Harry Potter actor Miriam Margolyes on the series’ adult fans: “It’s for children”
Dame Miriam Margolyes thinks the Harry Potter phenomenon is "over" and doesn't really get why millennials are hanging on
Aux News Miriam Margolyes
Does anyone give less of a fuck than an old British Dame? At this point in her career, Miriam Margolyes has nothing left to prove, so she doesn’t have to kowtow to anyone, let alone adult Harry Potter fans, whom she professes to “worry” about. “They should be over that by now,” she says in an interview with New Zealand’s 1News. “You know, I mean, it was 25 years ago, and it’s for children. I think it’s for children. But they get stuck in it.”
As worrisome as Margolyes may find Potterheads’ arrested development, she is not above taking their money. “I do Cameos, and people say, ‘Oh, we’re having a Harry Potter-themed wedding,’ and I think, ‘Gosh, what’s their first night of fun going to be?’” She laments. “I can’t even think about it.”
Get them again, Dame Miriam! The actor, who played the Harry Potter films’ Herbology teacher Professor Sprout, has long felt the series “doesn’t mean as much to me as it does to them.” (Understatement.) “For me Harry Potter wasn’t important,” she said back in June 2023. “I was very glad I got the part and I enjoyed being in it and meeting all the people, but it’s not Charles Dickens.”
You can debate the quality of prose and relative cultural impact of J.K. Rowling vs Dickens in the comments if you want. But Margolyes has a point that touches at a larger cultural phenomenon, which is much of the entertainment for being made for adult audiences is repackaging what they liked as kids. From Marvel to DC to Star Wars to Harry Potter to Twilight to every live-action Disney remake, millennials are constantly being fed “new” versions of stories that were intended, in their original form, for a younger demographic. As Margolyes observes, many of us get “stuck” in nostalgia loops that keep us from evolving our taste in art and media, and the major entertainment companies are all too happy to keep the loop going in order to cash in.
It’s a bit of a troublesome trend, and although “Harry Potter is wonderful” and she’s “very grateful to it,” as she states on 1News, Margolyes has a very different perspective than the adults who grew up with the series and still make it a major part of their personalities. “It’s over. That’s what I think,” she says.
333 Comments
Is there any correlation between having “mature” tastes in entertainment and being a mature person?
Honestly? Yes. Harry Potter, Star Wars, Marvel, etc. tell simplistic stories with simple themes. They don’t challenge you, they’re comfort food. If you keep eating Kraft Dinner as your staple meal into your 30’s and 40’s you have an immature palate. If you are still super excited about Harry Potter into your 30’s and 40’s you have an immature brain. You’re allowed to enjoy whatever you want, but you can’t hide from the fact that your tastes say something about who you are.
THIS
Extending the metaphor, I don’t think there’s anything wrong with whipping up the occasional box of Kraft Dinner after a particularly long day.
Yep. This.
Also, Kraft Dinner gussies up really well. Throw in some seasonings, chopped broccoli, fish, and buddy, you got yourself a casserole going!
Thought you were dead.
I wouldn’t feed that to convicted child molesters.
Absolutely true. Everyone can use some comfort sometimes. But it’s a bad idea to eat it every day.
The thing is, even the people you think are eating it every day probably aren’t. The old “read another book” crowd never once understood or noticed that the people they were screaming at did read other books but they were interested in talking about this series right now. Back to the sports fans: if you only ever see Bob at the game where he’s painted his whole hairy body in his team’s colors and he’s shivering on the bench rooting for his guys, you might assume Bob goes around in his daily life also naked in body paint. You might also use your own brain for a second and realize this is what Bob does for fun on what turns out to be about eight Sundays per year. You’re seeing Harry Potter fans online talking to other Harry Potter fans about Harry Potter? Obviously they never talk about anything else and go around their jobs naked and painted green for Slytherin. People contain multitudes unless they’re someone you can feel superior to and pretend they only eat Kraft dinner every night.
Keeping it going, there is no reason for you to continually eat (or especially, drink) something you don’t like just to be an adult.
I just have no interest in recreational sadness. I’m not going to use the 2 hours or so a day I get to entertain myself on shit that makes me sad, but is “IMPORTANT”
Which is probably why the person you’re responding to specifically talked about eating ONLY that.(Turns out other people make dumb points when you change what they said before responding.)
Absolutely not but you don’t want to be making a habit of it.
Eh, I’d say that appreciation of variety is a good thing to have. The way some people talk about entertainment, it’s like “Okay, you’re 30 now! Time to eat steak or seafood for every meal, and NO CANDY.”
To me it’s not about choosing to put stuff like Harry Potter aside because it’s “kids stuff”. I don’t avoid the Harry Potter movies because I’m worried about being labelled as an unserious person, I avoid them because at this stage of my life I find them boring. I do, however, still eat candy. Also I still pretend to use the Force to open automatic doors. We all mature at our own rates!
Makes sense! We all have shit like that.
Using the Force to open automatic doors is the way.
Is it possible to learn this power?
Trust your feelings.
No one’s saying you can’t have variety. showdetective isn’t saying you can’t have Kraft Mac & Cheese for dinner once in a while, just that if you don’t eat anything more complex EVER, it’s a bit immature.
(looks over at the 24-year-old coworker who watches Cars every night as he goes to sleep in the home where his mom does his laundry) yeah there might
I think watching the same movie every night would be bad, kids movie or not.BTW, two days ago I turned 37 and I still live with my mom, although I do my own laundry. I haven’t re-read or re-watched old fiction much for years.
I don’t even like Harry Potter but fuck her for telling people what they are “supposed” to like.
Entertainment is for everyone to enjoy.
Counterpoint: have you tried rereading those books in adulthood? There’s plenty of childhood media I return to regularly, but rereading Potter I quickly realized they’re very much for kids and best left in the past. I wouldn’t publicly censure adults for still being in the pocket for Potter, but I’d be keeping some negative thoughts to myself.
I’ve never had any interest in reading them but I have even less interest in telling other people what to enjoy. I have a friend older than I am that loves HP stuff, I don’t think badly of people for it.
I think there’s room for revisiting things one enjoyed, while recognizing that there are other things out there that better scratch those itches as we mature.Personal example would be Aqua Teen Hunger Force. I was in college when it first hit, and a stoner, and not particularly following any direction. It hit right in my strike zone. I can still occasionally revisit the classic episodes and enjoy them, but I haven’t felt any urge to check out the new episodes. I tried the recent movie sequel, and couldn’t get more than 20 minutes in.Does that mean it’s bad? Hell, probably not. It’s just not resonating with me in the same way that other adult animated and/or absurdist comedies do.
Oh there’s all sorts of examples; my point is that while rereading Sorcerer’s Stone and Prisoner of Azkaban scratched a nostalgia itch, I will flat-out argue that Chamber of Secrets and Order of the Phoenix are unequivocally bad books and I arch an eyebrow at anyone over 25 who says otherwise.
My first take was to disagree with you, BUT:OotP is an awwwwwful book that needed at least 200 pages cut. And an editor to say to Rowling, “Maybe don’t write 82% of Harry’s dialogue in ALL CAPS.”
maybe the books after Order are good but my reread definitively halted with that one. It left me thinking the series buckled under the perceived necessity to escalate the conflict, tie the saga together, and integrate contemporary political commentary.
I think Half-Blood Prince was a romp, and Deathly Hallows was a fairly strong ending. it’s very clear how the book, after the third, tries to shift to doing all the things you said. The first couple books are typical YA, a bit Roald Dahl-y. Goblet of Fire doubles in size, but somehow managed to keep the focus on WHIMSICAL SHIT AT A MAGICING SCHOOL. Phoenix though… it’s like she thought that for the series to work she had to do a whole bunch of belated world building after the fact. There’ve been countless articles on “why the wizarding world doesn’t make sense.” It doesn’t; it falls apart with any real inspection. I would argue it was never meant to make sense in that fashion as, say, Lord of the Rings. It’s a magical boarding school. hence the literal hundreds of pages of dreary exposition in OotP. The chapter where Hagrid is TELLING THEM THE STORY of his adventure with the giants is shockingly terrible.
There has been a trend to dismiss the HP books as “no, they’re actually really bad!” They’re fine. Sometimes excellent, sometimes not (looking at YOU, OotP).
Yeah, I’ve never been aboard that particular train. I have said (correctly) that HP is another version of Joseph Campbell’s hero’s journey/monomyth concept, and that there are better versions of it out there. It’s a great starting point, but shouldn’t be one’s ending point (and I don’t think that it is the end point, for most readers).My ex-wife and my kid read the whole series together. She really dug the stories, and has seen the movies. Nowadays, she doesn’t really talk about HP anymore. She’s since moved on to utterly demolish the Warrior Cats books (fucking ALL of them, somehow), Keeper of the Lost Cities (all of them to date), and is currently getting through Percy Jackson. HP was a great jumping off point for her, and she’s since become an ardent reader.To the extent that the HP series has fundamental value, I’d say it’s in getting kids to pick up a fucking book.
I was an adult when I first read them, and didn’t find them bad. Maybe I’m just a semi-literate dolt?
keeping negative thoughts to myselfNo but really, I think we’re talking about people who are deep in the fandom pocket to the exclusion of other fare, not “I finally checked out Harry Potter, not bad!”
Honestly, with the amount of people I know who are barely literate, I’m happy when anyone reads anything.People with Masters degrees who can’t actually read and comprehend sentences just blow my mind, I swear.
People with Masters degrees who can’t actually read and comprehend sentences just blow my mind, I swear. Oh fuck, man, I once had to process fellowship applications for wet bench researchers. People with multiple degrees – most with an MD & PhD – working on curing various cancers and genetic disorders.Maybe 2 in 10 could write a complete, intelligible sentence. And it’s like, “guys, there has to be SOME room in there for basic, human communication.”
I think it’s a hard science thing, my bad experiences are with engineers. Like ok sure you are really in it for the numbers but if you can’t communicate you’re gonna fuck shit up.
I’ve also run into that with engineers, in direct, face-to-face conversation.“So…do you not know how human communication works, or…?”
A couple of my closest friends are engineers and they’re the most outgoing people I know, great at communication. The engineers I actually work with, however…
Good to know. My sample size is small in that area, admittedly.
My wife is a teacher, and gets involved in some of the district planning, test creation, etc from time to time. Some of the writing that goes on in these committees is legitimately worrisome. She’s shown me paragraphs that I would’ve said were malfunctioning ChatGTP work, if they hadn’t been written well before it was available.
Oh people who get involved with schools who aren’t teachers are just the worst. Administration is petty tyrants who aren’t good at any kind of real work and everyone else who wants to get their hands in the pie is usually a Type A dumbass. I’m in PA so school boards are all determined by local elections and it turns out that no, our children isn’t learning.
I have. They’re light, but no more so than plenty of so-called “adult” authors (Tom Clancy, James Patterson, Dan Brown, etc).
What a boring thing to say. I’ll take good-old fashioned jerks and snobby dipshits any day over such fucking pablum
Fuck you too, asshole.
This take is much lamer than it gets credit for.Sure entertainment is to be enjoyed.There’s a difference between liking Harry Potter and dog fighting, right? So we all agree not all entertainment is equal in how worthwhile it is.So blanket “it just entertainment” line is pretty lame. A 40-50 year old who re reads all 7 HP books every year is enjoying themselves, sure. But would you rather talk to that person or someone who reads the same about but different books?
If it’s not something harmful, which dog fighting is, you are just being an ass if you give people shit about what they like. It’s just being a snooty asshole. Being into an IP doesn’t mean you read the books over and over every year. I like lots of things, I don’t need to repeat media.
