Elliot Page recalls being forced to wear a dress to the Juno premiere
"I wish people would understand that that shit literally did almost kill me," Page says
Aux News Juno
In a new profile, actor Elliot Page opens up about his childhood, the trans experience, and he reflects on times in his career that “almost kill[ed]” him. One of these “pivotal” moments took place during the red carpet premiere of Jason Reitman’s Juno.
“When Juno was blowing up—this sounds strange to people, and I get that people don’t understand,” Page explains to Esquire. “Oh, fuck you, you’re famous, and you have money, and you had to wear a dress, boo-hoo. I don’t not understand that reaction. But that’s mixed with: I wish people would understand that that shit literally did almost kill me.”
In Juno, Page plays the title character—a pregnant teenager who is definitely more androgynous that what was seen in popular films at the time. Prior to the film’s premiere, Page was set on wearing more gender-affirming attire, like a suit. Instead, he was forced into a dress by the film’s distributor Fox Searchlight.
“I think of times when people actively were like, “No, you need to wear a dress” in very, very, very pivotal moments. I remember the premiere of Juno at the Toronto International Film Festival,” Page says. “I remember going and having the thing I wanted to wear, and then understanding the degree of expectation of how fancy someone is supposed to look. So I said I wanted to wear a suit, and Fox Searchlight was basically like, ‘No, you need to wear a dress.’ And they took me in a big rush to one of those fancy stores on Bloor Street. They had me wear a dress, and . . . that was that. And then all the Juno press, all the photo shoots—Michael Cera was in slacks and sneakers. I look back at the photos, and I’m like . . .?”
While this predates Page coming out and his subsequent transition, the double standard was made clear.
“It’s easy for people to roll their eyes, but you know what? No. That was really extremely, extremely fucked up,” Page continues. “I shouldn’t have to treat it like just this thing that happened—this somewhat normal thing. It’s like: No. Regardless of me being trans! I’ve had people who’ve apologized about things: ‘Sorry, I didn’t know, I didn’t know at the time.’ It doesn’t matter! It doesn’t matter if I’m trans or cis. Lots of cis women dress how I dress. That has nothing to fucking do with it.”
332 Comments
It’s wild to me that there’s still people in this century that see a woman and think “she MUST wear a dress.”
I agree. I also think it’s a little much to treat this as such a traumatic event. The studio cast you in a movie that will launch you to stardom, and they’d like you to dress a certain way for the promotional activities. That’s a mild annoyance at best. Actors/millenials, man.
Obviously you have never had gender dysphoria and depression associated with it.
I have not. And I would not want to downplay such a thing.But his story isn’t “If they only knew my inner turmoil.”It’s more like, “Employers asking someone to do something? WTF?”
his story is both “people shouldn’t be forced into clothes they don’t want to wear” and “nobody knows the inner turmoil it caused me”.
Employers asking someone to do something
Which is in and of itself always a perfectly valid thing to complain about. We shouldn’t just live with the idea that the people who pay us own us, at any level of society, at any pay grade, in any job, whether gender identity issues or sexuality are part of the problem at hand or not.
If there’s some legal compulsion to follow orders, maybe you’re forced to comply in the moment, but talking about it and revealing behavior as shitty later is totally fair. That’s TF.
Well, “employers asking someone to do something based solely on their perceived gender that they don’t ask other genders to do.”
It’s not like there was a uniform that Fox Searchlight assigned people to wear. They basically had said “hey, wear what you want to this fancy party” – so he did. And then they said “oh, wait, no, not you. You’re a girl, and girls all wear pretty dresses. Everybody gets to choose but the ladies.”
Like, we established back in the 1970’s that women can wear whatever they want – Diane Keaton in a tie! – so this is some wack throwback shit they rarely pull on guys.
Add gender dysphoria to the mix and it’s just a toxic brew.
Exactly. “Please dress nicely,” is a reasonable request. “You are a woman and therefore must wear a dress,” was outdated in 1970.
My take is this was a movie premiere for a film that featured these two as sexual partners, so the studio wanted them dressed in a way that reflected that. If Page was pushing back hard on it or explaining why he preferred a suit than obviously that adds to the story. I’d be surprised if anyone making that decision was aware it was adding to Page’s depression or anxiety.I also wouldn’t be surprised if they deliberately dressed Cera to reflect his character.
Then why didn’t they ask Page to dress to reflect his character? His character would not have worn that dress or those shoes.Still a double standard. Even if Page wasn’t trans.
Ehhh though that doesn’t really match the movie, though. They’re supposed to be unlikely partners who are quirky nonconformists, and all that.
Regardless of whether they knew about Page’s dysphoria and depression or not, c’mon, if someone says “I’d prefer to wear something else” there’s little valid reason to push that. It’s old-fashioned hollywood sexism at it’s core.
I kind of get it. But if your boss told you you had to dress up for a work event and you get there and your coworker looks like they just rolled out of bed… why didn’t they force Cera to wear a suit, you know?
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From the article you didn’t read:“…this sounds strange to people, and I get that people don’t understand,” Page explains to Esquire. “Oh, fuck you, you’re famous, and you have money, and you had to wear a dress, boo-hoo. I don’t not understand that reaction. But that’s mixed with: I wish people would understand that that shit literally did almost kill me.”
Then he should have just fucking said NO and quit.People quit jobs and careers all the time. Hollywood didn’t just pick on Page, they craft the image of every celebrity because that’s the industry – that’s the job.
It was a premiere, a work function basically. The studio didn’t GAF how Page dressed on his off days – but they were crafting an image they were trying to sell – so they made him dress a certain way for their event. I’m sure they didn’t know about his inner turmoil – or did I miss that part of the article that I read?
If you want to work at Arby’s you wear the uniform and do what corporate says. Hollywood is the same way. But studios pay waaaaaaay fucking more than Arby’s. Why is it one rule for everyone else but not for him?
Sir, you may not be able to tell this by the formal dress I’m wearing, but this is an Arby’s…
buuuut, the rule is not for everyone. it’s specifically for women.
it reminds me of the “high heels at cannes” requirement.
Society has this rule for women, not just studios. I guess you could make the argument that they didn’t force Jared Leto to wear a dress to the premiere of Millionaire Buyers Club or whatever it was called – but they sure as shit made Rock Hudson marry a woman.I honestly can’t think of any comparable examples, can you?Tom Cruise probably wouldn’t be allowed to wear a dress to the premiere of Top Gun 2
Or we can advocate for better working conditions. We can advocate for better understanding of marginalized groups. It’s perfectly good and valid for Page to speak out about their experience if it helps the next actor struggling with dysphoria down the line.
Let me teach you a lesson, friend – it never hurts to just be civil when responding to someone in life or on the internet. There’s no need to attack someone for their complaints about their job – no matter what it is.
Oh, sorry – is Elliott Page here reading this? No? Then what’s your point?
they’d like you to dress a certain way do something with your body that you find extremely distressing and uncomfortable for the promotional activities.Fixed that for you. This is no different than studios bullying performers into nude scenes, sex scenes, weight loss, etc all to “launch you to stardom.” Asking someone to dress formally is fine. Demanding they wear a dress when their castmates can wear just pants and a shirt is stupid.
As mentioned in the article, look at how the studio let Michael Cera dress. If nothing else, it’s a shitty double standard.
Very good point. I think I’m on, or much closer to, your side now
A friend of mine is intersex and was essentially castrated at birth. For 18 years although biologically male he was forced (by society? peers? institutions? whatever) into wearing girl’s clothing. This and lots of other related shit did almost kill him by suicide.
Emphasizing my earlier point:
Whatever name or pronouns Elliot is going by; Michael Cera looks like the least fuckable slob to ever fall off the turnip truck.
Look at him. Not a care in the world… Even without the context, I wanna hit him lol
Yep, Cera’s not even wearing a suit. And I can tell how uncomfortable Page is just by looking at his left foot. He hardly ever–if ever–wore shoes like that before. And I get that as a cis woman who hasn’t been able to wear even a kitten heel since I broke my foot. Much less feel comfortable in any dress except maybe a maxi-dress.
I’m assuming you don’t have any kind of anxiety or depressive disorder to speak of. Asking somebody to do something that triggers it, especially when its for a stupid reason, is asking somebody to endure pain for no good reason.
