obi-Wan hiding behind a door 20 feet away even though he can sense when Luke is even on the same planet as he is? Jedi have the power to hide themselves using the force. Obi-Wan, a trained Jedi master would easily be able to access this ability while an untrained Luke would not.
I can accept that Vader is still growing and developing in his use of the Force. They showed he hadn’t sensed Obi-Wan until after Obi-Wan reached out to him through the Force. Not every Force user has the same exact set of abilities. So it could be that Vader hasn’t gotten to where he can recognize someone simply through their Force presence yet. Later in ANH Vader says, “I sense something, a presence I’ve not felt since…” which could be a retcon of him remembering the events of the show and also showing how he has grown his abilities.
Here’s a cute character that will keep people distracted from our flawed story. And she has a cute robot too!
This show has plenty of dumb moments, but it’s easily the best written SW show to date.
That’s a pretty low bar to clear 😉
I completely agree!!
We need James Cameron to really raise that bar!
Not a chance.
So do you prefer the mind-bending stupidity of “the book of boba fett” or the children’s-picture-book-level storytelling, dull-as-dishwater dialogue and non-existent characterizations of “The Mandalorian?”
What exactly is ‘mind-bendingly’ stupid about BoBF?Mando is pretty much the most Star Wars show of any Star Wars show ever.
“What exactly is ‘mind-bendingly’ stupid about BoBF?”
The writing, the plotting, the general pointlessness of it.
Literally everything about BOBF. It’s grossly incompetent and fails at the most basic rudiments of storytelling. I was watching in slack-jawed disbelief throughout almost the entire run.
That’s….amazingly vague. It pretty obviously told the story of Boba Fett after he got out of the Sarlacc and how he took over at least part of the criminal underground. It finished the story of the rivalry between him and Cad Bane.
If it ‘fails at the most basic rudiments of storytelling’ I wouldn’t have been able to even say those things about it.
Personally I’d take “The Mandalorian” Season 1 because it just looked better. It’s the only SW show so far that took it’s anamorphic cinematography and production design seriously. Not always mind you, but close enough. Greig Fraser who shot Dune and The Batman shot the first season.
“The Book of Boba Fett” most of the time looked like a late-season episode of the original “Battlestar Galactica”. Robert Rodriguez only knows how to make things look cheap.
Damning with such faint praise…..
No argument. The other shows are passably okay to downright terrible.
It’s not even close to the best written Star Wars show to date.
BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA, ok.
Aha! I have detected a lie!
Come on, they hired the screenwriter of Army Of The Dead and King Arthur: Legend Of The Sword! What more did you want? Shakespeare?
Yeah so wait… if in the finale everyone has their minds wiped etc.
… fuck that that’s terrible writing wtf!
I don’t agree at all. I think the writing has been great. The writers understand the characters and the places they are at during this point in the timeline. This show is really amazing in my opinion.
When I watch modern prestige franchise series like this and like Picard, I’m left with the impression that modern screenwriting schools of thought involve focusing on a series of what they hope are memorable vignettes, or “big moments”. Usually these are either action setpieces, or sweeping emotional statements, or twist revelations. How those vignettes are stitched together, how they make sense in the grand scheme of things, and how and why the characters move from one of these moments to the next are all seemingly less of a priority.
Picard doesn’t even have interesting “moments”, though. It’s rank incompetence on the most basic level.
I didn’t say they succeeded, only that that’s what they were going for.
The writing is very amateur. Is like the writers were hired thanks to know the right people, but without merits.
There is an after credit scene on the last episode where C-3PO takes Leia’s hand, leads her off to a clinic and says “don’t worry. You will come through this fine. Just like me.”
Darth Maul came back after being chopped in half.The Grand Inquisitor could just be mostly dead.
Reva had her lightsaber set to stun.
“The Dark Side of the Force is a pathway to many abilities some consider to be unnatural.” The Grand Inquisitor in Rebels could be a clone or another Dark Jedi from the same species. He did look chubbier and had different voice.
Also you know, we know the Emperor was obsessed with clones.
Somehow, the Grand Inquisitor returned.
THE DEAD SPEAK!
The SW franchise should just say fuck it, the multiverse also applies to Star Wars, and that’s why there are inconsistencies.
Darth Maul coming back was ridiculous. But then again, they’re probably planning a live-action limited series about how that happened…right?
This ain’t even my biggest grievance! What I want to know is how they could steal Cal Kestis’ daring raid into the bowels of the Fortress Inquisitorius and then have it happen (if what I read is accurate) almost the exact same way 5 years later?!?!?!?!!?!? YOU BASTARDS!!!!!!** I had a bet Cal would show up in the show…
My theory is that someone was kicking around a script for a Fallen Order adaptation and just retooled it into the Obi Wan show.