“I do Cameos, and people say, ‘Oh, we’re having a Harry Potter-themed wedding,’ and I think, ‘Gosh, what’s their first night of fun going to be?’” She laments. “I can’t even think about it.”She is a great actress and funny as hell but this quotes feels like the definition of “Okay Boomer”.
It’s probably just screaming “You have your mother’s eyes” and “Expecto Patronum” over and over again until they both come.
Huh? People from all generations can think weddings themed around entertainment franchises are stupid.
Stupid weddings can’t exist because they are only about the two people getting married, if it passes for them you don’t matter
Most stupid things don’t appear stupid to the people being stupid, my dude. I’m not forbidding anything, but as a human person I am allowed to have opinions about things, especially the kinds of things I am invited to attend.Relax.
Last time I took my kids to Disney World I saw several couples on their honeymoons wearing wedding-themed Mickey / Minnie hats. Maybe they’re furries and into some funky shit, but mostly I agree with Morgolyes. Yes, people are entitled to whatever they enjoy but c’mon, grow up a little.
Or maybe they are just people who liked cute hats and how they fuck is just as normal or abnormal as anyone else in the world.
they should spend tens of thousands of dollars on a five hour thing that is insanely stressful because… uh… reasons?
there’s ways to do inexpensive weddings that are also somewhat traditional.
My last Disney trip (with two other families) we planned one adult night (two grandmas who came watched all the kids) at the steakhouse in Canada land in Epcot and we had a very nice time and enjoyed drinking in Epcot.
I cannot possibly imagine making that a week long thing.
Beers of the World in Epcot is Disney’s greatest invention.
Even better. We were there for the Wine festival, so there were all kinds of pop-up booths for other countries!
I kept disappearing into the various country-themed restaurants to refill and when I resurfaced my wife was like “where did you…oh. Great.”
Thanks, Walt. I actually really like Disney World but a few beers don’t hurt.
“My last Disney trip.” I can’t believe anyone would go more than once (if that).
“entitled to whatever they enjoy” … “grow up a little”You don’t actually think people are entitled to whatever they enjoy
I do, but it doesn’t mean I won’t get judge-y.
facepalm
You can recognize that people have the right to do something while at the same time respecting them a little less for it. These things are not mutually exclusive. She’s not saying that it should be illegal to sell a Harry Potter book to a thirty-five-year-old.
Well, they’re also entitled to dislike something and express that, aren’t they? It’s not like they’re going around shutting down weirdly-themed weddings, they’re just annoyed by it (I’d hope).
Is this Reddit? Are we in basements?
“Enjoy what you like, but not like that.”
Last time I took my kids to Disney World I saw several couples on their honeymoons wearing wedding-themed Mickey / Minnie hats.Disney adults are the fucking worst.Adults without children at Disney parks belong on a watch list.
By your logic there shouldn’t be ANYONE in Disney World who isn’t a child/has children.
I think YOU need to grow up a little and stop feeling the need to be performatively grown in public. The world is on fire and you guys wanna tell people to grow up because they wear wedding themed mouse hats.
30k+ dead in Palestine with YOUR tax dollars and yet you think the ones who engage with childrens content need to grow up?….. not the grown ass adults who are bent out of shape over adults engaging with childrens content?
The mental hoops you people will jump through to justify just being hateful cunts is mind blowing to me.
Ewwww. I hope people like you are going to die soon so people can just be who they are without being afraid of being judged by total asshats.
I dunno; I remember going to a wedding decades ago where there was no theme, but the simple fact that they exited the ceremony to the Star Wars fanfare had me wondering if they were ready for this big step (their ages and the fact that they were basically a match made by their youth pastor didn’t help).
What are your thoughts on the Star Trek theme? Does it have to be serious music not associated with a media franchise? What if it was an Avenged Sevenfold song?
Avenged Sevenfold is serious music?
No, that was a separate thought.
Eh, we did the wedding party introductions to the Imperial March at our wedding because we thought it was funny. I was 29 and my wife was 30 when we got married.
Well, that was decades ago! How did the marriage turn out?
That’s unfair. Even Boomers don’t assume someone’s wedding night is their “first night of fun”.
For me, it’s the corporatization of it. Like when someone says, “I really like drinking coke, so I got a tattoo of the cursive Coca-Cola logo.” All I can think is, yikes.
Mirium Margolys is pretty cool. She did a nice series: Miriam Margolyse: Almost Autralian.
That was very good.
She is hilarious when she is on the Graham Norton show
I’ll look for that, thanks.
Miriam Margolyes says a lot of stuff. Which then gets bits taken out and put into articles like these.
Yes. 85 year old woman says something and OMG eveyone has an opinion about it!!!
If only.
or it’s an adult pointing out that the intended audience has always been children and any adult reading YA fiction is a fucking failure. read animal farm, leftist faggots.
Wow, right out of the gate with slurs, par for the course for you, the epitome of human garbage.
Anyone reading these books is far more in touch with reality than you are, living in a fantasy world of your own imagining.
The only failure here is you, completely failing when it comes to word use, basic language, or logic.
You are a fucking hypocrite in denial. You are still a pussy in denial. Redlining is explicitly racist and happening now. That is systematic racism. That’s in addition to the previous science you had a meltdown over after you bothered to pay attention to the proof YOU put forth and realized it all said you were wrong.science > youYou are a pathetic fucking joke and ridiculously out of gas.
She’s Silent Generation, tribalist.
Wut? No. No, it doesn’t. Making fun of people for having freaking Harry Potter weddings, or rightfully pointing out how asinine it is for grown adults to still be obsessed with an aggressively mediocre and decades-old fantasy series for children, is not even remotely similar to an “okay, boomer” statement.
She gives hilarious interviews, but I would never take any ‘advice’ she gives as actual advice. She knows how to be absolutely filthy dirty and also can pretend to be the most innocent person ever, depending on who else is in the interview with her. She’s great at that, and she has a sharp wit… yet, I think even Miriam Margolyes would say to never take life advice from Miriam Margolyes.
Millennial here, Margolyes is spot on.
I don’t see it. To me, that’s a pretty clever burn and the complete opposite of how I envision Boomer Humor. Also, “Okay boomer” has always been stupid.
Hi, GenX personified here. As usual, I can understand both of your points of view. It’s definitely a bit skeezy to throw a Harry Potter wedding, which probably makes half of your guests feel vaguely uncomfortable, while most of the other half are probably joyfully mocking you for it the entire evening. But it’s also uncool to shame someone, in an international medium, for throwing such a shindig. It’s weird and contradictory, but I’ve found that embracing apathy about shit like this tends to broaden the mind a little. And if ever a generation has embraced apathy, it’s X.(Fuck. How does Musk manage to make a *letter of the alphabet* feel creepy?)
Gen X. Unofficial motto*: Leave us out of it.*Because we could never be bothered to make anything official.
I mean, one thing I will say is that I dislike the idea of entertainment being dragged along kicking and screaming with its audience as it grows.You’re allowed to outgrow things. You’re also allowed to hold on to things. But that doesn’t make you entitled to force the thing to change because you don’t want to outgrow it.Plenty of stuff that I love that’s meant for kids that I love as is because you know what, I’m still allowed to enjoy it.
(To be clear I said “dragged along” very deliberately. If entertainment is aging up with its audience and that’s the authorial intent, different story entirely!)
Yeah I think fans trying to age up kids stuff for themselves is real terrible. The worst example of this imo is Space Jam 2, a movie that exists only to cater to millennial nostalgia.If you like kids stuff, fine, but just accept it for what it is.
…and which sucked. Very few legacy sequels or reboots work at all. Maverick is probably the only one I can think of that elevated its source material.
But the thing is the original Space Jam movie is also kinda shit.
True, but the latest one smells like Lebron once again chasing Jordan.
That’s the thing that amazes me about it! I always say “why remake the classics, remake bad movies better.” LeBron tried it and somehow managed to make it worse.
People sure have a lot to say about the quality of a kids movie starring Michael Jordan and the Looney Tunes.
Nothing but the finest discussion of cinema here on the AVClub
110% a nostalgia thing. Plenty of Gen X’ers love the movie, but know it’s not a good movie.
Maverick is definitely one of the few (the only one off the top of my head) that is demonstrably, easily superior to the original.
Co-sign. I cringed when I first heard it was being made, and then couldn’t have been more pleasantly surprised. Had no business being as good as it was.
My only regret is not seeing it in the theater.
But Tom Cruise said we had to!
Definite theater experience. People cheered at the end.
Couldn’t agree more. Good heavens was Space Jam 2 terrible. It was even worse than those kinds of reboots usually are because instead of being a soulless nostalgia cash grab, it was a soulless vanity project.What he did to House Party was even worse, and that’s saying something.
I never said it didn’t? But yeah, you can count the good legacy sequels/reboots on your fingers… possibly on one hand
I think they more you tend to break down what’s actually happening, the more complicated it gets. Something like Space Jam 2 is a great example. The original film is super-mid ‘90s, not just because that’s when all the athletes involved were in their prime, but also because it was riding and in many ways capped off an almost decade-long trend of live action-animation combos that happened after Who Framed Roger Rabbit was a surprise hit in ‘88. So if you’re bringing that back in 2021, who is your primary audience? Realistically, the studio is probably trying to nostalgia grab all those old viewers AND get the kids with their sports heroes, and that kind of thing is almost always an awkward fit because neither audience is really getting what it wants.
I don’t know a single millennial who watched space jam 2.But I am also white, so that could be a thing.
Depends on the execution. Andor is aged up Star Wars but they did it well so who cares.
I like this take. I still read a few comics. The best ones are able to take the things I loved as a kid, and present them in ways that elevate what I loved and invest it with things I didn’t even know I wanted.Immortal Hulk is my go-to example for this. It’s a great Hulk story, and a full third of it sees the Hulk being severely de-powered. It’s like an anti-take on what I loved about the Hulk as a kid.
and then you ahve the flipside, which is things like Spider-Man “brand new day” or Green Lantern/Flash: Rebirth. Both stories where the authorial intent is “I want it to be the same as it was when I was a kid, which was 30 years ago.”
Yep. DC is notorious for that shit in a general sense, and Marvel is just friggin’ ADDICTED to the idea that Parker needs to be a put upon, sad sack loser. I do not understand it.
I don’t know, man. DC has always been doing retcons so it’s… less jarring when they do it for the 27th time.Spidey though; that was the first time I can think of Marvel did a FULL DC level mindwipey REBOOT. They’ve retconned loads of shit, but more in a cherry-picked, whatever, as the years go on fashion. Joe Quesada and Dan Slott and some other goofs swore up and down for years that married Peter Parker was “just the worst” and “unrelateable.” The hate for MJ is… wild.But here’s the fucking thing.When they did Brand New Day, I was 26. I wasn’t a kid. I wasn’t a teen.Peter and MJ got married in 1987 *when I was six years old*. Quesada is 20 years my senior. Not ten. TWENTY. So he was FORTY-SIX when they did the retcon.Peter had been with Mary Jane for almost my entire life. Gwen Stacy was DEAD before I was born. Swingin’ single peter wasn’t my jam… so you have these fifty year old men demanding nostalgia for something that was, by that point, thirty+ years ago, when THEY were kids. Geoff Johns wanting Barry Allen back. Barry died in fucking 85. Wally had been Flash almost as long, with a marvelous and legendary run by Waid/Ringo/et al. For ME, for an entire generation (or TWO!), Wally West was Flash. Peter was with MJ. Kyle Rayner didn’t have the longevity as Hal, but I didn’t give a single goddamn fuck about Hal Jordan. Hell, it’s not even really accurate that Peter is a sad sack “loser.” Dude always was dealing with the terrible problem of running at LEAST three insanely hot women at a time. Peter ran into PROBLEMS; paying his bills, managing relationships, dealing with a grouchy boss, the conflict of being Spider-Man messing up his personal life. But a LOSER? Nah.That you had late forties and fifty year old men saying, “We want these character to be the way they were when we were kids”, which was literally three or four decades ago, is insane.Does Peter have to stay with MJ forever just because MY generation only knew it? No. Not at all. But fuck sake, move him on better. Or just start a new Spidey book with him as a teen. Call it “Ultimate Spider-Man” or something. Oh, WAIT. They did ALL THAT when they LITERALLY had a book where Peter was a single swingin’ teen going on. Movies and cartoons where he was. As you can tell my this wall of text, it sets me off. I’m generally super-chill about most nerdy things. I’m a big proponent of adaptation to best suit a medium, open to new ideas, etc etc. But jesus christ, Johns and Quesada … screw them.