Did they (the studio) know this when they asked him to do this? That’s the missing piece.
I don’t think trans issues were at the forefront of anybody’s mind in ‘07, so I don’t think the studio was trying to cause him pain by misgendering him, but there’s still a baseline level of misogyny that lets Michael Cera show up in whatever he wants and dictates to another actor in the film to show up in a dress because they need red carpet photos of them in one. The issue now is people saying, oh what’s the big deal putting on a dress when someone is explicitly saying that it caused them pain and was leading them towards suicidal ideation.
Does the article say Michael Cera was allowed to show up in whatever he wanted, or do you assume that because he wore sneakers? I would bet the studio also had some say in his attire as well
It sounds like either suit or dress she was going to be outdressing Cera
It’s very common in the industry for men to get to wear what they want. Seth Rogan has spoken about it and has purposefully stepped up his dressing game out of respect and sympathy for what his female co-stars have to go through.
I’m a cis woman and I would find being forced to wear a dress mildly traumatic. It takes away my agency. It’s one thing to have a dress code, but if the men can wear suits/slacks/etc. then the women should be allowed to, also. Being forced to dress according to what society deems appropriate for your gender–whether that’s the gender you are or the gender society thinks you are–isn’t a dress code. It’s just ridiculous shit that gets used against women (and people who are perceived as women) way more often than against men.
Century schmentury! It took them five or six years to get Counselor Troi a standard-issue uniform on Star Trek, and that was the future.
Big, “I must draw you!” energy with some people. It’s crazy, I see women in pants and suits all the time and it doesn’t suddenly challenge my, admittedly accepting and open views on gender norms. No clue what Fox Searchlight was hoping to achieve here.
I haven’t seen Juno since it was first out but I don’t remember thinking “Gee, that pregnant teenager is definitely more androgynous that what’s seen in popular films!”
It was more like “Wow, that nerdy kid got someone to fuck him?”
Thanks for weighing in
You too.
Me too?
Yes Cranston…you too.
You’re a loser and nothing you say or do will change that
This is so obnoxious
How is this more obnoxious than some moron saying “well gee he didn’t seem trans when I saw him in one movie ten years ago!”
“I’m less obnoxious than the bigot though” ???
I’m sorry, I’m being a jerk, and I shouldn’t. I hope you have a nice day despite my rudeness
Juno didn’t seem androgynous at all, the character basically dressed like most girls I knew at the time
especially very pregnant ones
The claim wasn’t that she was more androgynous than girls you personally knew at the time. It was that she was more androgynous than girls in popular films at the time, which is completely true.
Okay
Yeah, that’s a bizarre take. There was nothing particularly androgynous about the character Juno.
Of course, in (what year did that come out?), gender-as-identity and preferred pronouns wasn’t as big a discussion. I supposed they could ret-con the whole thing and make it like “Though Juno was assigned female at birth, at some point she/they decided they was non-binary or male and hence forth was doing business as male or non-binary.”
But if the Juno fandom is as toxic as some others; that’ll be some can of whoop-ass.
Juno the character is female even though Elliot Page the person is male.
Thanks for picking up on that.
I think they can probably just ignore it. The Juno Cinematic Universe never took off to the point that it would require the types of retcons and cast shuffles of something like Marvel.
I’m hardly some Juno fanboy but if that wasn’t intended to be the message at the time it was released, then I’d find retconning the film (or any film, for that matter) to fit a contemporary narrative just plain annoying.
Juno had short hair!!!
So did Mia Farrow!!!
I know, and back when Rosemary’s Baby came out people lost their collective shit.
outside apparently the dude playing her, or is Juno a him? Fuck this shit is too much for me to ever know anything any more.
Think it’s pretty clearly revisionist history to bolster the point the author seems to want to make. Contemporaneous press loved Juno because she reflected a “real” girl and not a Hollywoodized version of a teenager. There was nothing androgynous about it.
It’s an interesting word choice because it’s hard to appear androgynous when you’re doing what is historically the most “feminine” thing you can do, which is carry a baby, but she was definitely not dressing or behaving in a stereotypically feminine way.
This isn’t about the character, this is about what the actor wanted to wear to the premiere and a studio forcing them to conform into a dress because “woman”.It’s shitty.
Yeah, I know. I wasn’t commenting on the actor or what they were forced to wear to publicity events; I was commenting on the movie, which had characters in it.
Was an odd comment to leave given the subject matter of the article.Also one that people could perceive as someone advocating that the character wasn’t androgynous so the actor shouldn’t be either.Which, needless to say (well, it should be needless to say but isn’t), is an opinion that is bad.
Well this isn’t the first odd comment I’ve left to these often odd excuses for journalism.I really don’t know if the character was meant to be androgynous (needless to say, I’ve never seen the script) I said that that did not occur to me as I watched the film. I really wasn’t advocating that at all. Sorry/not sorry if I wasn’t clearer but I’m not taking a ton of responsibility for what every stranger reads into everything I comment on a poorly written, poorly edited entertainment site.
I’m sorry if I’ve caused offence, hope you have a nice life.
None taken at all. We just rappin’ on the internet, as the kids do.
I don’t think anyone suggested a causal relationship. We’re just annoyed to see a movie mis-represented. Juno, the character, was not particular androgynous. That has no bearing on how Page should feel. Page was playing a character. That’s acting. Lots of actors play characters who are different from them.
I’m really missing the “mis-represented” part here.It was a premiere where the Actors show up to wave and watch the film they just made. It’s not a trailer or a movie poster.
Did you read the sentence from the article that Caffeine Spider quoted saying that Page’s character in the movie was more androgynous than most movie characters at the time? That is the particular sentence that Caffeine Spider finds “mis-represents” what actually happened in the movie. Not the bit about the premiere. Page’s character in the movie was not more androgynous than other movie characters at the time regardless of how the author of the article is trying to ret-con it to make FOX’s actions during the premiere seem more outrageous (as if they weren’t enough of an example of a dual standard by themselves).
The article states that the character was androgynous. That’s the part that kicked this whole comment thread off.
I think his comment is less odd than the original claim in the article that motivated the comment. I didn’t consider the character Juno to be androgynous either.
It’s almost like 15 years ago might has well have been another eon. In terms of trans- acceptance, it was.A studio spent lots of money to make a movie. Movie is well received. Star of movie wants to wear clothes that (according to the common wisdom of the time) would alter the audience acceptance of the title character and hurt the earnings and awards prospects of the movie. Studio refers actor to stipulations in contract and dresses actor to suit their purpose. That is so far from unusual for the time – it’s also a little disingenuous for Page to not acknowledge that she (again, at the time) signed a contract that gave the studio control over her promotional wardrobe. I am all for LGBTQ rights. I want everyone to be treated equally, be able to identify themselves as they are and have a baseline expectation that people will respect their preferred form of address. I am not for revisionist history. Page hadn’t come out; in 2007 what studio was going to say, “Yes, star, the promotional events for our movie about a pregnant teen girl, who you portrayed, are a perfect time for you to publicly declare your trans-identification; we’ll just tear up our contract with you and, you know, fuck the producers and director who depend on gross points for compensation….”? C’mon. I’m sympathetic to his internal struggles of the time. But, he went for a role and signed the deal. I didn’t agree with the LGBTQ politics of the time, nor the popular arguments that queer people couldn’t credibly portray hetero people. That said, it was unfair for him to expect a studio to bear the financial damage that would arise from his tacit coming-out. If people read this and go nuts, they should refer back to the metier of the year in question. This was 8 years pre-Obergfell, and LGBTQ people did not enjoy the same protections or popular acceptance as today.
that nerdy (or whatever) kid getting to fuck a gorgeous woman is the premise of the entire movie industry.
Well, certainly a big chunk of it.
At least every woody Allen movie.
Exactly.
That just makes you sound super weird.
I’m fine with that.
I hate literally everything you post Caffeine Spider. Literally everything you say is something my out of touch / gaining from white privilege father would say.
Literally?
