Russell Crowe chuckles at actors looking for “pathos” in their superhero movies
Russell Crowe warns actors not to expect a superhero film "to be some kind of life-changing event"
Aux News Russell Crowe
In a new profile for GQ, Russell Crowe makes clear he doesn’t want to directly comment on Dakota Johnson or “what anybody else might have said or what their experience is” with the superhero industrial complex. However, when told that Johnson said big-studio superhero movies can feel like art “made by committee” (not an entirely accurate reflection of Johnson’s actual quote), Crowe admits it brings “out the impish quality of my humor.” He laughs, “You’re telling me you signed up for a Marvel movie, and some fucking universe for cartoon characters… and you didn’t get enough pathos? Not quite sure how I can make this better for you.”
Yes, superhero movies are “a gigantic machine,” and yes, “It can be challenging, working in a blue-screen world, when you have to convince yourself of a lot more than just the internal machinations of your character,” Crowe acknowledges. However, he stresses, “These are jobs. You know: here’s your role, play the role. If you’re expecting this to be some kind of life-changing event, I just think you’re here for the wrong reasons.”
Crowe himself hasn’t “had a bad experience” on a superhero film (He’s worked with most of the major cape-and-cowl studios, including DC’s Man Of Steel, Disney/Marvel’s Thor: Love And Thunder, and Sony/Marvel’s upcoming Kraven The Hunter). For him, it seems to boil down to the director. “I mean [on Thor], OK, it’s a Marvel movie, but it’s Taika Waititi’s world, and it was just a gas every day, being silly,” he says. “And then, with JC Chandor on Kraven, I’m just bringing a little weight to the circumstances, so the young actors have got an actor they can bounce off. Going to work with JC was fun.”
The superhero conversation has been going on for years, and everyone has an opinion about it. In complete fairness to Johnson, whose name got pulled into this particular conversation, she said that the Madame Web that got made was not the Madame Web she signed up for, suggesting major changes occurred in the script. The full quote that’s being somewhat misrepresented here is as follows:
“It’s so hard to get movies made, and in these big movies that get made—and it’s even starting to happen with the little ones, which is what’s really freaking me out—decisions are being made by committees, and art does not do well when it’s made by committee. Films are made by a filmmaker and a team of artists around them. You cannot make art based on numbers and algorithms. My feeling has been for a long time that audiences are extremely smart, and executives have started to believe that they’re not. Audiences will always be able to sniff out bullsh*t. Even if films start to be made with AI, humans aren’t going to f*cking want to see those.”
In a separate interview with The Associated Press, Johnson praised Madame Web director S.J. Clarkson for having “everything under control.” While filming, she “didn’t worry for a second that it wasn’t going to be great. Ultimately, like in the edit or even on set, it’s just, she’s so detail oriented and she operates on such a high level … I just felt really held and I really, you know, trusted her.”
From those remarks, it would certainly seem that Johnson blames the studio, not Clarkson, for whatever Madame Web’s failures were, and in fact, that the studio should’ve gotten out of Clarkson’s way and let her do her work. In this, it seems Johnson and Crowe would probably agree. Because even for those big ol’ superhero movies, “so many of these directors have a certain skill level—freaking genius people. Think about what’s required, right? It’s everything: the composition, the framing, the colour, the music, what’s left outside the camera,” Crowe says. “Whether it’s [Proof director] Jocelyn Moorhouse or it’s Ridley Scott, you’re talking about hanging out with geniuses.”
72 Comments
I like middle aged, don’t give a fuck, nothing left to prove so let’s take jobs for the fun and the money Russell Crowe. Much better than the angsty early version.
Hoping for The Nice Guys 2.
i hope he just keeps making random exorcism movies ever year
As long as he rides around on a Vespa in them, I’m in
I’ll give that an amen!Ba-dum-tsssh!
Nice guys 2 set in like 1992 and they are both 10 years older! I would love it.
Is 60 middle age now? I know some people who will be delighted. Or are we just talking about men?
Middle aged doesn’t mean halfway through your life, the middle age is the bit when you’re well into adulthood but not yet classed as old
I thought middle-aged is when you take up jousting.
I think I’ll just go with that, despite the threshold for senior citizen status being 62. But ask anyone under 30 how old “old” is and they’ll likely tell you about 48.
Yes, but people under 30 are idiots.
I’m not so sure. Despite their “Matrix” birthing they seem to have some kind of native intelligence the Millennials never did. Like their Boomer parents the Mills are obsessed with STUFF and brands and their sense of entitlement gives me the pip.
I have bad news about people over 30.
You can join AARP at age 50! I did (you can get great discounts at Denny’s!) , although I’m unlikely to be able to retire until my 70s.
I’m there myself and I’m not going to try to tell people I’m middle aged, lol. And retirement? Oh, yes, I get you.But I live in a capital city where most folks can be both profoundly stupid and incompetent and still earn 80K a year with very generous benefits and retirements. The trade off is that you spend your life rubber stamping the same forms and staring out of a dirty window for 35 years. And because of “circumstances” I’m going to have to “go there” too despite completing four college degrees.