Also with Spidey– while there are some legit issues with the JMS run, one thing he was doing a great job of was advancing Peter in his life. Aunt May knew he was Spider-Man. He and MJ and Aunt May were all living in Avengers Tower. He still had problems but he was continuing to mature and grow, and it was great stuff. There was no need to pull things back to an earlier form.
If memory serves, bringing Barry back was Dan DiDio’s idea, not John’s.
Eh, not even a Potter fan, but I don’t see it as any different than people being rabid sports fans. So long as people can recognize that escapism isn’t a place you fucking *live* in, whatever.Though I will say that the amount of people who defend HP/JKR as if they were their parents is incredibly fucking weird. I was a massive TMNT fan in the late 80s, and if people shit talk Eastman/Laird, I’m not going to lose my shit and fight people over it, because it was a fucking cartoon and I’m an adult with bills and responsibilities n’ shit.
Eastman and Laird didn’t have shit to do with that cartoon. They hated that shit.
I’m aware. Wasn’t my point. In any event, sub in Jack Mendelsohn. Same point.No adult needs to be going to the mattresses to defend creators of shit they consumed as children and/or have an affinity for as adults. It’s the next closest thing to console war shit, or “cola wars” brand fights.
If you were aware, that was a strange choice of sentence.But your primary point is valid, I suppose, although it seems that the people going over the top in defending JKR are doing it less because they love her books than because they agree with her bigotry. Most of the non-bigoted Potter fanatics are either moving on or leaning into separating the art from the artist.
Dude, we’re shorthanding here. Very few people know who Jack Mendelsohn is. Many more know who Eastman/Laird are. I suppose I could have used the Lee/Kirby example, but I didn’t, as I was jawing on the Internet, and TMNT came to mind. Their names were all over the place when the toy line and cartoon hit, as the creators of the property.Is there a point to your pedantry, in this case? NOTE: There was, in fact, no point to the pedantry. My mistake for trying to engage.
Like, it just struck me as pretty fucking weird to get unnecessarily specific about a creator’s name and get the facts wrong. Like, most nobody knows who Eastman and Laird are, but anyone who does knows that they created the original comic, not the cartoon, associated Archie comic, or anything else. It was strange.I then just said, “that was weird,” and responded to the actual content of your post. It seems like you’re the one who can’t get over that mistake, not me; if it was just “shorthanding,” you probably wouldn’t be so upset.
they sure loved the millions of dollars it brought their way!
The sports thing is a solid analogy, as is the idea that the real problem is picking any small sliver of culture and making it your whole personality. I was a lit major, so I love me some Shakespeare, but the people who only read Shakespeare are also weird as fuck.
Oh, totally. I have a ton of nerd friends, but the vast majority of them have pursuits outside of escapism. Fitness, healthy motivation for career advancement, appreciation of nature walks, general self-improvement, etc. Varied shit.On the other side, I know several folks IRL who have made escapism their entire persona. And it’s like…man, there’s more to life than working retail to obtain funds for enough fabric to make your next anime costume and pay for a ticket to the next anime convention that month while the rest of your life stagnates.To speak to the lit major piece, can relate. My “hero” in that space was John Milton, but if I had to read Paradise Lost and Areopagitica all the time, I’d want to beat my brains in with whatever hardbound copy of Milton’s writings was nearest. 😀
Yeah, I think I don’t love her take not even because I disagree that Dickens is better written than Harry Potter, but because that position reminds me of the sort of intellectual cowardice I’d often see from people who thought they were being smart. There is no risk in saying Dickens or Shakespeare or Milton are good writers. If that’s all you read, I don’t see a quiet genius whose mind is always on higher things. I see someone who appears scared of any new idea that hasn’t been vetted and approved by generations of scholars. The actual smartest people I know tend to have wide-ranging and unconventional interests alongside their grounding and affection for the canon basics.
This is all true but doesn’t apply here. Not being an adult HP fan does NOT indicate intellectual cowardice. HP’s themes, references and ideas are super derivative and conservative and it is written in a dull, old-fashioned journalistic style.
Well fucking said.
You seem like an insufferable piece of shit. Kill yourself.
The other aspect of it is that being a die-hard insane sports fan is SOCIALLY ACCEPTABLE and even encouraged, wheras being a die-hard fan of some nerd thing … isn’t. And yet stadiums full of people in their colours, celebrating those extreme fans who dress up (cosplay), paint faces, etc. Waving banners. Getting tribal.Ultimately to your other point, the most concerning part of any of this is: making that THING one’s entire personality.
The other aspect of it is that being a die-hard insane sports fan is SOCIALLY ACCEPTABLE and even encouraged, wheras being a die-hard fan of some nerd thing … isn’t.I would say this has obviously and measurably shifted in the last 15 years and is far from true today.
sure, it’s shifted. it’s still not measured the same.
This was true 30 years ago, maybe.But you just haven’t properly processed childhood trauma if you think this is true Most major cities have cons and cosplay gatherings. I regularly see LARPing in the park near me.D&D is mainstream. Comics culture is mainstream now.
Yeah, what’s wrong with a little Friar Bacon and Friar Bungay…
Sort of playing the devil’s advocate here, but there might be enough in Shakespeare to keep you going for a whole human lifetime. That shit runs deep. The college professor I did Shakespeare told us, “it’s amazing what you miss the first fifteen times you read it.” Harry Potter, per Margolyes and per me, might just not have that kind of juice.
I’m not really arguing the literary merits of each, and like I said, I love Shakespeare and am neutral at best on the Harry Potter series. I am suggesting that loving Shakespeare is the safest opinion in literature, and an unwillingness to venture outside of it is more likely the sign of an insecure or incurious mind than a brilliant one.
If someone tells you their favorite writer is Shakespeare, their favorite band is the Beatles, and their favorite movie is Citizen Kane, that’s a presidential candidate whose PR team put together the most broad and inoffensive set of opinions possible for public consumption, not an actual human with interesting thoughts and feelings. That is as much a testament to the power of those works and artists as it is a slight against the person whose only taste and opinions are so prosaic.
Fair enough, really. But we may have update the Shakespeare response. I mean, he’s genuinely difficult for moderns to read. Perhaps, I don’t know, Toni Morrison? Ernest Hemingway? Who’s the most reliably emblematic author today? Also, I kind of liked it when Mitt Romney said his favorite book was “Battlefield Earth.” I mean, it’s hard to argue that a PR team came up with that one. It had to have been true.
I was being glib; an actual candidate’s list would be in the same spirit but obviously feature more Americans. The four books by Americans in Modern Library’s top ten of the 20th century are The Great Gatsby, The Sound and the Fury, The Grapes of Wrath, and Catch-22, and I’d be shocked if the first three of them haven’t been named as at least one candidate’s official favorite book in the last seventy years, and probably multiple. For the record, Trump’s most frequently cited favorite movie IS Citizen Kane, which is both literally what you should guess if asked to predict “generic candidate’s favorite movie” and an obviously ridiculous lie.
I can believe that Citizen Kane is Trump’s favorite movie, just for all the wrong reasons.“He who dies with the most money wins” is certainly one possible interpretation of the Citizen Kane.
From a political perspective, “The Great Gatsby” is probably the safest choice. I think that it’s still a required read in a lot of high schools. “Catch-22″ can be seen as subversive and “The Grapes of Wrath” is too socialist/left-leaning. “The Sound and the Fury” is a classic, but it involves a lot of weird incest issues and that chapter written from the point of view of a special needs kid, so not what every one of your constituents will want to think of you reading. It should be noted that Al Gore absolutely went for it and said that his favorite book wall Stendhal’s “The Red and the Black,” which wasn’t even written by an American.
A lot of it depends on how the question was asked, too. If a journalist e-mailed their campaign or it’s up on the website, it’s much more likely to be a heavily sanitized answer chosen by committee. If a reporter caught them live after they read Goodnight, Moon to a kindergarten class or something, the answer won’t necessarily be any more honest, but it will generally give you more insight into how the candidate’s mind works and/or how much advanced prep they’re doing.
The analogy only works if you don’t watch sports.No one watches the same game over and over. Most fans won’t even record games to watch later.Sports is more like people into HP fan fiction or Cons or something like that. Not people who reread the books every year or watch the movies over and over.
Yeah no one says “How do these two fuck” after hearing about a couples equally stupid sports themed wedding
I do like to take the piss out of uber-rabid sports fans, though.“LOL u still collect comic shit”ME: And you have no fewer than a dozen $100+ replica jerseys and regularly cheer on large men trying to give each other CTE. We all have our crosses to bear.
I’m in my 40s. I’ve never met anyone who mocked me for being into books and nerdy stuff.Nerds talk down about me liking sports ALL. THE. TIME.I can’t speak for your experience. But mine is that “nerds” have always been the snobby/bullish ones.
I say that. But then I say “How do these two fuck” at every wedding I go to. Loudly and usually in the middle of the ceremony. I don’t get invited to many weddings anymore.
I’m guessing you attended five or six as the groom.
I don’t ask a silly question like that. Instead I insist I get to watch the wedding night to ensure the marriage is official. I don’t get invited to many weddings either
Vote for Trump, I think Prima Nocte might be on his second term platform.
That’s because everyone knows how rabid sports fans fuck. Intoxicated and without consent.
If anyone had an NFL themed wedding it would be two morbidly obese diabetics from Green Bay or Dallas and I’d be wondering in the most literal way, “how do these two fuck??”
People don’t worship Rowling because of her mediocre writing, they worship her because she’s a raging bigot and that makes them feel validated about hating the same people she does. It’s similar to why so many people adore Donald Trump.Eastman/Laird don’t belong to any hate groups so people are way more normal about them.
I’m not entirely talking Rowling worship, though. The chuds will back anything that hurts their “enemies,” like good lil’ “agents of chaos” or whatever, so they “back” Rowling. I’m talking about the die-hard Potterheads who do not want their escapist bubble/weird identity shattered.Point being that a section of the HP defense corps is adults who loved HP as kids, who took a ton of their identity from HP/JKR as kids, and are responding to attacks on JKR as if they were destructive attacks on a whole-ass multimedia empire that they love. There are chuds in there, because there always are, but there’s a strong current of “Just LET ME HAVE MY STOOOOOOOORRRRRRRIEEEEEEEEES” in there as well.