As I read this, it has become evident that anything a person writes about a character in a film, is actually about the actor themselves. I am a perfectly fine and well-adapted human being who cannot delineate between the two. They are one and the same, seeing Apocalypse suddenly become a fighter pilot in the distant past in a space war threw me for a loop and then when they died in the far future in that space planet covered in spice, my head almost exploded seeing that Oscar Isaac was still alive and walking, but apparently he must have a time machine, that’s the only explanation.This is a weird rant, but what I’m saying is, keep doing you Spider, I have no clue why this opinion about the character in Juno seems to have people up in arms that you are somehow denying Elliott Page’s experience as valid. Contrary to my previous paragraph, I can actually tell the difference between the two concepts of an actor and a fictional character whom they are representing.
I don’t think anyone is up in arms, it’s just the statement is a bit of a head-scratcher.
And Spider’s comment was more coherent than their usual posts! Sometimes I have no clue what they mean, but I’ve come to expect that.
Here’s an analogy that I think well represents situations like this.Someone builds an elaborate, multi-tiered house of cards. Another person comes along, looks at it, and points out that one of the “cards” is actually a coaster. A third person reacts by saying, “Oh, so it’s not a house of cards then?”You can criticize or comment on an article without criticizing or commenting on the article’s thesis.
Juno was definitely presented as on the tomboyish side. Otherwise in 2007 we had the girls in Superbad, Transformers, Disturbia, High School Musical 2, etc., which were clearly presented as feminine.
I guess I can see it
What a bizarre thing even not counting gender identity. You can wear whatever the fuck you want and others can fuck off.
I mean, the producers of Juno weren’t the first employers to ever have a dress code.
I feel like this was his actual point.
Search your feelings, you know it to be true.
Fifteen years ago…
…in a galaxy far far away?
He also wore a dress to the 2008 Oscars (nominated for “Best Actress” that year, not sure how we’re handling that in 2022…) and to the Inception premiere in 2010.
I remember there being talk of bringing it down to one, but I feel like that’s never gonna happen because it’ll just lead to some minor controversy in the OscarsSoWhite vein whenever one gender (let’s be real, probably men) takes the title for multiple years. Having 2 categories lets 2 people get awards (and then have people complain about how others got snubbed). I mean, unless they want to give out a second-best actor award.
I mean, they could give out two “best actor” awards without having a hierarchy. Not sure it’s the best solution, but who knows
“I mean, they could give out two “best actor” awards without having a hierarchy.”
How?You have two awards, with five different people vying for each one? How do you decide which five are nominated for “best actor 1″ and which are for “best actor 2″?
Not sure it’s the best solution, but it’ll piss somebody off. That’s fer sher.
wow, page has dodged near-certain death three times!
They also frequently wore suits post-Juno.If the studio made them wear a dress to the premiere, they may have made them do so at the Oscars. But beyond that, not everyone has a journey that goes from point a to point b. They may have been trying to make themselves fit the mold they were told they needed to.
It almost killed him? So, basically, his career is more important than his integrity or LIFE. Nobody MADE him wear anything. You know what, maybe when kids aren’t being murdered in schoolrooms and marginalized people aren’t being murdered by those sworn to protect and serve us I’ll, maybe, think about giving a single fuck what this entitled fuckhead has to say.
Still think he should play Viola in 12th Night, a terrific actor & a great role & there would be layers to it
Hahaha
*gasp*
This person seems be a large amount of work. Do they ever do anything but bitch?
We’re all works in progress.
You cannot even begin to imagine what it’s like to endure a career constantly seeking to cram you into a box you don’t fit in. I’d sit this one out.
Fuck this Hollywood millionaire coward and their stupid easy to solve problems. Try living without a place to live, worrying where your next meal is coming from, and without access to proper healthcare. Rich people should shut the fuck up about their “problems.”
Yes its soooooo hard.
Why are you quoting what your mom said to me last night!DAMMIT, I promised myself I would not engage with you. But you walked right into that one
If that “burn” was your engagement, maybe you should’ve listened to yourself.
Many people would be embarrassed to say something so unfunny.
Can we all collectively agree not to engage with a profile called “laserfacelvr” cool awesome. Laserface actually cared about stuff and had thoughtful nuances to him besides posting a bunch of deep cut comic book panels and then commenters on this site (name Dino Ironbody, defender of Black Face) bullied Laserface off this site. And now there’s an account called “laserfacelvr” who posts ignorant and misogynists stuff? That’s not at all what laserface was about.
I’ve actually been dismissing and reporting his replies to me. He honestly seems to be stalking me. But this one comment just set up a stupid joke that I was powerless not to make. It’s a curse. But you are right. Back to report and dismiss
Lol I’m stalking you. It’s honestly like you fucking losers share a hive mind full of the same dumb, unfunny, unoriginal little quips. You’re a fucking loser. No one on earth has considered stalking you for a second.
“But this one comment just set up a stupid joke that I was powerless not to make”This is how unfunny people talk
Love this
Sure because Laserface wasn’t the biggest bully on this board
I absolutely hate your name please change it. Laserface wouldn’t approve.
If you want to make minimum wage, you can usually wear the same uniform as everyone else. The women at my supermarket all wear pants.If you want to be an actress making millions for acting in films and rise to celebrity status, you let the studio paying the bucks craft your image and take the cash and smile.Or you go work at the supermarket, or become a teacher, or become a cop if you love pants. Then, you do community theater on weekends to scratch that itch.Every job has a uniform. His was a dress because that was the uniform for the job that HE chose that afforded him the fame and wealth the rest of us suckers don’t have.
Great! So let’s do the same level of image crafting for women as men, yeah?
Or none at all! How about that?Hollywood crafts images for everyone who wants to be a “headliner.”
Rock Hudson had to marry a woman to save his career. I imagine that fucked him up. And studio heads knew he was gay!MGM forced Vincente Minnelli and Judy Garland to get married back in the day – he actually had to go back into the closet.Thank god they stopped with that bullshit and Tom Cruise can just be Tom Cruise, right?
Actors and actresses are forced to lose weight to get roles – Jack Black, for example, was told he had to drop weight if he didn’t want to play a goofball forever.
Fast forward to 2014 where the studio “forces” someone who publicly identifies as a woman to wear a dress to a premiere.
Yes, that was the thrust of my point. None at all would be significantly better. Losing weight is a very real pressure for men in the industry, but how to dress is certainly not.My godmother was Roc Hudson’s best friend and beard, so I’m very familiar with the boxes the industry pushes gay men into. However, I believe it’s only relevant to talk about the 21st century in this context, a century in which certain outdated norms have persisted despite progress elsewhere — such as men like Seth Rogen being able to comfortably exist beyond a box.
“That’s just how it works, so quit complaining and get me a beer.”- Quintessential middle-aged white guy to whoever is listening
Thanks for supporting divisive stereotypes, friend. You are more of a problem in this world than I am. Let me teach you a lesson, friend – it never hurts to just be civil when responding to someone in life or on the internet. There’s no need to attack someone for their age or race – no matter what it is.You take care.
I love that you posted a long screed about how a famous trans actor should shut up and sit down, and then accused OTHER people of being uncivil. Please eat shit, you ugly bigot.
You attacked another person and told them directly to EAT SHIT and called them a bigot. I wrote something that Eliott Page will never read. But I read yours. So, I never told them DIRECTLY to shut up and sit down – but you told me.
If you don’t like what I wrote engage with me and let me see how I’m wrong. Teach me. Nah, easier to act the way you act. You don’t make the world better – you’re just part of the problem.
Teach, don’t tear people down. Engage with a bit of thought, not anger.Otherwise, you’re the piece of shit bigot.
You hurt because you’re hurt. I feel bad for you. Have a good night.
It seems your original point was that if a person wants to be a successful actor they should just suck it up and do what the studios say no matter how much it pains them. Which makes this particular comment of yours extremely awful.Just because that’s the way it has always been done doesn’t means that’s the way it should continue to be done. Things change for a reason and often the reason is because it has always been the wrong thing to do and enough people finally decided enough was enough.
Except female-identifying celebrities have been wearing tuxes at premieres and fashion shows since about the 80s, and probably before. Look at Diane Keaton. Nobody tells her to wear a dress if she doesn’t want to. Yet someone explicitly told someone who is being open about his trans experience that they had to wear something they were not comfortable wearing and that’s valid.
Wait, was he open about his trans experience back when Juno came out? Pretty sure he was still Ellen page then and for years after.
Being trans isn’t just what happens after you make the decision to transition between genders. It’s a process that takes many years and takes many different shapes. Disregarding a bad experience someone had because they weren’t out at the time is ridiculous.