Life sucks. Abundantly.
Well, some people (mostly Japanese, and mostly women) do live close to 120 years, so it is possible. The oldest man on record made it to 116.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oldest_people
I figure those later 60 years would be quite rough, wow. So now I’m Googling (you made me look, lol). Seems the Japanese don’t treat their older folks any better than we do. Even if it were possible I wouldn’t want that.
Given that women have longer life expectancies overall, that’s more a win for you than us.
Well, I hope I’ll be able to find some tough broads for friends because it’s getting dangerous out there for aging women. Especially post-pandemic, it seems. Did Australia return to any kind of normalcy? Have the cost of homes there skyrocketed too? I’m on the lookout now and it’s very discouraging.
Oh, shit’s still fucked. Proper fucked.
I wish I could say I can’t see the end of this, or maybe what I see is worse than any horror film they’ll every review here.
It’s always bad when Alan Kohler has to drop the trademark deadpan sarcasm…
:O!!
Alan is to economics what Antony Green is to elections.
I would consider 40-65 to be middle aged, sure.
I think that angsty period had a lot to do with the tragic death of Tugger.
i dunno kinda miss the angsty early version
In his prime there wasn’t a better actor in the World. When he’s in the mood now he can still turn it on, but I don’t think he’s been anything less than enjoyable in anything he’s filmed for years, even if it’s not all top quality product around him.
I’ll second that opinion. Crowe is one of the few movie-star-handsome actors that I would just forget is an actor while watching his movies. Like, I never forget that Tom Cruise is Tom Cruise (except maybe in Tropic Thunder), but Crowe somehow just becomes his characters. It’s eerie.
Maybe he can make another Master & Commander film, maybe one based on the final book, Blue at the Mizzen, in which Jack Aubrey finally gets made Admiral (and thus has the right to fly a blue pennant on the mizzenmast of his ship, hence the title).
If I were a Billionaire, I would throw money at Shane Black, Ryan Gosling and Russell Crowe to make Nice Guys 2. Much more rewarding than the annual running costs of a MegaYacht.
Once that was done, I would also consider funding more Aubrey.
At least millionares aren’t doing that and then like, keeping it all to themselves.Imagine if musk had Nice Guys 2 made and only screened it at his house.
Remember how that financier weasel Martin Skreli bought that secret Wu-Tang Clan album and kept it private? After he was convicted of securities fraud he had to auction it off, but I don’t know what happened to it after that.
oooh yeah. I do remember that now.
Ccoincidentally, there are some very recent developments in that story:https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/us-news/article/2024/jun/12/martin-shkreli-wu-tang-clan-album-lawsuit
https://www.theguardian.com/music/article/2024/may/28/wu-tang-clan-once-upon-a-time-in-shaolin-album-played-first-time-tasmania-mona-martin-shkreli
Wow. And that’s just now. Bizarre that this would happen just as I was thinking about it!
We seem to be time-sharing popular culture. I knew nothing of this until I saw that article.
Man, I would love a new Master and Commander, it’s one of my favorite movies. Having one good film is fine, though.
Sounds like it was near Waterworld-level degree of difficulty, having to film so much only looking over open ocean. I think the cost is just prohibitive relative to the box office you could expect.
60 is middle aged?
My feeling has been for a long time that
audiences are extremely smart, and executives have started to believe
that they’re not. Audiences will always be able to sniff out bullsh*t.
Even if films start to be made with AI, humans aren’t going to f*cking
want to see those.”Haha, no, they’re not. Audiences are dumb as hell, and probably always have been. However, it’s not accurate to say that executives believe that audiences are dumb; rather executives think that executives are smart, when they are in fact just as dumb as audiences. Which is why sometimes, big dumb executives make big dumb movies that big dumb audiences love to the tune of $1b+, but mostly they make big dumb mistakes and audiences get bored or distracted.Which is not to say that audiences don’t have a certain sort of savvy when it comes to “sniffing out bullshit,” but it is mostly limited by their extremely poor sense of media literacy. And while AI might be too shit to make movies humans want to see right now, it seems inevitable that even if AI doesn’t rise to meet audience expectations in the coming decades, audiences expectations are sure to drop to meet AI’s limitations eventually.
you know you’re in the audience, too.
Buddy, I fucking love the Avatar movies.
Ouch, there are a lot of other choices.
But they’re the smart kind. The kind who sneaks in their own Raisinets and bottle of kombucha.
Yeah, that’s some lazy pandering there.
One of the first things they taught me in theatre school is never to treat your audience as dumb, but cool story bro.
DC’s Man Of Steel, Disney/Marvel’s Thor: Love And Thunder, and Sony/Marvel’s upcoming Kraven The Hunterwait is Russell Crowe the Watcher?
I’m hoping he’s the Impossible Man.