Keep with the sports analogy and then look at how many people make a living talking and shit talking so grown men can go off on each other weekly about their chosen sports team. People are always going to discuss, debate, and defend whatever thing they enjoy/love. For me, it’s HP and Doctor Who with a lot of other film nerd shit thrown in (I love awards season). For the guy in my life, it’s NFL, NHL, and NBA (we both enjoy baseball to a degree but not enough to really care). Either way we are grown adults dealing with our regular life and use our entertainment of choice as a means of connection with other humans.
I totally agree with this, and my marriage with my husband is very similar to what you describe. Bring this to it’s natural conclusion I suppose my (very embarrassed) husband had a slip of the thumb and accidentally posted the very nerdy reddit thread he was reading about Severance ( one of of our favourite shows) to his entire volleyball team, most of whom have never heard of it. Beyond that incident, we are otherwise able to both balance our nerdier passions with real life interests and aspirations quite nicely.
sports has a loooong history of being about adult human endurance and combative competition. it goes back to the fucking colosseum and holds a special power over adults. harry potter is literally YA fiction and any adult who reads it is a faggot brainlet. pathetic.
It’s hilarious you complain about “being stalked” while you literally stalk multiple websites just to be nasty to people. Why are you even on these sites? You hate everything on them. You try and make fun of people for having hobbies, meanwhile being an ass on the internet seems to be your whole fucking life.
That and being a victim.
You are still a pussy in denial. Redlining is explicitly racist and happening now. That is systematic racism. That’s in addition to the previous science you had a meltdown over after you bothered to pay attention to the proof YOU put forth and realized it all said you were wrong.science > youYou are a pathetic fucking joke and ridiculously out of gas.
BTW, way to show what a bigot you are inside, trying to insult people by calling them gay. Why would that even be an insult if you were not bigoted? Like I said, you are just absolute garbage.
i don’t use faggot to mean gay. jesus christ, how lost are you in the fucking soc jus weeds. an entire generation used it and it didn’t mean gay. i’m not going to change for a bunch of fucking faggots.
Right, yet another word you claim means something completely fucking different. You are the one who needs to read some new books, like a fucking dictionary. I’ve found the reason no one wants your plays, it’s not because you are a cis white victim, it’s because you are a moron who doesn’t know shit.
Dude, you need to get a life, it’s all focused on your victimhood and stalking websites devoted to topics you hate just to be hateful. You are absolute scum.
You are still a pussy in denial. Redlining is explicitly racist and happening now. That is systematic racism. That’s in addition to the previous science you had a meltdown over after you bothered to pay attention to the proof YOU put forth and realized it all said you were wrong.science > youYou are a pathetic fucking joke and ridiculously out of gas.
you calling me a stalker is like Hitler telling Goebbels to take it down a notch. HAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHHHAAHAAHAYOU’VE STALKED ME FOR WEEKS. FUCKING PATHETIC. ALL OVER A FUCKING DICTIONARY. YOU IGNORE CONTEXT LIKE ALL PROGRESSIVES.i wouldn’t worry about my career faggot. i’ve supported myself doing what i do for 15 fucking years.you’re an obsessed fucking landwhale with zero life. kill yourself.
It’s accurate as fuck, no matter who says it. I continue to point out your hypocrisy and inability to deal with reality because you are human garbage.
I’m just going by what you said about your victim story, it’s just because you suck at words. I didn’t believe your playwrite bullshit anyways. Your still just a bad fucking counselor.
Unlike you I actually haver hobbies and friends outside of searching out multiple website to be angry on. LOLOOOLOLOLOLOLOL
i’m typing with my thumb, stalker whale elf cunt. who cares how i write on some fucking sold out irrelevant sjw message board. eat shit. kill yourself. get a life.
LOL the stalker who life is consumed with stalking MULTIPLE WEBSITES is complaining I stalk him? LOOLOLOLOLOOLOLOLYour entire fucking life revolves around being a victim! You were a victim at work, your a victim of DEI, progressives are racist against you. It’s so all consuming that you seek out multiple websites devoted to topics you hate just to troll. No one who feels the need to go to places they dislike to be an asshole is mentally well or having a good life. And no one who throws around racial and homophobic slurs like you do isn’t a bigot. Liberalism is defined by sources other than you or me. Someone’s words or positions either conform to that definition or they do not. You want to add exceptions to the definition and make it different for some undefined period of time. Without a source, that’s just your retarded opinion.You have to prove your context is relevent with a source. You can’t because it is not relevent and everything in the universe grasps that but you. It makse no sense to say a PREVIOUSLY segragated society changed the definition liberal when it was invented during a far more segragated and racist time period. In order to be logically consistent you have to admit that either King isn’t liberal or the CRT proponents you vilify as illiberal are just as liberal as he is for having the same views.You are still a pussy in denial. Redlining is explicitly racist and happening now. That is systematic racism. That’s in addition to the previous science you had a meltdown over after you bothered to pay attention to the proof YOU put forth and realized it all said you were wrong.science > youYou are a pathetic fucking joke and ridiculously out of gas.
how does one stalk a website? you literally comment on every comment i make.kill yourself.
By coming here for the sole purpose of trolling. You don’t like anything here, your whole existence here is just revolving around your victim complex that subsumes your entire life.Specifically what time period was the definition of liberal different? What year to what year? What was the specific definition of liberal at that time? What source suoports those claims?You don’t even know the answer to the first two questions and you know the third doesn’t exist because you are manufacturing bullshit. Let’s watch you mewl and squirm trying to avoid reality!Liberalism is defined by sources other than you or me. Someone’s words or positions either conform to that definition or they do not. You want to add exceptions to the definition and make it different for some undefined period of time. Without a source, that’s just your retarded opinion. You have to prove your context is relevant with a source. You can’t because it is not relevant and everything in the universe grasps that but you. It makes no sense to say a PREVIOUSLY segregated society changed the definition liberal when it was invented during a far more segregated and racist time period. In order to be logically consistent you have to admit that either King isn’t liberal or the CRT proponents you vilify as illiberal are just as liberal as he is for having the same views. You are still a pussy in denial. Redlining is explicitly racist and happening now. That is systematic racism. That’s in addition to the previous science you had a meltdown over after you bothered to pay attention to the proof YOU put forth and realized it all said you were wrong.science > youYou are a pathetic fucking joke and ridiculously out of gas.
get a fucking life.i’d say that when one lived in a fucking segregated society, it made perfect sense to call out the majority white population for being racist and for fighting for individual rights, which is in the fucking definition of being a liberal.i’d say when one lives in a society where most black people are fucking middle class, it makes no fucking sense to blame an entire race for non-existent problems and call white people fucking colonizers and spirit murderers, you dunce cunt.kill yourself. get a life.
You are continuning to ignore that society was not longer segregated when King made many of his comments. You are also ignoring that the very definition of liberal was laid down in times of slavery and segregation, but somehow, for some period of time you can’t say, the definition was different.
What makes sense to you is not how liberalism is defined. “”Fighting for individual rights” is not what the quotes I provided are doing. Saying that all white people are evil is not “fighting for individual rights” or “calling out a majority”, and if it is IT IS THE SAME WHE JON STEWART SAYS IT. Saying that black people deserves SPECIAL TREATMENT is the OPPOSITE of “fighting for individual rights.
How you fight for something matters. Your goal does not make all actions liberal. As I have said several times and you keep ignoring, if King murdered people for his goal, murder would not suddenly be liberal. Actions and views either conform to the definition of liberal or they do not. The fact you can’t cope with is Kings words and views were often NOT in line with the definition of liberal JUST LIKE CRT PROPONENTS TODAY. And you can mewl that the times matters there, but that’s still nothing more than your desperate opinion supported by nothing.
“i’d say when one lives in a society where most black people are fucking middle class, it makes no fucking sense”
WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT WHAT DOES OR DOES NOT MAKE SENSE THAT IS OPINION. We are talking WHAT IS OR IS NOT FACTUALLY LIBERAL. What makes sense to you is IRRELEVENT to FACTS.You are still a pussy in denial. Redlining is explicitly racist and happening now. That is systematic racism. That’s in addition to the previous science you had a meltdown over after you bothered to pay attention to the proof YOU put forth and realized it all said you were wrong.science > youYou are a pathetic fucking joke and ridiculously out of gas.
And seriously, who between us needs a life? I have friends and fun hobbies you try and make fun of me for because you are a jealous loser that no one likes and spends his time on websites he doesn’t even like just to be hateful to people.Your entire fucking life revolves around being a victim! You were a victim at work, your a victim of DEI, progressives are racist against you. It’s so all consuming that you seek out multiple websites devoted to topics you hate just to troll. No one who feels the need to go to places they dislike to be an asshole is mentally well or having a good life. And no one who throws around racial and homophobic slurs like you do isn’t a bigot.
sports are for grownups and harry potter is for children. small flaw in your argument
Awwww…attracted some lil’ guys addicted to seeing grown men give each other CTE who got big mad at the comparison, Lord bless ‘em. ;-*
I could have maybe done that at like age 12. Now I’m like, okay this disappointed me, moving on. Kinda hard to be such narrow focused as life won’t go on if my favorite film franchise was mocked.
Popen whose entire identity is their sports Fandom are also ridiculous and embarrassing. But for average sports fans, even then: sports involve real people, and are constantly evolving and changing from year to year, and consistently presenting something new or providing real human drama. That really isn’t comparable to an extremely mediocre children’s fantasy series that was completed decades ago.
Adults should not be constrained by what’s considered mature or not, but people who have theme weddings are going to the Bad Place.
I know a couple of people who have done the full Disney wedding, and it sounds like my personal hell. The crowds and rigmarole alone, man…
The fucking cost is insane too.
Yeah, if I were invited to one, nah. I’d take half of what it’d cost to get there, add in a further half of that to account for the aggravation I’d be avoiding, and get them a nice gift.
Sugar Land. Figures.
like that lotr wedding from one of the insta or snap founders that fucked up a federal park?thats not one pineapple up the ass. thats ALL the pineapples up the ass.
Ah yes, our annual reminder that Professor Sprout is actually a pretty big bitch. (Not only for this, but also for making racists and ableist jokes, defending Rowling, and publicly slandering Steve Martin)
She’s not a bitch for this.
Yes she is
Wait…slandering Steve Martin???!Limey bitch.
Also, of course she doesn’t understand, as she was only involved in the movies, which were… meh…
I was pretty involved in reading this thread, but now I must leave immediately to Google ” Miriam Margoyles Steve Martin”
Good for her, I guess? I’m not a huge HP fan but I love that it got a whole generation of kids to actually pick up books, if they still like it 20 years later it’s not my place to put them down.Also:
My kids have all read the series at least 3 times each, so I’m on board with that sentiment. It put them in the habit of always having a book on the nightstand to read before going to sleep.
Sprout had what, 5 minutes of screentime throughout 8 films?She can say whatever she wants. She’s still wrong.
Yes, sometimes there ARE small parts. Your comment is the last and the best take!
…are Potter adults still a thing (or at least a prominent subculture)? Maybe the death of tumblr has cut off my exposure to them, but I get a stronger impression the series lives on through kids discovering the books/movies; many of my nieces and nephews went through Potter phases which distinctly ended at a certain point. I get the impression the fandom will nestle into a groove like Babysitters’ Club or Power Rangers.
Potter adults are still a thing just like Star Wars adults are still a thing or Disney adults are still a thing. The books are still best sellers on Amazon, and tons of merchandise is sold at stores, even stores that focus on nothing but Potter stuff, and most of that stuff is targeted at adults with lots of cash, not kids.And to be fair, it is not a lot different than the money I might spend on Tolkien related stuff or Tiki themed barware.