The point is that you can’t say “how horrible for the studio to do that” because 1) The studio didn’t know about his journey2) Hollywood is a business and they pay actors millions for actors to do what they tell actors to do on set and at premieres3) we all want to wear whatever we want to work for any number of reasons, but most of us can’t. Some companies STILL require women to wear dresses and men to wear ties. But I would never work for one because I hate wearing ties. E.P. Had options. Not being an actress in Hollywood was one.4) I’m not discounting his trauma. But ffs, there are people forced into feminine roles out there who don’t a) have a choice and b) have the luxury of taking the million dollar paycheck at the end of the day. My sympathy goes to those people who do it EVERY DAY. Not the rich actor who once had to wear a dress to a premiere.
Wouldn’t it be crazy if we could, as a society, change that tho? You don’t seem to believe so and I look forward to the day when you “wake up”.
No – we can change it. Stop going to movies and buying into the cult of celebrity. Stop. Stop watching TV and visiting this website or any website that reports on film.
Because the lesson Page learned at the age of 20 was that, as an actor, the studio controls you from the moment you are attached to a film until the DVD release. They dress you at the premiere and at press junkets and tell you what to say and not to say. The outer life surrounding a film upon release is just as much “playing a part” as acting in a film.So throw away your TV and never pay to see a movie again. If we do that as a culture then Hollywood will go away.Until then, you will have someone dress you for the premiere and press junkets that follow.
Enjoy sucking your bosses dick
Let’s keep it civil, friend.
You do the very same thing.
And this would actually be a good point if he were complaining about having to wear a dress while playing a woman in a movie rather than choosing what he wants to wear to a work function. If I went to a work function that was formal, I could wear a tux if I wanted to and not get fired or blacklisted because of it. Why should actors be different?
It’s awesome to complain you had to wear a dress when you are rich and people are dying in wars…really tough life what can i say.
I’ll have you know that northerneye3 is a contortionist/escape artist. His entire career is being crammed in boxes that he doesn’t fit in.
She managed to fit a bunch of movies and some tv shows in there.
“This person seems be a large amount of work.”In what way?
In the way that this poor, confused shitbird is bitching about a slight that happened YEARS ago—in Hollywood, no less—a planet unto itself FULL of primadonna choads who switch genders and roles and points of view like I switch channels on the TV whenever I see one of their dumbasses.
Wearing a dress almost literally killed me, kind of way, id guess.
First off, his pronouns are he/his; second, this was part of a large interview and cover story that included his transition as a topic so why *wouldn’t* he talk about it?Also… you definitely had the option to not click on this story and not comment on it.
It’s the new in job.
Yeah, it’s definitely them and not the fact that websites like the AV Club take one soundbite out of an interview and ignore the rest.
Nope.
They did that movie, Juno. Also, stfu with your reductive sentiments. Tsk I can’t believe so many trans people ALWAYS complain against violence against trans people. Don’t they do anything else, omigosh.
You’re ignorant is what I’m saying. Go hang out with J.K. Rowling.
Also Black people omigosh will they stop complaining about racism or whatever already omigoshhhhh.
I’m calling you an idiot is what is happening here.
Are you talking to yourself?
And wow how bout women who get beat by their wives, what a downer right its like all they ever talk about. Just like talk about something else.
I wish people didn’t “bitch” so much. Then we wouldn’t have cancel culture. None of these problems existed 30 years ago (I’m still mocking your ignorance and stupidity).
The irony here is just beautiful.
I’m glad he managed to survive this near-death experience.
Nothing like mocking people who came close to suicide to show the world what a great person you are!
He survived his tragic ordeal and you will survive my comment, hopefully. You matter!
Meanwhile, around that time, in Colombia (where I am from), a neighbor was getting gunned down in front of me and my siblings for getting involved with a gangsters’ wife. I still have nightmares about that day. And no, it wasn’t the first time somebody was shot nearby, but the first time I saw it from such a short distance. But yeah, wearing a dress sounds awful. Poor guy.
You can either heal from trauma or constantly try to win the trauma Olympics where no one else’s experiences matter because yours were worse. He never once compared wearing a dress to violent murder.
The world is falling apart because of evil rich people. Shut the fuck up.
“That was really extremely, extremely fucked up”. The thing about being a rich, white, spoiled person is that your capacity for understanding what “fucked up” really means gets really distorted.
There is no trauma Olympics or “extremely fucked up” Olympics where we measure or arbitrate how people get to feel about their own experiences. I’m sorry your experiences sucked. I’m sorry Elliot Page’s experiences sucked. I wouldn’t want to experience either of them. Yet neither is invalid simply because the other exists.
I see and I agree. I didn’t want to sound insensitive, I guess I am a very bitter guys sometimes, but you are right, I shouldn’t disregard other people’s traumas. Sorry people like him have to deal with things like these that invalidates their identity, and sorry being insensitive.
it sounds like you’ve been through a lot and I sincerely wish you the best. Thank you for being open to other perspectives.
Thank you for being patient and respectful. I will try to be more like you in the future 🙂
Well this took an unexpected turn into a happy ended. Love that for this comments section!
“I didn’t want to sound insensitive”
Good, because you’re coming off as OVERLY sensitive.
This. Isn’t. About. You.
It was actually really nice to see someone reconsider their initial reaction and agree they should be more empathetic – usually not the payoff I get for reading deeper into the comments.
You weren’t trying to sound insensitive? Holy fuck. You have some work to do
good for you for giving it a second thought and being adult about it for the likes of AV Club comments section
A kind of comment we don’t see often. I’m glad I scrolled down before replying to your earlier comment. Good on you.
Let me guess, you voted for Trump because white people got it rough?
So you think Elliot will feel better about the whole dress thing if he just takes a field trip to Columbia?
Nope, I was just being an insensitive a-hole. Sorry. I respect his struggles and can’t imagine how awful it could be to not be able to be yourself. Sorry for being insensitive. Just one thing, it’s Colombia, not Columbia.
Oops…
Sorry about my snotty replies earlier. I didn’t see how much you turned around on this. My bad
Did I just see someone learn and grow on the internet and on the same thread no less? I have now seen it all and you, sir, win the internet for the day. Take the damn star.
You should not have to apologize to a bunch of privileged white people who think having to wear a dress is trauma.
Based upon this story, might not feel anything – in very short order.
The thing about you not being Elliot Page is that you don’t know fucking SHIT about Elliot Page’s life, so how about you fuck off or something?
Trying to hide your transphobia behind class warfare and anti-racism, cute.
Oh no, you have nightmares. Poor baby.
He said it “almost literally killed me”. All this person does is bitch. Nothing else
“More than half of transgender male teens who participated in the survey reported attempting suicide in their lifetime, while 29.9 percent of transgender female teens said they attempted suicide. Among non-binary youth, 41.8 percent of respondents stated that they had attempted suicide at some point in their lives.”https://www.hrc.org/news/new-study-reveals-shocking-rates-of-attempted-suicide-among-trans-adolescenLearn something about dysphoria and the trans experience instead of being a judgmental prick.
Don’t engage with him Pink, just flag and dismiss.
I normally would just dismiss but I think a lot of the knee-jerk reactions here are because a sentence like “almost literally killed me” may indeed seem overly dramatic to people unfamiliar with the statistics and reality of suicide rates in trans people. I don’t expect this commenter to benefit from it but I hope someone else reading will realize that for a trans person like Page, something like being forced to wear a dress for your job for no good reason *actually can* almost kill them.
considering how objectified women are in general and then even more so in entertainment, i can only imagine how much more horrible it must feel being treated like a woman when you’re actually a dude.
Does flagging even do anything anymore
I think its like praying. It probably ain’t doing shit but you know, you kinda hope it does. Dismissing is the more important thing. They do this sorta shit for attention so just shutting down their posts is your best course of action
Not in my experience.
I’m actually starting to steer clear of other people’s OPs now and just making my own so I can hit dismiss. Only option left.
You’re so brave for this. Thank you
Right, and that rate doesn’t change even if they transition. So…
He compared wearing a dress to rape (“forced”) and that it almost “literally” killed him. So I think it’s perfectly fine to have some perspective from actual real world violence that people have experienced.You’re right though. It is the trauma Olympics. We cannot discuss anything without using the most extreme terms.