He’s Kraven’s dad, older Kraven. Kraven has a dad Kraven and an even eviler Kraven brother in it. I think it also has Chameleon and Rhino in it, but they’re ancillary characters/extras, just involved because they’re packing anyone with a Russian name in there, otherwise it’s “Kraven must defeat his brother to live up to/reject the legacy of his dad” which isn’t a Sony Spiderverse standard but somehow feels like it is.
It’s the Madame Web we deserve, but not the Madame Web we need right now.
Cool. Cool.Hey, does anyone want to give any credit to or talk about THE FUCKING SCREENWRITERS?Not every fucking movie is a fucking piece of fucking auteurism. The fucking director is not the only fucking creative entity on a fucking film. And that cuts both ways! They deserve way more fucking credit and way more fucking blame. How is anyone fucking shocked or arguing about fucking executives vs fucking directors when there is a whole fucking OTHER DISCIPLINE INVOLVED? And even when it’s a hyphenate writer-director, there are MANY examples, like full fucking filing cabinets, of hyphenates who are talented directors and fucking SUCK as writers. I think maybe like Kevin Smith and a handful of other hyphenates are on the opposite end of the “auteurs who are shit at one of the two things they refuse to let other people do” spectrum.FUUUUUUUUUUUUUCK.Sorry. It’s obviously a sore spot for me.
I’ve never understood why the director gets more credit/blame than the writer.and then with some movies I’ve heard it’s the editor who saves or ruins it.
Typically, the writer and editor defer to the director. If the director wants a line rewritten or a scene re-edited, they can usually tell the writer or editor to do it. Not always (not to mention the studio and the producers have a say too), but that’s how I was taught.(Which isn’t to say that the writer and editor should be micromanaged by the director, just that – again, the way I was taught – the director ultimately approves or vetoes their choices)
Also the way I was taught. And FWIW I *like* that arrangement and have no problem with it. When done correctly and with reasonable respect. I’ve had both experiences, unfortunately. Directors who were awesome and respectful and when they needed or wanted something changed they either asked me to do it or at least gave me the option. And also directors who told me dick-all and I had to discover their fuckery when I saw the final product. Guess which ones sucked and which were mostly okay? (To be fair, I’ve mostly worked in the world of 48 hour film projects and low budget shorts.)
To be perfectly “me” (and other jilted screenwriters) about it:Because nobody thinks about the writers. There’s a reason people know the name Alfred Hitchcock but not Joseph Stefano or Charles Bennett. And depending on the director some of them co-write and take the lion’s share of the credit.I always tell my screenwriting students that it’s a wonderful art/craft but you routinely get kicked in the head by the industry and given no credit for your work. You have to actually LIKE screenwriting to make it worthwhile. Even career screenwriters like Tom Lennon and Ben Garant, who are very upfront about being hired guns, actually have to *like* the work. Even if they don’t love the material.
Reminds me of the old joke about the aspiring actress who was so dumb she fucked the writer.
Amanda Peet?Oh. You meant a literal old joke…
I wonder if it’s the same for songwriters.
Without a shred of personal experience or expertise, I would guess it’s worse for songwriters. Because the public is even less aware of their existence than screenwriters.
They definitely deserve more recognition.
That’s a lot of fucks you gave.
Probably too many.
If it’s not on the page, it’s not on the screen.
Are you claiming that there’s actual writing involved with Marvel movies? I thought they made couple of pictures with cool effect ideas and that was pretty much about it. No wonder they suck so much.
Hollywood likes to project the image that the directors do everything. It’s why you have a Black guy directing Black Panther etc etc.
Nia DeCosta as a Black female director on The Marvels whom then later Bob Iger blamed all of the productions problems on (still makes me mad)
You cannot make art based on numbers and algorithms.
Xenakis?
*shrug*I mean, they don’t have to suck butt in an embrarrasing way, like Madame Web or Love&Thunder.Pretending there are only two options, arthouse and trash, is a big part of the problem.
have you seen that picture of Samuel L doing one of those “you come home and I’m waiting for you” scenes from behind the scenes…everything is greenscreen…there is no stupid apartment, the chair he’s sitting in is green, the gun has green screen dots…I mean, I used to say that it must be easier for theatre actors because they always have to pretend they see things that aren’t there but I think I heard Ian McKellen got frustrated on those awful Hobbit movies. Frankly, doing that garbage and just posing all day looks a little demoralizing. At least on the Volume those actors are kind of like doing a little play in front of a drop with props and shit. Honestly, watching Jason Momoa pretending he’s flying through space while doing his Mountain Dew X-treme “WOOHOO” when he’s just lying on his belly on a green table surrounded by 100 people looks like it must be pretty shitty at least some of the time
I genuinely feel bad for the actors during the Omnipotent City scene in Thor 4. It’s soooo obvious it’s just them and Crowe on the Volume it’s unsettling. A room has never felt so empty.
Was that on a volume or just a greenscreen? Because in Ant Man Quantumania it’s clear that it’s just people sitting in a room like 90% of the time. Unsurprisingly, Star Wars Phantom Menace is the worst offender, there are so many scene where people are walking around furniture that isn’t there and looks like it isn’t there.