Oh, definitely. It’s just in more of a stable lull now, not a full-on fervor. Dig a bit, and you’ll still find adults who refer to themselves as Ravenclaws or Hufflepuffs or whatever.
I enjoyed having scarves, a banner, etc, prior to Rowling’s loathesome terfdom.
Yep, that’s very real as well. A whole bunch of kid Potterheads grew up into young adults who were just tremendously let down by their hero. Probably led to a lot of discussions about separating art from artist (which I think can be done, but that’s a whole other thing).I’ve definitely seen parents in my orbit who pass their copies down to their kids, but who won’t get aboard the merch/theme park train. It’s like, “This meant a lot to me, and then it became something else, but maybe you can find some of the joy I once found in it.”
Very much. I never made HP my personality (I did that with a couple other properties, was able to grow up). I did enjoy it, a LOT. Loved the books. Did midnight release for HBP and DH.I enjoyed having cool accoutrement. The first day of my actual teaching career, I wore a Slytherin tie. Students loved it! Lots of talk about “what house” kids were. I had a banner in my classroom. Had a scarf. Functional but also nerdy things(incidentially this where I generally put my nerd dollars now; less figures and things and more functional shit like coffee cups, genuine clothing articles, etc)When my oldest child was old enough we started reading them together. We got LEGO sets together. So it was also a big bonding thing for my kids.Fuck Rowling, man. I won’t stop my oldest from buying HP lego with her own money (she has moved onto other things, especially nintendo), but… i can’t. can’t spend money on it, can’t do it as gifts anymore. etc etc.The original 7 books, sure.
Total Ravenclaw attitude.
Hey now, I’m a Herbledorf! And PROUD of it!
Oh Potter adults are totally a thing. My brother in law read all of those books and probably still re-reads them, in addition whatever the Percy Jacobs thing is. And it might not surprise you to learn that he does indeed have the brain of your average 12 year old. On a good day. Is he a parent? Yup. So what I’m saying is society doesn’t have a chance. Because he is far from being the only one.
The books’ popularity has dropped off significantly, but they still sell better than most other book series. It’s no longer this massive cultural phenomenon, but it’s still popular enough to milk for a bit of extra money. But it feels like it peaked quite a while ago and the kids who are reading it now are doing so because it’s easier for mom and dad to hand them their old copy of Sorcerer’s Stone than go out and buy them something new. I doubt those kids will be sharing Harry Potter with their own children someday.
I work with a dude who was a pretty full-on HP adult, but that seemed to chill out pretty fast when he met a nice girl and got engaged.
Hmmm, people who liked something a lot 25 years ago have grown up and still like it a lot. Go figure?
You’re right, it’s not shocking that many people don’t grow up, and they are too closed minded to open up to new things.You’re free to be that way.But Margolyes and I are allowed to look at you and say, “I think I’d rather talk with more interesting people than people who haven’t changed much in 25 years.”
Who said they didn’t change in 25 years. Those people probably like a bunch of new stuff too. But they still like the stuff they used to as well. This is not any sort of revelation. Just like people still like the food they grew up with, even if it was of questionable quality.Sure, you are absolutely allowed to look at those people and say shit about them. And they are just as allowed to say back “Lighten up Francis, you might want to pull out that stick up your ass!”
“Margolyes and I” you fucking tool
I think one of the reasons so many Potter adults (and Disney adults, and whatever other way-too-hardcore fandom of children’s entertainment you can name) are unable to let go is because nothing ever ENDS anymore. These days, brands don’t die because Hollywood/publishers/etc won’t let them. So like, Potter went for 7 books (and 8 movies) and could have ended right there forever. Well done, JKR, enjoy your Scrooge McDuck-size money bin. But then she kept going, whether it was via her constantly releasing tidbits of Potter lore (“Dumbledore’s gay”, “wizards used to shit on the floor”, etc), or her sequel play, or those Fantastic Beasts turds (which no matter what she says, I’m like 90% sure WB had a hand in pushing her to make). Fans have had a steady stream of content to string them along basically non-stop even after the original series was over, until we get to the present where they’re (well, a percentage of them) still into it. You can apply this to all sorts of franchises (I could probably go for pages about how it’s fucked up superhero comics) but it’s never been stronger than it is today. In another decade or two we’ll get stoties/quotes like these from people that were involved with Twilight or The Hunger Games series (serieses?).
There’s something to this. Star Wars was at least gone – except for increasingly ludicrous books and some primitive video games – from 1983 to 1997, when the special editions came out.
Harry Potter won’t even go away for that long.
As for the MCU, I still enjoy the movies and it is so widespread it is in some other weird category besides nostalgia now. I mean, Shang-Chi basically functioned as an original film to me, since I didn’t read those comics. Same with Guardians. On the other hand, I can Leo-point all through the Spider-Man movies at stuff from my childhood.
I’m sure other fans have similar experiences, except with the characters mixed around.
I remember as a kid a friend of mine had a shirt that said, “Star Wars: The First Ten Years – 1977 – 1987″ on it. And I thought that was deeply weird and sad.This was easily the biggest SW nerd friend I had. I mean, we were all super into SW when it was current, bu, dude, Star Wars is over, man. It ended FOUR whole years ago! And it’s not like new content came out since then. “The first ten years?” Doesn’t even make any sense.
Let it go.
If only I knew…
I remember a cover story in Starlog asking, “Is Star Wars fandom dead?” That was about 1987.
As a kid for whom Star Wars was my favourite thing, I never felt like there was a real promise of more until more actually started happening, and eventually knew I had to find a new favourite thing, preferably involving girls. If there were other kids my age still holding onto a torch for the future of Star Wars, I didn’t see them do it openly.
If only it had been…..
I was thinking the other day about how in Back to the Future, the difference between 1955-1985 was DRAMATIC. But now, is the difference between 1985-2015 that drastic? Not really.What does this have to do with your point? Because nothing ever ends. The 80s brought into the mainstream home video. Things began to be preserved. So it wasn’t just like, I watched Transformers when I was a kid and then I didn’t. I could rewatch. Things stopped ending. Things became readily available and accessible. It makes things blurrier.
On the one hand, the statement that the changes between 1985-2015 aren’t drastic is ludicrous.
The idea that in 1985, I’d carry in my pocket a device 100,000 times more powerful than my TRS-80 computer with my cassette tape games, was unfathomable. And that, by 2020, almost every book, song, play or word ever published could be found or purchased?
On the other hand, what you say has merit. But it’s because of the same thing. The Internet shrank us all. We were no longer alone. And that gave us power to DEMAND nostalgia. There’s a fookin’ Back to the Future Musical now. Hell, there’s nostalgia for shit I was too old to enjoy the first time (Chip’N Dale’s Rescue Rangers)
One of my fondest Internet memories is this:
When I first saw Empire Strikes Back in the theater, I saw a version where, when Lando goes up to get Luke when he’s dangling off the doohickey antenna, he actually goes out on the Falcon, grabs Luke and says, “I got you, kid.”
Now, in every version you see, it goes from Lando putting his safety harness on some support in the Falcon, cutting to Leia asking him if he’s got Luke and then cutting to Luke and Lando being lowered back in. I couldn’t believe I was wrong.But then I put it out on the Internet once and instantly heard from people who saw the same thing! It was fucking beautiful man.
I get what you’re saying in the first bit. There have been seismic shifts. We’ll disagree. I think 85-2015 look a hell of a lot more similar than 55-85. I love the comment of “the internet shrank us.” Great way too look at it. “to DEMAND nostalgia.” To your final point:wait, they CHANGED THAT SCENE? That’s all I remember. Lando coming out up the top hatch of the Falcon to grab Luke and say “I got you, kid.” What the hel????
Go find it. Hand to God. They changed it.
i wonder if it was with the initial special editions or a later cut. why? for “safety?”
On Reddit, I just saw a comment by someone who said they never noticed Lando pausing to make sure Luke was Ok when Luke wandered up to the cockpit. Fuck, what is even reality?
man, now my brain is totally confused. am i just berenstain-ing this? DID I see Lando put his arms around Luke above the ship? Was it just Luke dropping down? I vividly remember him saying “I got you kid” but is this mandela effect? I can’t find the OG scene!
Same memory. I was a white Air Force brat in New England. Lando was the coolest man I’d ever seen and I hung on his every word.And what great shorthand for, “He’s OK” than to have him treat Luke the same way Han does?
Ok, so I’ve had the OG movies on my computer for several years now, I scrounged them up as a torrent many years ago. I checked the scene in question and… there is not “I got you kid”. Looks just like the scene Bob posted minus a few shots of Empire ships flying around.
https://www.google.com/search?sca_esv=954b93ba754f5c0c&rlz=1C1GCEA_enUS874US874&q=empire+strikes+back+lando+rescues+luke&tbm=vid&source=lnms&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiA3eOd2uWEAxUHkokEHerOCQcQ0pQJegQIDBAB&biw=1920&bih=919&dpr=1#fpstate=ive&vld=cid:99076b85,vid:cVzlBMjQYJ0,st:0
Fun fact: more time has now passed between Tim Burton’s first Batman movie and now than between the Adam West TV show and Batman ‘89. To your point about time blurriness, it sure doesn’t feel like it.
jesus christ… really, it doesn’t feel like that much time has passed *at all*
i would think that the preservation would have had the opposite effect. the original is there to be re-watched ad nauseum; why the heck would i want to watch a ‘new’ and ‘updated’ version?
Oh man, were you around for the Star Wars VHS remasters, which led to the Special Editions?Cause damn, man, people went apeshit for those. There were complaints, and eventually bigger complaints (like Lucas saying the Special Editions were THE definitive editions, going forward – as in those would be released, not the OG cuts), but at the time? Damn.
The THX remasters with the awesome box art, hell yeah. Everything being repackaged, rebooted, and resold.
i was technically around (as in alive) but not into star wars.
i don’t mind remasters, as most of us of a certain age have had the experience of buying our music as record, cassette (possibly 8-track), cd, remastered cd, mp3 and ‘vinyl.’
i guess i was thinking more of reboots or remakes, my bad. i don’t need to see a new version of ‘adventures in babysitting;’ the original was just fine, homophobia and all.
I think you’re only saying that because you (presumably) didn’t live through 1955-1985, but did live through 1985-2015. People were still listening to Elvis in ‘85, and old TV shows were rerun ad nauseum. Reagan was bringing back the 50’s morality trying to roll back all the hippie progress. Nothing ended then either. It’s just easier to see it now
Well put.
All that made me think of is how the minute Robert Zemeckis and Bob Gale are dead, a BTTF remake will be greenlit before (whichever one dies last)‘s body is in the ground.
“But now, is the difference between 1985-2015 that drastic? Not really.”This is one of the dumber statements I have read in quite a while. You had to have given it literally zero thought in order to make a claim this asinine.
Dramatic for us at the time, but when my nephews watched this movie, I finally asked them the long-awaited question of whether they could even describe a difference between 1985 and 1955. Except for the parents being obviously younger, they could not.