It’s totally possible to think this is blatant hyperbole given how many people, trans people especially, face real world violence and that a millionaire star being quote/unquote FORCED to wear a dress to a festival is pretty far down on most reasonable people’s idea of what true violence is. While, also I might add, being completely sympathetic to how difficult it must be to feel you have to hide who you are to conform to societal norms.
I get where you’re coming from, but this isn’t a “trauma olympics” thing. This is rich-person trauma versus poor person trauma. To be a little hyperbolic (for brevity,) a rich actress who will never want for anything gets multiple headlines for the trauma of having filmed a fake rape scene… while the person reading those stories who was actually raped might think to themselves “uh… what?” An uber rich music star might be suffering from depression, (which we know from having read multiple articles to that effect,) which is bad… but so are poor single moms working two jobs and getting like four hours of sleep a night. Single mom might look at that pop star and say “oh my god, shut the fuck up,” and I would completely understand that position.I submit that it is likely easier to be depressed when you have eleven mansions and spend half your life on lavish vacations and are waited on hand and foot. I mentioned in another post that I’m having a difficult time reconciling my overall resentment of the insanely over-privileged with my empathy for those going through a tough time.
This is rich-person trauma versus poor person trauma.At the time, Page was neither rich nor famous. This is not rich person trauma. It is trans person trauma. Intense gender dysphoria and pressures from society causing suicidal thoughts and mental distress in a trans person occurs regardless of that trans person’s income or status. Very very very very few trans people get to eventually enjoy the status and success Page has and he is using his platform to inform people about his experience and the trans experience. Also keep in mind that Page probably could have a bigger net worth and even more fame if they stayed closeted for the sake of being more media-friendly and “bankable.” a rich actress who will never want for anything gets multiple headlines for the trauma of having filmed a fake rape scene… while the person reading those stories who was actually raped might think to themselves “uh… what?”Uh, being forced into doing something with your body at work that you do not want to do and that you find extremely upsetting is fucked up and should never, ever happen. Advocating for safe workplaces for women in no way invalidates or dismisses the experiences of rape victims. This is a terrible, terrible example of deciding that people can be traumatized at work because people experience worse things outside work, or because at some pay level, trauma no longer matters.Single mom might look at that pop star and say “oh my god, shut the fuck up,” and I would completely understand that position.No. No. No one’s depression is more legitimate than someone else’s. Being rich and famous can’t make your brain produce more serotonin. That’s not how shit works. One of the most insidious things about depression is that it makes you feel like you do not deserve help or that you are unable to be helped. It doesn’t matter how much money or fame you have. We see that in the number of famous people who commit suicide. You don’t get to decide that someone else’s illness doesn’t matter simply because you have a worse illness. That’s like saying a cancer patient shouldn’t feel any sympathy for someone with depression. It’s a bullshit take.I’m having a difficult time reconciling my overall resentmentLetting your resentment rob you of your empathy is fucking toxic. Don’t do that.
Are you really defending the made up murder dude to get on the soapbox of wealthy people suck?
If anything, this is a time where we need to reflect on:
1.) Elliot Page didn’t have much power in the system. 2.) Suffered something that psychologically almost sent them to suicide.3.) Is a laborer in the model of power, it’s kind of 1 in redux but needs to be addressed, I have far less empathy or sympathy for capitalists making pictures but the actors are just laborers with a much higher floor to their wages.
Made up murder? I already apologized for being an insensitive and bitter prick. But saying I made it up? You don’t know what we went through during the 90s and the 2000s, especially in Cali. Were you there? Did you have to live through the cartel wars? Feeling an earthquake every other night because another car bomb exploded in the downtown area? The Cali river being off limits because of how many young poor people were getting dismembered and thrown there by drug dealers, paramilitary organizations and even our own military working with them? Did you have to live through the paramilitary and guerrilla massacres? When they went to towns a few miles over and dismembered everyone they suspected of being on the “wrong” side with chainsaws, even children? 3 of my classmates had relatives who were murdered while picking them up from school. My dad was shot 6 times just 6 years ago because being a lawyer in this country immediately puts you in risk. He was lucky that his tainted glass prevented the sicario from knowing what he was shooting at and missed major organs. And no, I am not saying I am something special, this was life in Cali, it was what we were used to. And I can say I was somewhat privileged, because my experiences were in an upper-middle class environment. The situation in our “invasiones” and the “ollas” of the city was way worse. And the fact you think that me talking about one murder that I witnessed is “made up” just goes to show how sheltered your life has been, or how little you know about life in Colombia, especially in Cali. You think the reality shown in Narcos was rough? That is the americanized version, real life was/is way worse.
I just want to say I’m sorry for all the people who are jumping in to slam you for your initial post without bothering to put in the additional minute it would require to read your redaction and apology for it. Yeah, it was a shitty take but you admitted that and that’s honestly really nice to see.
It’d be cool if people would at least try to get caught up on a discussion before jumping in with their own takes.
Sounds like a made up story you tell in the comments sections of unrelated articles for boo hoo sympathy points
Yeah, sure bro. Colombia is a made up country in which there hasn’t been an ongoing civil war for over 70 years. And if there was violence, it never ever happened in the cities, no car bombs, no sicarios, no massacres. Smh – It is virtually impossible to have lived in Cali, or in the Valle in general, in the past 30 years and not witness first hand acts of violence. I don’t need to embellish any stories about my city. It’s a city I love with all my heart, it has great things, great people, great weather, the parties are the best. And if you want to learn to dance salsa, it is the best place to go. But the violence was always there, much of the city economy has always depended on drugs and on protection and extortion by far left guerrillas or far right paramilitary groups, not to mention the cartels and the corruption within the armed forces. Come and spend a night partying in Menga, or go to any event during the december feria, and you can witness it yourself. You’ll see how easy it is to party right next to gangsters, and how easy it is to witness a shooting or a stabbing. Or just go to any bar in la sexta, quinta or farallones, you can see how we live with those elements by our side every day. Or if you have a death wish, go a couple of blocks behind upscale neighborhoods like normandia or cristales and visit the invasiones. Or behind plaza Caicedo to the Ollas. If you decide to walk a few blocks too many around an area you feel its “safe”, you won’t make it back.
I spent time in Mexico. My sister was horrified when I said “yes, the cartels do hang people in public and the cops do nothing”. Some genius tried to kidnap me in his taxi. Had a big knife!I think I get you.And it’s good that you’ve explained yourself and acknowledged this comments section wasn’t the right place to share your trauma. People need to read your replies instead if just shouting at you.Paz x
Another one trying to hide their transphobia behind the class struggle. This is a trans person who was humiliated publicly, even though you may not have noticed they were being humiliated. Actual capitalists should get the wall, but we don’t need you transphobes appropriating the language of class warfare to attack transpeople who work for a living and are just well paid.
He never once compared wearing a dress to violent murder.“I wish people would understand that that shit literally did almost kill me.”
Thanks for being like this. In my experience, a single trauma starts the Trauma Olympics and listing multiple traumatic experiences makes you a liar or attention whore. You can’t win with most people, and endless invalidation sucks.
he said this:
“In a new profile, actor Elliot Page
opens up about his childhood, the trans experience, and he reflects on
times in his career that “almost kill[ed]” him. One of these “pivotal”
moments took place during the red carpet premiere of Jason Reitman’s Juno”almost “kill”ed him. boo fucking hoo. read upon how Margot Robbie felt about her suicide squad costume.
I imagine that was one of the worst things you’ve ever experienced. So you’re comparing the worst things you experienced to one thing that Elliot Page said bothered him. The only one comparing the experiences is you and the only one taking it to extremes is you. I don’t know what Elliot Pages most traumatic experience is, I very much doubt you do either, but I bet it’s not this. Why do you feel the need to compete instead of listen empathetically, especially when you have so little info?
“That was really extremely, extremely fucked up”. Yeah, he doesn’t know what fucked up means. First World Problems are hilarious to me.
What happened to Elliot Page was fucked up. Fucked up isn’t a single event or “level” of harm (which is subjective anyway). It’s a spectrum. What happened to your neighbor was also fucked up. But again, the absolute ONLY person comparing the two is you. The problem is you.
Bro you speak fluent English in a country riddled with crime and poverty. There’s a good chance you’re in a more privileged position than many of the Americans responding to you.