Don’t worry. We weren’t creative enough to come up with a more original story, so trust us that we’ve written everything very carefully and coherently to adhere to canon.Maybe the last 2 episodes will make me eat my words. But right now I have an 80/20 chance that my snark will be justified.
Yeah, the answer is, they know what a hash they’re making and they don’t care. They wanted to do a Vader-Kenobi duel, so they did. They wanted to have kid Leia, so they did.
I forget already, but does Baby Leia know Obi-Wan is Obi-Wan or does she still think his name is actually Ben? Maybe when they part he just tells her to call some guy named “Obi-Wan” if she ever needs help in the future?
We were thinking something like that, but the Third-Sister specifically refers to him as “Obi-Wan” directly to Leia in the latest episode.
This doesn’t really bother me all that much. Read the original speech from Episode IV again “General Kenobi. Years ago you served my father in the Clone Wars. Now he begs you to help him in his struggle against the Empire. I regret that I am unable to present my father’s request to you in person, but my ship has fallen under attack, and I’m afraid my mission to bring you to Alderaan has failed. I have placed information vital to the survival of the Rebellion into the memory systems of this R2 unit. My father will know how to retrieve it. You must see this droid safely delivered to him on Alderaan. This is our most desperate hour. Help me, Obi-Wan Kenobi. You’re my only hope.”If you consider how reluctant Obi-Wan was to leave his vigil over Luke at the start of the series when asked by Bail Organa, it kind of makes sense he’d send his daughter (with a more personal relationship) to get his help again.
I hadn’t reviewed Leia’s message in A New Hope, but to me I think it really does sound like she had never met Obi-Wan, especially the “Years ago you served my father…” part. But I don’t really care whether the message from a movie that came out 45 years ago perfectly matches the story being told today, I just wish the Obi-Wan show was more fun.
10yo aren’t babies. She knows him by both names.
Reva called him “Obi-Wan” while talking to Leia.
Disrupting the canon is the least of this show’s problems. I think I’ve cringed harder watching this show than the original Office, but at least the latter was doing it on purpose.I just don’t know who this is for anymore. I guess kids that grew up on the prequels? I certainly don’t know anyone in their 40’s, like me, who finds this show even watchable. Maybe I’m out of touch with my own generation.
Honestly I don’t care. I am having more fun with this show then I did that terrible Boba Fett show.
But it had Timothy-end of argument
And Luke, Grogu and Ahsoka.
I can only guess they decided to dumb the writing down for the Disney+ kid audience. The scene in episode one, where Larry, Moe and Curly chase Leia through the woods was a ripoff of the Home Alone nonsense. Then Obi-Wan got jealous of the gag, so he did the same bit in episode two. I wonder what high jinks I’ll get in episode three.
One thing Star Wars has always been known for, sophisticated writing that never pandered to kids.
So, in the end, this entire series is going to turn out to be the drunken dream of Darth Vader while he was in a Bacta Tank?Otherwise how do we explain Leia not just saying “Hey, remember me? We spent a ton of time together when I was kidnapped to be bait by the Inquisitors,” when she contacted him (and Ben reacting to the fact that he knew Leia) in Star Wars, or why Darth Vader didn’t say: I’ve been waiting for you, Obi-Wan. We meet again at last. The circle is now complete. When I left you I was but the learner. Now, I am the master! Although you probably remember that from when we last fought and I gave almost the exact same speech ten or so years ago!
No reason for Leia to say that in a message. No reason for Vader to say that, either.
“As you know, Obi-Wan, we went on an adventure when I was 10. That, of course, is totally relevant exposition to bring up now.”
When Leia records her message to Obi-Wan, she is A) under duress, as her ship is under attack, and B) on a specific mission on behalf of her father.Her father has requested that Leia travel to meet Obi-Wan and recruit him personally for their case. Since the ship is intercepted by the Empire, she has to hastily record a message to Obi-Wan before she gets captured.Why would she waste time going into their history of running around together when she was a kid? She gives him the message that her father told her to relay, in the interest of recruiting him to help the Rebellion. There’s literally no reason for her to randomly reminisce about shit that happened when she was 10.
“how do we explain Leia…”She starts off with a formal diplomatic request on behalf of her father, but she ends with a personal plea : “Help *me*, Obi-Wan Kenobi”. (Emphasis added.) That ending is pointless if they have no relationship of their own.“ why Darth Vader didn’t say”He didn’t say it because it sounds dumb.