This is weird to say but I read this comment a couple days ago, didn’t think to reply, then spent the afternoon thinking of the myriad ways 1985 and 2015 are different. TVCR said so, but I think the lack of perceived difference has a lot to do with (presumably) having gone through the last 30 years as a continuous lived experience rather than 1985 (couple years before I was around) and 1955 being distinct, past eras with clear signifiers.I’ve been throwing odd thoughts into a bullet pointed list, and here they are. Now, I was thinking of the 30-year gap and thinking of 1994 vs. 2024. Regardless, most of the differences I thought of still apply:2024 Marty would be stymied by the utter lack of touch screens.nobody had a phone in their pocket.if you took a picture you’d have to take the roll to get developed, a process which many businesses boasted they could complete within an hour.Marty would have to rely on maps and verbal directions to get around.Cable channels are niche, Fox is barely breaking the three-channel dominance of CBS/NBC/ABC. Video on demand is pricey, ordered through a cable provider, and mainly reserved for sporting events.“Did you see ____ last night?” was a normal conversation starter.You’d have to buy a cd or tape to hear a song, or wait for it to come on the radio. If so bold, you would call the station and ask a person to play it for you.If you want to buy something you go to the store. Maybe you order it from a catalogue and wait 4 to 6 weeks for fulfillment. Shopping involved hoping the store carried what you need; maybe you’d call ahead to see if something was in stock.Marty would always forget to carry cash; many stores would still refuse credit/debit cards and people would pay for groceries with a check.A latte would be considered an exotic coffee order; Starbucks is barely a chain yet.Energy drinks don’t exist.The organic food movement doesn’t exist; vegetarian “health food” is bland and mostly relies on tofu as a protein. Substitutions are fewer. “What the hell is ‘soy’ milk?”Madonna is still relevant and her act/image is provocative in a way 2024 Marty would yawn at.Rap is still ascending as a genre, as is electronic musicDonald Trump isn’t even a reality tv star.“Reality tv” doesn’t exist as a term, and hasn’t been brought into its current form by shows like Survivor or The Bachelor.Every sitcom has a laugh track.The internet is slower and websites are far cruder; nobody had a dedicated line in their home.Food is far more regional, and international cuisine is thought of as quirky and exotic.Photoshopping, image manipulation, and computer generated graphics are primitive compared to today; you could trick someone in 1994 or 1985 with a deepfake.Rechargable devices: almost everything either used disposable batteries or had to be plugged in.Though more regulated than the 40s/50s, smoking indoors was still permissible.The taxi industry hadn’t been gutted by rideshare apps.Apple computers and products were niche and very much in the shadow of Windows/Microsoft.Not to mention all the year-specific events and details which would color the era/environment and contrast the years. Plus, I’d argue BTTF works so well because once we get past the initial “things are so different!” time-travel shock and Marty finds Doc, the story is less focused on “how are these eras different?” than the concerns of Marty getting his parents together and getting back home, as well as making the contrast more about how the people in Marty’s life and hometown changed over 30 years and how he influences them to change.
As far as I can tell, that’s a general trait of humanity. Hercules, for example, didn’t spring fully formed having already accomplished his 12 labors, that shit was made up over the course of decades or centuries.
Yeah, but Harry Potter DID end, though. All we’ve gotten since then are a bunch of terrible prequels. Which makes the whole thing even more pathetic. It doesn’t even have a *narrative* reason to keep going.
Well, there’s one sequel, Harry Potter and the Cursed Child, which most people hate as far as I’m aware.
But anyway I didn’t mean end as in end the story, I mean end as in going away, fading into the background. Take Star Wars for example. There were 16 years between Return of the Jedi and Phantom Menace. And sure, there were things like novels for the diehards, but nothing like a movie. A lot of people kinda just… stopped being into SW for a while (I don’t wanna say “grew up” because that sounds rude and reductive). Nowadays, Star Wars never ends, we get announcements of new shows and movies all the time in addition to comics, and we know there are more sequels on the way. Like I said, there are countless examples, and these days the time between adaptations/new sequels to keep a franchise going is shorter and shorter.
are unable to let go is because nothing ever ENDS anymore.Eeeeeeerrrhmmmmmm…Tell that to Fantastic Beasts. 🙂
My question would be to her and anyone with that opinion: are there any children’s stories you heard as a child that still resonate with you, taught you a lesson, or that you still feel fondly about?
I think perhaps people deride adults like “children’s” entertainments is because they view it as regressive and incapable of acting maturely. And while that surely happens to some degree, I think it suggests that value and meaning can only ever be derived from entertainment that’s somehow only appropriate for your age group. Which is absurd.
How often to adults point to the lessons of Mr. Rogers? How often do we praise Reading Rainbow or the lessons on Sesame Street? You glean from and enjoy what you enjoy. As long as it’s not making you a menace to society, you’re good.
One could reasonably argue there are fewer lessons to be gleaned from Harry Potter (an adventure story about a rich kid at boarding school) than Mr. Rogers, Reading Rainbow, or Sesame Street (all very specifically didactic programs expressly engineered to empart lessons).
I’ve never read the books or watched the movies but I was under the impression that Harry Potter lived in a closet under some stairs. Doesn’t sound rich.
…do you think he spends the entire seven-book series under those stairs?he starts out living under his aunt + uncle’s stairs, then learns in the first book his parents left him an infinite inheritance and legacy enrollment in a prestigious wizarding school.
No, I have not thought about the possible the changing circumstances of a character in a work I have no interest in. Sounds like leaving him poor and making him use magic to get money without getting found out would have been more interesting.
“I have no knowledge of this subject, no interest in learning more about it, but felt the urge to express something about it based on my assumptions,” that’s a very online sentiment right there.
If that was the exchange that occured you’d be right. But I asked about something that seemed different from what I understood to be the case and got an answer. I’m not sure how that turns into whatever you’re describing. Must be some sort of very online sentiment, being upset that someone didn’t know something. Or whatever is happening with you. You’d know better than me why you act the way you do, hopefully.
You obviously haven’t checked out real estate prices in Brooklyn lately.
renting a closet under some stairs these days is a luxury that few can afford
I mean, I’d think Mr. Rogers and Sesame Street-theme weddings would be weird too.I don’t think there’s anything wrong with having a fondness for something one enjoyed as a kid or recognizing its impact on your values or ways of thinking, but carrying on about it well into adulthood the way HP fans do strikes me as going beyond fondness.
A Mr. Rogers themed wedding… everyone comes in, changes their shoes and picks out a new cardigan? Which puppet would conduct the ceremony? “I meow pronounce you husband and wife meow meow”
Not much from my childhood I think I’d want to form the bulk of my online personality around. Can’t really think of anything.
I mean, I think this is a good point, in theory, but you’ve used lousy examples. It’s one thing to find interesting things to talk about in C.S. Lewis’s books, for example. I can imagine an adult getting something valuable out of those. But I’m not sure that too many psychologically normal adults would get too much out of watching the average Sesame Street or Mr. Rogers episode. We have fond memories of those shows, and we remember, vaguely, the values they taught us. But I don’t know how many adults without kids watch Mr. Rogers episodes on a regular basis. These are different sorts of things.
I always get the impression that people who are snarky about Harry Potter reading adults is that they think these people don’t read anything else. My wife has read the HP books more than once but also reads more and also more broadly than probably 99% of the people in the world. She’s not a “Potter-head” or anything, but sometimes an easy, comfortable read or a mindless watch of a movie on tv is what one wants to pass the time for a bit.
Do you know adults who re-watch episodes of Mr Rogers in their 30s (without their own children present)?Same with Sesame Street?
fans of sesame street or mr rogers don’t run around dressed like big bird in red cardigan sweaters though; they took the wisdom and lessons of the media cherished to them as children and moved on lmao
I studied at a school in France for a number of years and was surprised to learn that according to conventional French opinion nearly ALL of English literature (including Dickens but excluding Shakespeare) is for children. Seriously, in France the idea that all 19thc English literature is for teenagers at best is seen as too obviously true to even be considered an “opinion” it is more like an observation akin to “peacocks have larger tails than most birds that can fly.”
Miriam Margolyes is a icon and should be on every talkshow
I loved Harry Potter growing up, but JKR being a TERF has killed a lot of the love/nostalgia of that series for me.
I do, however, appreciate that HP works as a jumping-in point to then read other fantasy books. Outsiders to the genre initially think, “oh, fantasy books are too nerdy, they’re full of incomprehensible worldbuilding and jargon, they’re for people with no lives & no friends,” but HP is mainstream and outsider-friendly enough to eventually ease people into other, better books specifically aimed at adults.
Oh shut up you old hag.
Sorry, not replying to you, that was the only option I saw to comment. Anyway, I recently reread the series at 34 after years of haven’t read them. I used to read them all the time as a kid. I had it a little hard at home, so it was always somewhat relateable to me. Nothing wrong with revisiting old childhood nostalgia. The series is therapeutic for me and I don’t have to think of adult things for a bit. Same if I watch a Disney cartoon or something. It’s a small mental mini vacation from adulthood. Just because you grow up, doesn’t mean you have to throw out your whole childhood. It’s okay to be child at heart. But the overobsessiveness gets old. If you enjoy great. If not great. If you still like the author great. If you don’t like the author great. I don’t have the mental capacity for it all. Everyone just needs to chill out. Quit making these things your personality. You’re missing out on other things that you might like.
The whole point of the article is “don’t make this stuff your personality as an adult”.
Very well put. I re-read the books last year also. Still enjoyed them but I’m always on the look out for new books, TV shows, and movies to consume.
None of us ever really grow up; but we tend to ruminate about our own pasts, not one created for a fictional wizard. But the the childhoods of most Mills were infused with marketing campaigns, dull Disney and way too much stuff (now in landfills). Nearly every Mill I know is grumpy and bitter over not getting every little thing they deserved (and they don’t seem to have much in the way of imagination), so let them have their illusiory-by-association childhoods again.
Horrible thing to say..
Ok, boome
I like it firm and fruity!
WAHEYYY!
Counterpoint: The Muppets.
That was made to be a show that adults could watch, too, though.
So were at least the later HP movies, well some of them anyway.
It’s not fit for kids, either.
about half of YA fiction is adult readers. leftists: read a different fucking book. in particular, animal fucking farm.
Says the asshole who can’t deal with basic reality or word use.
How about you read some different books and get a fucking clue?
the last books i’ve read were the Cancellation of the American Mind, which brutally crushes academia, written by arch liberals, and When Race Trumps Merit: How the Pursuit of Equity Sacrifices Excellence, Destroys Beauty, and Threatens Lives, written by a conservative (!), which absolutory annihilates DEI, from it’s most malevolent form of fucking with people’s very lives through changing standards for med school, to it’s cultural rot of leading the fucking MET to launch exhibits into conspiracy theories about how Egypt was fucking black and Africa was once a super hidden super power. No, i’m not making this up.perhaps you should set down the 8-sided die long enough to read something about current events, stalker loser elf cunt?
And yet here you are, still a fucking moron. Propaganda will do that to you. But you do love to feed your victim narrative.
I read plenty about current events, that’s why I’m schooling you on the fucking facts and you are losing your mind that the dictionary doesn’t support your bullshit of trying to invent what words mean.Liberalism is defined by sources other than you or me. Someone’s words or positions either conform to that definition or they do not. You want to add exceptions to the definition and make it different for some undefined period of time. Without a source, that’s just your retarded opinion. You have to prove your context is relevant with a source. You can’t because it is not relevant and everything in the universe grasps that but you.It makes no sense to say a PREVIOUSLY segregated society changed the definition liberal when it was invented during a far more segregated and racist time period. In order to be logically consistent you have to admit that either King isn’t liberal or the CRT proponents you vilify as illiberal are just as liberal as he is for having the same views.You are still a pussy in denial. Redlining is explicitly racist and happening now. That is systematic racism. That’s in addition to the previous science you had a meltdown over after you bothered to pay attention to the proof YOU put forth and realized it all said you were wrong.science > youYou are a pathetic fucking joke and ridiculously out of gas.
yes, heavily-vetted and thoroughly sourced accounts of actual events that were witnessed in the real world will and written by people across the political spectrum will “do that to you”, if by “do that for you” YOU MEAN BOLSTER YOUR CASE WITH IRONCLAD FUCKING PROOF.redlining is not a standard feature of our financial system. sorry. that’s your own victim narrative.i’ve already explained dozens of times how you can only argue your bollocks if you ignore context, and no thinking person would ever ignore context, you fucking sea anemone. eat shit, kill yourself, get a fucking life.