Yah eh. Crazy how 40 years ago we didn’t have any of these problems and now we do (cuz people are looking for something to complain about) and I’m going to keep pretending that we didn’t always have these problems but people were afraid to speak up back then. Rub some dirt on it and walk it off. Trauma? That’s for pussies.
I’m truly sorry for the traumatic experiences you’ve had to suffer through, but trying to use your trauma to invalidate the experiences of another person, even a famous white person, doesn’t make you come off as righteous, it makes you come off as bitter and sad. Page’s point wasn’t that he has it rough because he had to wear a dress one time, his point is that the cultural perspective on what is and isn’t acceptable in a place like America (a place supposedly built on ideals of freedom and individual liberty) was a lot more restrictive not so long ago. And as I’m sure you know since you can’t seem to help lording your trauma and bitterness over others, it’s a lot harder to change the present if we don’t acknowledge the past.But sure, in the “who’s trauma is worst?” contest, you win. Congrats buddy.
I’m not sure it’s right to tell other people that something that clearly bothers them shouldn’t be bothered by it.
Complaining about what an actor says on a pop culture website is the very definition of a first world problem but ok.
Well it’s good to laugh I guess
Elliott page said it “almost literally killed me”. So no – he didn’t say it “bothered” him.
his words “I wish people would understand that that shit literally did almost kill me.”
ithink him saying it almost literally killed me, is the issue here. Maybe it did, but i doubt it. Then again i wasnt there, maybe it was a close call.
.
While I don’t want to minimize or make light of the effect that had on you and your siblings‘Don’t get involved with a Colombian gangster’s wife’ seems like it would be pretty high up on the rules for living a murder-free life.
I bet that really limits the potential dating pool; as we all know all men in Columbia are either gangsters, cocaine producers or coffee farmers.
Welp thanks for the racism
Square
::REDACTED::
Wow, everything has to be about you.
Comparing trauma is something an asshole does. So, congratulations asshole.
Not comparing, dismissing. White people like Page love to equate minor inconvenience with things like what the OP experienced not realizing all they are doing is putting their extreme privilege on full display for all to see. People are right to call out that privilege, stop shaming them for doing so.
Your complete disregard for his traumatic experiences makes me have zero sympathy for yours. Maybe the nightmares will end when you can stop being a toxic dick about how you’re incapable of feeling sorry for anyone but yourself.
I mean, invalidating the psychological pain that drove somebody to consider suicide isn’t ever a great look, especially when playing whataboutism games. You saw some heinous shit, and it deeply affected you, which would hopefully mean you have more empathy for people suffering in silence then someone who has lived a relatively charmed life.
Congrats on making the “If you care about the homeless so much why don’t you let them live in your house!” argument of making someone wear a dress.
Meanwhile, in the 1940s the Holocaust happened and 10 million people died. But yeah, one person dying is sad i guess, sorry you have nightmares.Thats what you sound like.If Elliot Paige were bringing this up during a panel discussion on gun violence in Colombia that would be entirely inappropriate, he would be making the conversation about him.However, this is an article about Elliot Paige’s personal life and experiences. Therefore it makes sense that he would share an anecdote about a time he was made to feel uncomfortable by someone else for superfluous reasons.You’ve decided to leave a comment using your neighbor’s death as a prop for an argument no one was having. Way to go, loser.
People definitely got raped and tortured that day so your experience is stupid and you’re a baby for complaining about it
It’s not a competition? Something shitty happening to one person doesn’t invalidate what happened to other people.
That’s whataboutism.Multiple things can be bad in different ways.
I am very sorry you had that experience. It is truly terrible. That does not take any of the pain away for Elliot having to live as a different person.
I think it is hilarious that Page points out that he understands that people may not get it, and that some people may have a “boo hoo” attitude about it, and you feel the need to pile on with EXACTLY that response. Like “me too, me too, I think this is dumb too!”
Sure, champ….Sure.Making this up to attack transpeople is pretty amazing level to stoop to.
Copied from below:I already apologized for being an insensitive and bitter prick. But saying I made it up? You don’t know what we went through during the 90s and the 2000s, especially in Cali. Do you know how common this was? Were you there? Did you have to live through the cartel wars? Feeling an earthquake every other night because another car bomb exploded in the downtown area? The Cali river being off limits because of how many young poor people were getting dismembered and thrown there by drug dealers, paramilitary organizations and even our own military working with them? Did you have to live through the paramilitary and guerrilla massacres? When they went to towns a few miles over and dismembered everyone they suspected of being on the “wrong” side with chainsaws, even children? 3 of my classmates had relatives who were murdered while picking them up from school. My dad was shot 6 times just 6 years ago because being a lawyer in this country immediately puts you in risk. He was lucky that his tainted glass prevented the sicario from knowing what he was shooting at and missed major organs. And no, I am not saying I am something special, this was life in Cali, it was what we were used to. And I can say I was somewhat privileged, because my experiences were in an upper-middle class environment. The situation in our “invasiones” and the “ollas” of the city was way worse. And the fact you think that me talking about one murder that I witnessed is “made up” just goes to show how sheltered your life has been, or how little you know about life in Colombia, especially in Cali. You think the reality shown in Narcos was rough? That is the americanized version, real life was/is way worse.
Ugh wait so you’re making light of the way Elliot Page feels in comparison to unrelated death? Fuck you. You’re an asshole.
What if I forced you to wear a dress?
.
I’m glad you posted lower down backing off of this take. People never do that online. Good for you.
lol
That is awful. It should’ve been you, not your neighbor.
It’s funny, I recently spoke with a trans person from Colombia who had a somewhat similar experience. This particular person is very kind, very active in a lot of communities that deal with different forms of oppression, very sensitive to what other trans people and, really, all kinds of people go through when they’re mistreated, not seen, forced to be something they’re not, etc. I think their political outlook would draw a connection between smaller and larger forms of oppression, seeing them on a continuum and stemming from related systemic issues. That’s how that person happens to handle their trauma stuff. You handle yours whatever way you see fit. I just don’t know about denigrating other people’s problems. I don’t judge you for it, I just wouldn’t take it as an ideal approach.
This doesn’t have to be a competition. I understand what Elliot is saying. I’m from the southern Philippines where I had grade school classmates kidnapped, an uncle was once on the the police kill list of the then mayor (and now Philippine president), a friend died in my arms after being shot by a politician’s son, and recently, another boxer friend was shot in the head on the highway because a jealous army colonel was upset that he was training his mistress. I could go on.
I get that everyone’s trauma is different, but we don’t need to pull someone down to validate ours. Elliot’s gender identity and very public persona, is without a doubt, a big part of what affects her. The public conversation around her and the people constantly judging her with hurtful words is nothing we can relate to.
It’s sad that that happened to you and I hope you’re getting help, but that doesn’t mean that other people are not allowed to feel bad about things that happen to them and hurt their quality of life.
Poor girl. She ain’t a dude. Never will be.
Try to think of it another way: Your potential for empathy is unlimited. It’s a resource that you can give, and give and give; you don’t need to be choosy about it. I have a friend who lost his newbown baby in the explosion in Beirut. He’s stateside now, and he wouldn’t hesitate to offer support and empathy for someone who dropped their ice cream. We all have that within us.
Ironically, since this is the internet your story is both irrelevant and potentially a lie.
Are you trying to claim his trauma isn’t valid? Are you trying to claim YOUR trauma is more valid? It just sounds like you are a transphobe that’s out here loudly drawing attention to yourself.
Deleted because everyone else already jumped all over you about this comment
Is that all you people do down there is shoot each other? I don’t think I’ve ever seen a Columbian smile.
It sucks but he wasn’t forced. If it was fine to wear what he wanted on set, have some stones and wear what you wanted to the premier. Was there a contractual obligation to wear a dress at the premiere?
“If it was fine to wear what he wanted on set, have some stones and wear what you wanted to the premier.”How fucking stupid are you? You think actors get to choose what they wear on set? Jesus fucking Christ, there are costumers and designers who decide EVERY SINGLE THING that an actor wears on set.
He was playing Juno while on-set. He was not playing Juno at the premiere.
All the asshole guys commenting that it’s no big deal, would you do it? Would you non-ironically wear a dress to some gala event with lots of cameras and such? Don’t lie and say you would.