Well, the entire show centers on a massive break in canon, which is Vader and Obi Wan meeting between ROTS and ANH.But, whatever. I like the show well enough and I truly don’t care about parsing canon anymore.
“ I like the show well enough and I truly don’t care about parsing canon anymore.” Thank you for this. So glad to see this sentiment reflected somewhere in the world. So tired of canon. I truly do not care if all the dots connect any more. Between Marvel / Star Wars / Star Trek and no doubt a host of other genre properties, I am DONE caring whether or not a prequel perfectly interlocks with an ages old films / tv / etc / whogivesacrap.
Exactly. It’s exhausting and pointless. If a show is good, fuck it, pee all over canon all you want. But at least earn the right to do so.Sadly, so much genre legacy stuff is just terrible regardless of fealty to decades-old sources of inspiration.
“if the show is good”… that’s a very big if talking about Kenobi. 😀
Yes but what if you don’t care about Canon, and you still think this is bad
As long as it is good, I don’t mind.
That doesn’t “break canon” at all. Just like retconning Vader into Luke’s dad in ESB/ROTJ didn’t break ANH, and making ROTS didn’t break ANH, either.
There are countless inconsistencies between the PT and the OT. There are many additional inconsistencies across the vast spectrum of SW content.
That’s still just an interpretation of a line though, right? They never outright state that the last time Kenobi and Vader met was on Mustafar. Maybe Vader considered himself a ‘learner’ even by the time of this new series, and something will happen that in his mind confirms him as the ‘master’.
In the context of the original Star Wars, Obi Wan tells Luke Vader was his pupil. Vader then says the last time they met was when he was a “learner”, referring back to that time.Yes, I know people are parsing this every which way to find wiggle room. But, come on, the intent was completely, utterly clear, even if his language was a little florid and not 100% specific. In no way, shape or form does this show’s rage-fueled, murder-happy Vader consider himself a “learner” in any sense.
I wish they took writing a story was also taken very, very seriously.
Why would Vader say he “was but the learner” last time they met when he kicked the ever-living shit out of Kenobi?
They will meet again before the series is done, obi wan will gain the advantage and tell vader he is still a learner/padawan
Assumes Obi-wan and Vader don’t have another fight later in the series where Obi-wan totally schools Vader somehow….
This is not “the last time” they met.
Why would you assume this with two episodes to go?
My guess is that Obi-Wan takes his whiny little boy to school sometime in the next two episodes.
You really think that’s the only time they’re gonna meet in this series?
No, but that still doesn’t make the line make any sense.
Obviously in the last two episodes Kenobi is going to teach Vader how to turn into a force ghost. It answers TWO different questions.
Has Disney+ announced a limited series about Darth Vader learning to be a Sith? I’d watch that, as long as he kills everything that pisses him off, and gets all the space babes he wants. I mean, his groin wasn’t burnt, was it?
Because Vader did not say “last time we met”. He said “when I left you”. When you left your ex-wife is when you got divorced, not when you dropped of the kids last week. When you left school is when you graduated, not when your high-school reunion was over.There are two real contradictions though:a) It was Obi-Wan that left Anakin.b) Vader is not the master, Palpatine is.
I wish they took it seriously enough to not do ‘2 Muppets in a coat’ as a legitimate escape attempt from an Imperial base.
Hate how this show introduced humor to the Star Wars universe >:(
Counterpoint: Star Wars canon is a trash fire. Burn it all down or just ignore it and tell good stories.
Yep. Star Trek too.
That’s already happening (and far better IMO–really enjoying some of the new Star Trek stuff)
What could be better stories than “But wait…he’s your father! But wait he’s your grandfather! But wait…there’s more!”
It’s fathers all the way down.
The Book of Boba Fett made some baffling character choices, but at least the basic story made sense. Obi Wan Kenobi is another pile of bantha poodoo. I feel pretty confident in my take that it’s the worst written pile to come out of Disney-era Star Wars so far, and that includes The Rise of Skywalker. I mean, when an 8-year old girl is hitting pause multiple times an episode to ask questions (the magical tunnel, for example) or air grievances (two kids in a trenchcoat… really?), you know there are problems. Not to mention the parade of “Obi Wan writer explains why…” stories that have cropped up lately.Yes. Reserve some commentary until all six episodes have aired, especially with regard to Leia’s memory and the Grand Inquisitor. But some – MANY – issues can be criticized right now.