I’m not impressed by your conservative circle jerk of people who are as retarded as you. But I’m not surprised your life is consumed with reading propaganda that feeds your victim narrative.
And I’ve explained several times the FACT that your context doesn’t fucking matter in the slightest. Liberalism is defined by sources other than you or me. Someone’s words or positions either conform to that definition or they do not. You want to add exceptions to the definition and make it different for some undefined period of time. Without a source, that’s just your retarded opinion. You have to prove your context is relevant with a source. You can’t because it is not relevant and everything in the universe grasps that but you.It makes no sense to say a PREVIOUSLY segregated society changed the definition liberal when it was invented during a far more segregated and racist time period. In order to be logically consistent you have to admit that either King isn’t liberal or the CRT proponents you vilify as illiberal are just as liberal as he is for having the same views.You are still a pussy in denial. Redlining is explicitly racist and happening now. That is systematic racism. That’s in addition to the previous science you had a meltdown over after you bothered to pay attention to the proof YOU put forth and realized it all said you were wrong.science > youYou are a tyrannt, a bigot, and a pathetic fucking joke.
contempt of sources prior to investigation is prejudice and naked ignorance.only an absolute dullard would suggest context doesn’t matter to language. it is the defining factor about…anything. it’s shockingly, appalling stupid to jettison context, and yet the only way your argument works, so you appallingly, shockingly jettison context. as do all progressives.the progressive destruction of context is just one more corpse for the fire, but one that has cost people their jobs. microaggressions ignore context. people have been fired because their oppressors purposefully ignore their context to cheat. a professor was fired for saying a chinese word that sounded like “nigga.” he was teaching a class on the chinese language, for fuck’s sake. only by ignoring this context could this—and your—stupidity continue. we learn this in grade school.keep copying and pasting and maybe redlining will make a comeback, faggot elf landwhale.
“only an absolute dullard would suggest context doesn’t matter to language”
STRAWMAN. So pathetic you keep doing this. I’m saying the SPECIFIC context you are claiming matters, does not. You don’t get to declare words mean whatever you want.
Liberalism is defined by sources other than you or me. Someone’s words or positions either conform to that definition or they do not. You want to add exceptions to the definition and make it different for some undefined period of time. Without a source, that’s just your retarded opinion. You have to prove your context is relevant with a source. You can’t because it is not relevant and everything in the universe grasps that but you.It makes no sense to say a PREVIOUSLY segregated society changed the definition liberal when it was invented during a far more segregated and racist time period. In order to be logically consistent you have to admit that either King isn’t liberal or the CRT proponents you vilify as illiberal are just as liberal as he is for having the same views.You are still a pussy in denial. Redlining is explicitly racist and happening now. That is systematic racism. That’s in addition to the previous science you had a meltdown over after you bothered to pay attention to the proof YOU put forth and realized it all said you were wrong.science > youYou are a tyrannt, a bigot, and a pathetic fucking joke.
YOU; “And I’ve explained several times the FACT that your context doesn’t fucking matter in the slightest.”so not a fucking strawman, you totally dismiss context, purposefully, like a fucking imbecile. NOTHING MEANS ANTYTHING WITHOUT CONTEXT. KING’S MEANING MAKES NO FUCKING SENSE WITHOUT CONTEXT.you’re pond scum. kill yourself. get a life.
How are you this retarded? That is not a quote of me saying context doesn’t matter in language, that is me saying YOUR context, the SPECIFIC CONTEXT YOU ARE CLAIMING MATTERS does not matter.
So yes, very much a strawman.
Liberalism is defined by sources other than you or me. Someone’s words or positions either conform to that definition or they do not. You want to add exceptions to the definition and make it different for some undefined period of time. Without a source, that’s just your retarded opinion. You have to prove your context is relevant with a source. You can’t because it is not relevant and everything in the universe grasps that but you.It makes no sense to say a PREVIOUSLY segregated society changed the definition liberal when it was invented during a far more segregated and racist time period. In order to be logically consistent you have to admit that either King isn’t liberal or the CRT proponents you vilify as illiberal are just as liberal as he is for having the same views.You are still a pussy in denial. Redlining is explicitly racist and happening now. That is systematic racism. That’s in addition to the previous science you had a meltdown over after you bothered to pay attention to the proof YOU put forth and realized it all said you were wrong.science > youYou are a tyrant, a bigot, and a pathetic fucking joke.
the context king was living in make his statements valid and liberal. sorry. they just fucking do. he was calling out a dominant group on their behavior and fighting for individual rights.soc jus advocates argue that racism has never been worse in a society that has never been better. they are tilting at fucking windmills, you fucking lunatic. in today’s CONTEXT, does it make sense to call white people fucking colonizers and spirit murderers…as we do everything possible, both legal and illegal—to promote poc? no. no it fucking doesn’t.context is king. you are a cunt. eat shit and die.
“the context king was living in make his statements valid and liberal.”
That something is valid is your opinion. That it was liberal is factually incorrect. Sorry, that’s just fucking reality.
“he was calling out a dominant group on their behavior”
No, he wasn’t. He was judging people based on immutable characteristics. He was calling for special treatment for people based on race. This is what YOU said about the same statements made by others. That is the reality, learn to cope.
Liberalism is defined by sources other than you or me. Someone’s words or positions either conform to that definition or they do not. You want to add exceptions to the definition and make it different for some undefined period of time. Without a source, that’s just your retarded opinion. You have to prove your context is relevant with a source. You can’t because it is not relevant and everything in the universe grasps that but you.It makes no sense to say a PREVIOUSLY segregated society changed the definition liberal when it was invented during a far more segregated and racist time period. In order to be logically consistent you have to admit that either King isn’t liberal or the CRT proponents you vilify as illiberal are just as liberal as he is for having the same views.You are still a pussy in denial. Redlining is explicitly racist and happening now. That is systematic racism. That’s in addition to the previous science you had a meltdown over after you bothered to pay attention to the proof YOU put forth and realized it all said you were wrong.science > youYou are a tyrant, a bigot, and a pathetic fucking joke.
you are beyond hope, help, reason, and sanity to say king wasn’t talking about a segregated, racist society’s actions. this is not my fucking opinion. it’s basic history. it’s the reason he spoke, the reason he advocated what he did, the reason for his victory, and the catalyst of change. documented, studied, taught in fucking grade school, along with the concept of context. famously documented and taught, along with his demand for colorblindness. suck my bollocks.if society wasn’t racist and segregated, he’d have been elsewhere, doing drastically different things, or he’d be viewed as a fucking crackeed crank, going off about non-existent problems.crts call white people colonizers TODAY. about the last fucking thing they colonized was the fucking Falkland islands. they judge a non-racist society as racist, a non-racist people as racist, over debunked horsebollocks like microaggressions and implicit bias. that’s the best they can do. they are actually racist, actually Marxist, and actually cracked cranks who are increasingly being viewed as such, such as the John Hopkins DEI head who resigned in disgrace after calling all white people racist and privileged.redlining is not a socially accepted reality, you fucking freak. to call an entire financial system which only cares about credit scores systematically racist—like, meaning, you know, the whole system is racist—based on some bad apples who will be destroyed is retarded.keep copying and pasting. maybe it will make your bullshit true if you post them long enough, you stalker loser landwhale twat and irrelevant cunt.get a fucking life
Says the guy who can’t accept reality. If King was talking about a segregated society (even though it wasn’t) then SO WAS JON STEWART WHEN HE SAID THE SAME THING. But you said it was BLOOD LIBEL and JUDGING PEOPLE BASED ON IMUTABLE CHARECTERISTICS.
None of that changes the FACT of what liberal means. Liberalism is defined by sources other than you or me. Someone’s words or positions either conform to that definition or they do not. You want to add exceptions to the definition and make it different for some undefined period of time. Without a source, that’s just your retarded opinion. You have to prove your context is relevant with a source. You can’t because it is not relevant and everything in the universe grasps that but you.It makes no sense to say a PREVIOUSLY segregated society changed the definition liberal when it was invented during a far more segregated and racist time period. In order to be logically consistent you have to admit that either King isn’t liberal or the CRT proponents you vilify as illiberal are just as liberal as he is for having the same views.You are still a pussy in denial. Redlining is explicitly racist and happening now. That is systematic racism. That’s in addition to the previous science you had a meltdown over after you bothered to pay attention to the proof YOU put forth and realized it all said you were wrong.science > youYou are a tyrant, a bigot, and a pathetic fucking joke.
jon stewart was talking about a segregated society??? what are you on about? he flashed debunked and distorted stats about the modern day before equating white comfort with black death. again, you conflate the past and the present for no fucking reason. they were different words.systemic racism definition: defined as policies and practices that exist throughout a whole society or organization that result in and support a continued unfair advantage to some people and unfair or harmful treatment of others based on race or ethnic group.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Institutional_racismhuh. throughout a whole society or organization, not just part of one one part of a part as you’re claiming with redlining. by definition, you are wrong, and we know you shove definitions up your twat for fun.i’m super impressed by all your friends and shit. that totally makes sense since you are online 24/7. at best, all your fun as shit activities are continually interrupted by you staring at you fucking phone.kill yourself.
They were both talking about ALL white people. They both judged people by immutable characteristics. You made clear that is illiberal. IT still doesn’t matter if they were different worlds, that is still NEVER going be how liberal is defined.
Current redlining meets that definition AND the ones I’ve already given you. Many organization were sued for redlining. But you don’t understand definition and can’t deal with reality. Your idea that is has to be legal or accepted is NOT correct. It is happening , that is systematic racism.
I’m not online 24/7 but keep being retarded!Liberalism is defined by sources other than you or me. Someone’s words or positions either conform to that definition or they do not. You want to add exceptions to the definition and make it different for some undefined period of time. Without a source, that’s just your retarded opinion. You have to prove your context is relevant with a source. You can’t because it is not relevant and everything in the universe grasps that but you.It makes no sense to say a PREVIOUSLY segregated society changed the definition liberal when it was invented during a far more segregated and racist time period. In order to be logically consistent you have to admit that either King isn’t liberal or the CRT proponents you vilify as illiberal are just as liberal as he is for having the same views.You are still a pussy in denial. Redlining is explicitly racist and happening now. That is systematic racism. That’s in addition to the previous science you had a meltdown over after you bothered to pay attention to the proof YOU put forth and realized it all said you were wrong.science > youYou are a tyrant, a bigot, and a pathetic fucking joke.
you’re purposefully ignoring the context, which i’ve provided, for crt, which is decidedly anti-liberal, viewed the civil rights movement as a symbolic victory, and believes in such debunked horseshit as the IAT, implicit bias influencing behavior, microaggression, “spirit murder”, viewing whites as uniquely violence (paging homicide rates for young black men), conflating the colonial age with modern America, etc., etc., etc. We are talking about a fundamentally different worldview than king’s, including calling colorblindness racism and demanding the destruction of fucking Western Civilization. i’ve documented all of this, and you know it.king was a liberal, fighting for individual rights, and judging a racist society as such, while still calling for colorblind INDIVIDUALISM.stewart is a old fucking progressive crt crank, fighting fucking windmills with distorted, debunked stats and blood libelous statements such as modern day whites “putting their comfort over black lives”, which is ridiculous, racist, COLLECTIVIST bollocks. he doesn’t even know where the shit he spews comes from, for example, attacking a moronic senator by claiming that gun deaths are the number one killer of children…using a study that including 18 and 19-year-olds in the study, the prime murder victims range for blacks, hopeless spiking the stats and making them useless except for the most craven political purposes.if you can’t tell them apart, i suggest your body fat has gained foothold in your synapses, mrs. popularity, who brags about her busy social life while being online 24/7.get a fucking life.