To be fair he was probably contractually obliged to promote the film and that would probably include doing whatever the studio said which he would have agreed to when he signed on.
Also, he was not out as trans back then, so how the hell would the studio even know it was causing this much distress if he didn’t speak out about it. You are asking if men would wear the dress, but to everyone back then it was just asking a female to wear a dress, no one knew…
Yes, but even if we were talking about an actor who presents and identifies as a woman: she still shouldn’t have to wear a dress. She should be able to wear whatever she wants, so long as it’s appropriately formal. And apparently Cera wore something casual, so why should Page need to go glam?
Cis-gendered actresses wear suits to events pretty often, especially now (they’re super in).
It was “forcing” a woman (as far as the studio knew) to wear a dress and that’s also bad. Page said that himself. It’s not just about the trans part of it. It’s about forcing people to wear clothing they are uncomfortable wearing, especially since women usually take the brunt of that. Women are expected to be gorgeously dressed and coiffed with heels at every event like this while men frequently get away with not even a suit.So, yeah, it’s a big deal made even bigger by for him by the fact he was a man that everyone treated like a woman.
Boo hoo a rich person had to wear something they didn’t want to wear. Give them an award so they won’t be so sad in their mansion.
Most people have to wear some stupid uniform for a job they hate almost every single day of their life. You think workers that serve dumb scum like you like having to dress in an outfit a corporation chooses? Boo fucking hoo for the millionaire.
I’m an asshole guy for different reasons and I’m not saying it’s not a big deal, but I would wear a dress to a big premiere deal or gala or whatnot.
Because fuck ‘em, that’s why.
That’s not a fair comparison, because I’m 100% comfortable with my shitty, mediocre, middle-aged white man’s body, so I would have no problem wearing a dress to a premiere whereas a transgender person who hasn’t publicly come out yet is likely to be very, very uncomfortable in their body and wouldn’t react the same way that I would to being forced to wear a dress.
No, but then again we probably wouldn’t present ourselves as a female and take prestigious female acting roles and then whine about being forced to wear a dress.
If I were being paid that amount of money, absolutely I would. Jesus, yes. I’d wear whatever they wanted me to.
You are trying to make a point here, I think. But how can you ask a guy if he would wear a dress to an event. It isn’t the same thing. It would need to be a guy that identified as a woman being asked to wear a suit to an event. Elliot was being asked to wear a dress because no one really knew he identified as a man. Just saying “Guys go wear a dress” isn’t remotely the same thing.
If I was getting paid as much as him to do it? FUCK YES I WOULD
yes. But it seems like you’ve already decided what the answer is.
Kristen Stewart is someone who managed to “get away” with switching between designer dress and suits whenever she feels like it. For what it’s worth, I do like her style most of the times. Maybe we’re evolving. Or maybe she’s just big enough to force Hollywood to change its views.
Diane Keaton’s been rocking the suit for decades.
Somebody always gotta go ‘n play the Keaton Kard!
Cate Blanchet and Tilda Swinton often rock suits as well.
It’s hard to be sure from the description in this short soundbyte, but I would argue that the difference is those are women’s suits. Usually very tightly tailored. Often with cleavage showing. Not infrequently with skirts. Hot as hell and great looks, but it sounds like Page wanted to wear more traditional menswear.
Look at Kristen Stewarts 2007 – 2010 premiere looks, they were largely dresses as well.
First off: Fuck Fox Searchlight, Elliot should’ve been allowed to wear whatever the hell he wanted.
Secondly: It’s kind of a fascinating look into the psychology of acting that literally playing a pregnant female teenager didn’t have this same impact on him. The idea that playing a role, when it’s your profession, doesn’t trigger your gender dysphoria is super interesting to me!
We all do shit for money we’d rather not.
Very true, and this was the more mainstream breakout role for Elliot right after Hard Candy.
I thank God every day that I’m not a parent raising a kid in our seriously fucted-up society.
Elliot has never said or implied this
I’m sure there is something to be said about being in the mindset of “I’m not this person, I am acting.”
Signed the 99 percentile.
there are trans men and nonbinary people out there who choose to be pregnant and presumably it either doesn’t trigger their dysphoria or it’s very manageable — everyone’s manifests in different ways.
Earnestly I should take a college course on gender/identity because I find it so interesting. There’s just so much going on.
Back in my academic days I did a lot of research on gender/queer stuff from an anthropology perspective (I’m a straight white male) because yeah it’s really interesting. One thing I learned is that queer people really would prefer you don’t find them any more or less interesting as anyone else. So now I’m no longer interested and just kind of nod my head when this kind of stuff (Elliott Page) comes up and say “sounds good to me home skillet.”
Same as there’s cis women who have no dysphoria about having ovaries, but hate the concept of ever getting pregnant.
I don’t know if I’m trans, NB, or if I’m just a cis woman who doesn’t like dresses, but I don’t like them either. I prefer the look and feel of a suit. Wearing a dress or anything that’s supposed to show off my assets (…that I don’t have) makes me feel like a clown.
I do think there’s something to be said that Elliot might still have been sorting through their identity at the time. I want to wear slacks to a premiere because I feel anxious in a dress and being ready to accept yourself as trans may be two separate things.
That totally makes sense to me. Acting is acting, and while going to premieres and such is “part of the job,” it’s a part of the job where you can be yourself to some extent. What’s more, it’s suppose to be a happy, celebratory thing. Basically, it’s a big party in your (and your coworkers’) honor, and you’re being told that you’re not allowed to be yourself.
If you can understand that Anthony Hopkins would have been repulsed being forced to eat human flesh while doing PR for Silence of the Lambs, even though he was perfectly capable of portraying someone who actually sought that kind of meal out, then you should be capable of giving that same understanding to Mr. Page. There’s a difference between structured art that you choose to be in while representing something that isn’t real, and being forced into a role in the real world by outside forces while actively trying to be yourself.Equating real life forced gender conformity with actors choosing to take roles is taking some unfortunate premises about the performativity of Page’s gender at face value.
Ok but someone doesn’t have to actually eat human flesh to portray someone doing that, while someone portraying a woman in a movie actually does wear dresses in the movie. Asking them to do something they have already done with seaming no issue isn’t the same.
But, that’s literally what acting is (and he chose to do it, no one forced him.) Every single actor plays a role that is not who they really are. Straight people play gay people, cis people play trans people, men play women (or, in the case of Victor/Victoria, a woman plays a man playing a woman,) recovering addicts play current addicts, decent human beings play serial killers, etc. It doesn’t hurt them because it is what they do, it is not meant to be real, and they had a choice in it. It’s not like he signed up to play a man and they forced him to play a pregnant teenage girl. Also, a lot of people are ignoring the part where he says it’s fucked up to make him wear a dress even if he was a woman. Like, if a cis woman actress were told she couldn’t wear pants to a premiere, that would also be fucked up. It’s not just about the trans stuff (although, having to hide himself at the time and then having that happen probably made it feel worse.)
No one forced her to anything. She’s an adult. She could have refused to wear a dress.
“So I said I wanted to wear a suit, and Fox Searchlight was basically like, ‘No, you need to wear a dress.’ And they took me in a big rush to one of those fancy stores on Bloor Street. They had me wear a dress, and . . . that was that.”Sounds less like forced and more like he didn’t bother to try that hard. Did he try insisting that no, he really wanted to wear a suit? Did they make some threats or insinuations? What’s the standard for force here?
So, if he didn’t run away or stabe a producer under the chin with a machete he wasn’t trying hard enough?
Why can’t you just fuck off?
What a compassionate take you found – you’re so unique and smart!
Well, I am clearly doing more actual thinking than most here.
He was young, perceived as a woman (more likely a girl) and relatively new to the industry, so they used his youth and naivety against him to make him feel he had no choice and I’m sure he also was worried about pushing too hard and getting labeled difficult making it hard to find work. It doesn’t make the requirement that he wear a dress right and it doesn’t make him complicit because he wasn’t confident enough to push back.
“ so they used his youth and naivety against him to make him feel he had no choice”
I don’t see that in the details given, that’s why I asked the questions I asked.
“and I’m sure he also was worried about pushing too hard and getting labeled difficult making it hard to find work.”
I agree. Does that equal forcing on the part of the studio?
“ and it doesn’t make him complicit because he wasn’t confident enough to push back.”