They have no idea how to use the canon. A huge chunk of the audience knows that the Inquisitor will be back because they know he’s alive for Rebels; yet, the show seems to think it will be a surprise reveal.Good writers know what its audience/readers think at all time. It should have been easy to predict that fans would be bothered by canon inconsistencies, and that it would hurt their enjoyment of the show on some level. You can’t ask them to wait at the end of the series to know why what looks bad right now won’t be as bad after all.
This is where the stupid habit of some creators of viewing their work as a “x hours movie” comes into play. No, it’s not a 6-hours movie; it’s a weekly TV series! It’s a completely different structure. Adjust.
The massive team at Lucasfilm were also responsible for The Rise of Skywalker so this statement doesn’t exactly fill me with confidence.
Don’t care, Baby!Leia gives me life, haters to the left.
haters to the left of me, clones to the right, here we are, stuck in the canon with poo.
I guess my issue is: why even go there? Why try to, like, thread the needle on canon? Why write yourself into that position in the first place? You don’t even need Vader and Leia. Just stick with a story about a Kenobi adventure that could literally involve almost anything. The playbook is wide open here. You’ve got Ewan McGregor, for God’s sake. He’s already playing one of the franchise’s most beloved characters. Just provide a good yarn with some fun side characters, some good action, some cool lightsaber battles, and let Ewan carry the whole thing. They’re blowing what should be a frickin’ layup.
She should tell Star Wars fans to stfu. Most obnoxious, entitled, socially maladjusted fandom since Halo.
Mind wipe would be lame, there’s really nothing in A New Hope that contradicts that Leia already knew Obi-Wan. “Ben Kenobi? Where is he?!” Also they’ve shown that Leia has intuitive mental talents anyway
Oh for fuck’s sake. Leia: “Will I ever see you again, Ben?”Obi-Wan: “Oh, possibly. Who knows what the Force will bring? Now remember, you can never, ever tell anyone about this.”Bail: “That’s right. You only know General Kenobi as someone that fought with me in the Clone Wars.”Done. Honest to Palpatine, you people make things too fucking hard.
One of the greatest moments in cinema history hinges on Obi-Wan futzing around with “A certain point of view.” Let’s not be too precious about canon.If this site had existed in 1983, there’d be riots about, “A certain point of view”
Other than Baby yo…ung Leia, and Ewen is a planetary treasure, this show is weak. Hayden Vader is too fast and graceful, voice is off and hes written 1000 times better by Zahn and Gillen. The scripts make little sense, and having Obi in a wide open plain, trying to hide? Sooooooo bad, and don’t even get me started on the Darth Parkour scenes. I howled.
I wish people wouldn’t take canon so seriously. Who cares if a TV show in 2022 slightly contradicts a film from 1977?
The 2022 show only exists to exploit people’s love for the 1977 film.
Because it’s careless and lazy and it’s easy to NOT contradict a movie from 1977.
With Filoni having a hand in all these shows I’m not really sure why people are so worried. He sometimes takes canon more seriously than he should (though it’s that sensibility that helped Clone Wars actually improve the prequel trilogy).
My theory is that this Leia isn’t Baby Leia at all, but another of the same species named Grogu.
Which Baby will appear in the Andor series? They all need a Baby.There was no Baby in Solo. See? Failed prequel.
So it’s going to end with that boy from The Last Jedi holding a snow globe.
Nice.
I don’t get most of the criticisms of this show really. It’s been fine. Some good moments, a good portrayal of a man with PTSD, some decent child-acting… ok some hammy moments, but that’s Star Wars 101.
Anyone wanting that EU stuff/storylines from the comics onscreen and verbatim is probably too staunch a fan, because those storylines are a fucking mess for the most part. People call the sequels bad fanfiction, but that stuff really is.
Oh my. This is going to be patently untrue, and it’s going to be DELICIOUS
But she doesn’t introduce herself in the hologram. She doesn’t say who her father is, either. It’s clear that she expects him to know who her father and she are. So far, the hologram makes perfect sense along side this show.Even if it didn’t, if all it would take to correct it is slightly different dialogue, then it’s not even a plot hole. Same with Vader’s preamble to their fight in ANH. It’s dialog, not plot.
Yes, thank you. Not only does she not go into the details of her and Kenobi’s shared history, she doesn’t even say she’s Leia or that her dad is Bail Organa – because it’s implied that Kenobi is already familiar with her, as well as who her father is.People just manufactured this “plot hole” from nothing.
Joby Harold what a hack. They’re part of the problem with this terrible series. The awful direction, writing and editing is not an accident or mistakes.
It’s not a continuity break if it involves something that the viewer made up.