I disagree. At some point you have a responsibility to stand up for yourrself and make the effort. Especially in something that has been presented as being of life-and-death importance. But I guess working in movies meant more than his life?
How does it feel to have no empathy and to not remember what it was like to be young and afraid of authority? I would ask how it felt to have so much confidence in yourself even though you were trans in a world that hates trans people and how you never felt fear through any of that, but it’s pretty fucking obvious you have never been in a group that is hated by people in power or you wouldn’t say these things.It’s really easy to stand up for yourself when you are cis, straight, white, and male. Take away just one of those things and there’s just nothing easy about it at all.
How does it feel to be brainless?
I do have empathy and I do remember those things. That doesn’t mean the situation outlined qualifies as force, or that people don’t have a responsibilty to stand up for themselves. Nor did I say it was EASY, I said it was a RESPONSIBILITY. Those are often NOT easy. Doesn’t mean you don’t have the responsibility.
I mean FFS,we are, again, expected to see this as life or death, but not getting to worrk in movies is even more important? I see you didn’t address that point at all.
Try thinking and being rational over being controled by emotion.
“Forced” is doing a lot of heavy lifting here. Did they hold him down and physically put the dress on him? It almost killed him? “Literally” in his terms. Sure thing, bub.
Look, I think we can all agree no one, regardless of gender, should be physically placed into any outfit against their will, under punishment of…whatever…it’s not clear if Fox had hired goons who were threatening him with various lengths of steel pipe and switchblades or what.And I think we can all agree that it’s stupid that we still freak out when someone wears something gender non-conforming. Further, I think at least some of us can agree that Page should be supported and treated with respect as a fellow human being. And, no, it’s not funny to mis-gender someone or refuse to use their preferred pronouns.With all of that said. There are still articles on Jez using the “she” or “they” pronoun. So everyone in the comments jumping down peoples’ throats for not using the right one: it’s still pretty fucking confusing and we’re getting used to the new norm. So calm the fuck down.
“Hey… you need to wear a dress to this premier!”“No.”Seriously… what was the exec assistant or whoever made this a thing going to do to Page? Shoot him? Fight him? Mace him?There’s a difference between being “forced” to do something and being “pressured” to do something. This instance appears to me to be the latter. I’m a big fan of respecting people’s agency and ability to make decisions for themselves… even in high pressure situations. (This is not, in my opinion, a “high pressure” situation. It’s a Hollywood “high pressure” situation. ) I’ve always been a fan of Page, but all he had to do was say “nah” and that likely would have been the end of it.
Did it also fuck him up to play a pregnant hetero CIS female in a relationship with Michael Cera? Or what about playing Monica in “To Rome With Love,” a character who “gives off a sexual vibe that drives men crazy?”
I would think that these roles would be equally as damaging. To be fair, he didn’t yet know that as a celebrity you never stop playing your assigned “role,” even at movie premieres. It’s why film actors make more than teachers.
Not the first person who Hollywood put some money behind and then carefully forced them into an image that they crafted. I’m just a CIS hetero guy but I would happily pretend to be a woman for 16 hours each day if it gave me a net worth of 14 million and I didn’t have to worry about putting money aside to send my kid to two weeks of camp in the summer.
So that’s what this is all about: You hate kids. Particularly your own.
Not very bright are you?
Perfect. Just perfect.
Honestly, I feel sorry for his kids, because Kildover is clearly a sociopathic shithead. He felt the need to post long screeds all over these comments about how Elliot should sit down and shut up, or quit his job.
Maybe he’s Ben Stern.
He felt the need to post long screeds all over these comments about how Elliot should sit down and shut up, or quit his job.And you feel the need to harass him. You’re not the hero you think you are.
No one cares.
I’m gay and I sympathize with the struggle but they willing and enthusiastically pursed a career in one of the most public, unforgiving and manipulative industries. Sure they were young at the time but you don’t enter into a public arena holding a life changing secret and expect to not do yourself any sort of psychological harm.
Just because it is expected that that industry would cause him harm doesn’t make it right or OK that the harm was caused. It doesn’t mean he shouldn’t speak out against the harm. They shouldn’t be requiring *anyone* to wear clothes they aren’t requiring the other members of the cast to wear. Just because something has always been a certain way doesn’t mean we should just accept it being that way forever. We should always endeavor to change the things that are wrong and one of the way to do that is to speak up about those things and how they affected us.
**Edited to add that by “us” I do not mean to imply I am a part of the LGBTQ+ community, just that I am someone who has been wronged in the past and feel that this philosophy applies to all wrongdoing.
Where do you get that her character was androgynous in Juno? You are creating a narrative that was not anywhere present in the film or in her appearance.
So, how dit it actually literally kill him, except for being mentally unpleasant?
I didn’t know studios had any say on that kind of thing. Personal publicists and managers maybe, and even then, I figured they could only “strongly recommend” but not force it. I mean, it’s an image-based industry, so I get it. But it sounds to me like the way Mom might force you to wear your Sunday best for church. Hollywood treats their young people like children.
I’ll bet if Page had really dug in his heels he could have worn that suit, and then never worked again because Fox labeled him as difficult.
I think a big part of the anti-trans discourse sometimes is just that people really forget how difficult being an adolescent is. They like to think it’s the best time of their lives, but they forget how insanely difficult puberty is, how you’re depressed, angry, horny, euphoric, often without any specific trigger even, simply due to your hormones. The people say “Oh boo hoo he had to wear a dress instead of a suit”, meanwhile he’s a 20-year-old kid dealing with fame and attention for the first time, with controlling adults forcing him to be inauthentic, AND with dysmorphia. Adolescents are suicidal for far less tangible reasons, because of how hard the whole fucking process is. And it’s not because they’re weak or dumb kids. When you’re a kid everything feels like a matter of life and death and considering suicide rates, it often is, and we should be ashamed for not taking that seriously, regardless of someone’s background or reasons.
How would he feel now if forced to wear a tux to a red carpet event? You know, like in the picture at the top?(and it didn’t almost “literally” kill her back then…)
Women have been wearing suits for decades so i don’t get it, personally.
But— but— they’re in suits, these must be men! No… no, it can’t be! WHAT HAS SCIENCE DONE?!?!!
What were they going to do? Not pay her?
How do you make a hormone?
Regardless if he was trans/cis, why couldn’t he wear whatever the he’ll he wanted. He was pretty much the star of the movie.
“It’s easy for people to roll their eyesHang on. Dammit. He’s right.
When your gender was being misperceived, of course you were treated as a subordinate, a physical ornament with little value beyond that. Now you won’t have to worry about that.
If you’re “almost killed” by an ordinary article of clothing, maybe you’re just too weak for this world.
I think Elliot needs a refresher on the meanings of the words “literally” “did” “almost” and “kill.”
Ellen and she’ll never be a man. Facts.
I have no doubt there’s an extra layer of fucked-upedness to this because of his trans experience, but it’s also just basic-level fucked up that even when he was perceived as a woman, a woman was forced to glam up in a dress and makeup while the man, Michael Cera, was allowed to show up looking rather schlubby. Page would have looked much neater and fancier than he did in a nice suit.
On the one hand, the studio didn’t know he was trans at the time, and I’ve been asked to do so fuckin much worse for jobs, so I can kinda understand having a hard time seeing the unendurable trauma of that. And, being able to afford hormones and surgeries for gender affirmation, and getting the validation of sharing your story publicly make this way easier in many ways than it is for trans people without those resources. So I kinda get people’s shitty knee-jerk reactions.BUT, the industry treating him the way they treated him probably kept him having to live his life in secret for decades longer than he would have otherwise, and that’s gotta be fuckin gut-wrenching! Also also, to the people bitching about him seeming to bitch about life as a trans person so much, um….he just came out and started living authentically, and PEOPLE ARE ASKING ABOUT THIS STUFF. Like, it’s a massive part of his life, so like, yeah, it’s gonna be the focus of a lot of interviews right now. I’d want to talk about it too! No, it’s not the same as growing up on a minefield in a third world country, and HE DIDN’T SAY THAT. He’s just talking about the weird bullshit that sucks ass when you’re living in the closet in an insanely public industry that tries to control every aspect of your life, so you don’t have to be a dick on the internet about it. Try for like 1.4 seconds a little empathy.