I understand perfectly that the specific context you keep mewling about is irrelevant to defining what is or is not liberal. What matters is what people say and the views they hold and those are the same.
King was fighting for special treatment for blacks. Keep pretending that isn’t real you ahistorical twat.
King and Stewart both talked about “white people”. If it’s racist blood libel judging people by immutable characteristics for one, it’s that for the other.Liberalism is defined by sources other than you or me. Someone’s words or positions either conform to that definition or they do not. You want to add exceptions to the definition and make it different for some undefined period of time. Without a source, that’s just your retarded opinion. You have to prove your context is relevant with a source. You can’t because it is not relevant and everything in the universe grasps that but you.It makes no sense to say a PREVIOUSLY segregated society changed the definition liberal when it was invented during a far more segregated and racist time period. In order to be logically consistent you have to admit that either King isn’t liberal or the CRT proponents you vilify as illiberal are just as liberal as he is for having the same views.You are still a pussy in denial. Redlining is explicitly racist and happening now. That is systematic racism. That’s in addition to the previous science you had a meltdown over after you bothered to pay attention to the proof YOU put forth and realized it all said you were wrong.science > youYou are a tyrant, a bigot, and a pathetic fucking joke.
And seriously, who between us needs a life? I have friends and fun hobbies you try and make fun of me for because you are a jealous loser that no one likes and spends his time on websites he doesn’t even like just to be hateful to people.Your entire fucking life revolves around being a victim! You were a victim at work, your a victim of DEI, progressives are racist against you, it’s all the books you read. It’s YOUR WHOLE FUCKING LIFE. It’s so all consuming that you seek out multiple websites devoted to topics you hate just to troll. No one who feels the need to go to places they dislike to be an asshole is mentally well or having a good life. And no one who throws around racial and homophobic slurs like you do isn’t a bigot.
um, generally if you have to brag to strangers on the internet about how great your fun activity full life is while showing signs of obvious internet/smart phone addiction, you are a liar and an addict. congrats. my life is very full, thank you very much.and you again fail the context test. i can’t believe an adult would stalk someone for weeks and weeks demanding that context is irrelevant to language. it is vital. it is what defines meaning. in all contexts. we learn this in grade school.seriously, you cannot tell the difference between the CONTEXT of king calling out a racist society full of racist majority members and segregation, and jon fucking stewart talking about “spirit murder” of black people, said black people being in university, because they are the only dim bulbs who talk about this shit, against a backdrop of a black middle class growth.for real, forever, fuck off and get a fucking life. put down the smartphone and enjoy all your Canadian friends and D&D homies. fucking twat stalker landwhale.
LOL I was pointing out how stupid it is for you to tell me to get a life when I already have one better than yours. You are the one failing the context test because you can’t show the specific context you are claiming is relevent is actualy relevent. Which is why you keep lying and acting like I’m saying context isn’t relevent to language, if you were honest about what I was saying you’d have to admit no sources support your claim. Jon Stwerat and King both talking about “white people”. That is either racist blood libel judging people by imutable charateristics or it isn’t. It doesn’t matter who said it, only WHAT WAS SAID. Liberalism is defined by sources other than you or me. Someone’s words or positions either conform to that definition or they do not. You want to add exceptions to the definition and make it different for some undefined period of time. Without a source, that’s just your retarded opinion. You have to prove your context is relevant with a source. You can’t because it is not relevant and everything in the universe grasps that but you.It makes no sense to say a PREVIOUSLY segregated society changed the definition liberal when it was invented during a far more segregated and racist time period. In order to be logically consistent you have to admit that either King isn’t liberal or the CRT proponents you vilify as illiberal are just as liberal as he is for having the same views.You are still a pussy in denial. Redlining is explicitly racist and happening now. That is systematic racism. That’s in addition to the previous science you had a meltdown over after you bothered to pay attention to the proof YOU put forth and realized it all said you were wrong.science > youYou are a tyrant, a bigot, and a pathetic fucking joke.
And seriously, who between us needs a life? I have friends and fun hobbies you try and make fun of me for because you are a jealous loser that no one likes and spends his time on websites he doesn’t even like just to be hateful to people.Your entire fucking life revolves around being a victim! You were a victim at work, your a victim of DEI, progressives are racist against you, it’s all the books you read. It’s YOUR WHOLE FUCKING LIFE. It’s so all consuming that you seek out multiple websites devoted to topics you hate just to troll. No one who feels the need to go to places they dislike to be an asshole is mentally well or having a good life. And no one who throws around racial and homophobic slurs like you do isn’t a bigot.
you. are. an. internet. addict. no matter when i post, you respond, night or day. whatever friends and awesome life you have come second to your addiction. so…there’s that.posting on a message board with my thumb does not indicate a lack of life. and i’ve only expressed being wronged by these people…because i’ve been wronged by these people. that hardly makes it my entire personality, you iphone-addict-no-context-having-motherfucker.systemic racism means it applies to the whole system. full stop. redlining is not a factor in the entire system. drop it, loser-Canadian-imaginary-friends-having cunt.and again, only a fucking retard would disregard context. the context literally gives language its meaning.hang yourself.
Your an imaginative dinosaur telling yourself stories to feel better about being a loser. Making shit up is your jam.
“posting on a message board with my thumb does not indicate a lack of life”
And yet, here you are thinking it about me while you spend your days trolling. Because you are mired in a sad victim mentality. You can’t stand other people being happy!Your entire fucking life revolves around being a victim! You were a victim at work, your a victim of DEI, progressives are racist against you, it’s all the books you read. It’s YOUR WHOLE FUCKING LIFE. It’s so all consuming that you seek out multiple websites devoted to topics you hate just to troll. No one who feels the need to go to places they dislike to be an asshole is mentally well or having a good life. And no one who throws around racial and homophobic slurs like you do isn’t a bigot.
“systemic racism means it applies to the whole system”
Literally not what your definition said! “or organization” remember? Foiled by your own dictionary again! Redlining is explicitly racist and happening now. That is systematic racism. That’s in addition to the previous science you had a meltdown over after you bothered to pay attention to the proof YOU put forth and realized it all said you were wrong.science > youYou are a tyrant, a bigot, and a pathetic fucking joke.
I don’t disregard context you can prove is real, only retards accept things dipshits like you make up! Which is again, the specific context you are claiming and not the basic concept that context matters to language! Liberalism is defined by sources other than you or me. Someone’s words or positions either conform to that definition or they do not. You want to add exceptions to the definition and make it different for some undefined period of time. Without a source, that’s just your retarded opinion. You have to prove your context is relevant with a source. You can’t because it is not relevant and everything in the universe grasps that but you.It makes no sense to say a PREVIOUSLY segregated society changed the definition liberal when it was invented during a far more segregated and racist time period. In order to be logically consistent you have to admit that either King isn’t liberal or the CRT proponents you vilify as illiberal are just as liberal as he is for having the same views.
bitch, you are utterly obsessed with me and push nothing but victimhood bullshit. i mentioned i was affected by this shit a couple of times months ago. since then i’ve been arguing with you about the importance of context and understanding the differences between liberalism and crt, which you ignore to make disingenuous, retarded arguments. you just replied to me within seconds of my posting. you have no life.again, AGAIN: CONTEXT IS THE MOST IMPORTANT PART OF LANGUAGE. to ignore it is madness, or the sign of a chronic fucking liar cough cough progressives cough.
redlining is a fucking red herring. it is not accepted or practiced on a systemic manner.get a fucking life.
I push nothing but victim narrative because I accept science from multiple avenues demonstrating that systematic racism isn’t zero? LOLOOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL
Your whole identity revolves around hunting for progressives to shit on. ON a website YOU DON”T EVEN LKE. I ran into you in a place I go because I like the topics. You seek out people you hate in places you hate. If you never post here again, I’ll never think of you again,. You’ll still be out with other accounts looking to troll.
CONTEXT IS THE MOST IMPORTANT PART OF LANGUAGE. to ignore it is madness, or the sign of a chronic fucking liar Chronic lying you say? Like someone who is saying I disregard the entire concept that context matters when I’m actually saying it’s the specific context they are claiming that is bullshit? That kind of chronic lying?Liberalism is defined by sources other than you or me. Someone’s words or positions either conform to that definition or they do not. You want to add exceptions to the definition and make it different for some undefined period of time. Without a source, that’s just your retarded opinion. You have to prove your context is relevant with a source. You can’t because it is not relevant and everything in the universe grasps that but you.It makes no sense to say a PREVIOUSLY segregated society changed the definition liberal when it was invented during a far more segregated and racist time period. In order to be logically consistent you have to admit that either King isn’t liberal or the CRT proponents you vilify as illiberal are just as liberal as he is for having the same views.You are still a pussy in denial. Redlining is explicitly racist and happening now. That is systematic racism. That’s in addition to the previous science you had a meltdown over after you bothered to pay attention to the proof YOU put forth and realized it all said you were wrong.
“ it is not accepted or practiced on a systemic manner.”
IT MET YOUR DEFINTION!!!!!!science > youYou are a tyrant, a bigot, and a pathetic fucking joke.
i’ve been on this website for fucking years. a decade or more. and i watched as the staff was whittled down to the current crop of sjws who say shit like Dave Chappelle endangers people’s lives. this place used to be beautiful, but like every other media space, it was slowly taken over by the soc jus Borg. the rest has been addressed over and over. get a fucking life.
Oh a decade or more but this is your only account that only started commenting 2 months ago. LOL. Yes, I’ sure you have been hate trolling here for quite some time under many accounts.
Liberalism is defined by sources other than you or me. Someone’s words or positions either conform to that definition or they do not. You want to add exceptions to the definition and make it different for some undefined period of time. Without a source, that’s just your retarded opinion. You have to prove your context is relevant with a source. You can’t because it is not relevant and everything in the universe grasps that but you.It makes no sense to say a PREVIOUSLY segregated society changed the definition liberal when it was invented during a far more segregated and racist time period. In order to be logically consistent you have to admit that either King isn’t liberal or the CRT proponents you vilify as illiberal are just as liberal as he is for having the same views.You are still a pussy in denial. Redlining is explicitly racist and happening now. That is systematic racism. That’s in addition to the previous science you had a meltdown over after you bothered to pay attention to the proof YOU put forth and realized it all said you were wrong.science > youYou are a tyrant, a bigot, and a pathetic fucking joke.
And seriously, who between us needs a life? I have friends and fun hobbies you try and make fun of me for because you are a jealous loser that no one likes and spends his time on websites he doesn’t even like just to be hateful to people.Your entire fucking life revolves around being a victim! You were a victim at work, your a victim of DEI, progressives are racist against you, it’s all the books you read. It’s YOUR WHOLE FUCKING LIFE. It’s so all consuming that you seek out multiple websites devoted to topics you hate just to troll. No one who feels the need to go to places they dislike to be an asshole is mentally well or having a good life. And no one who throws around racial and homophobic slurs like you do isn’t a bigot.
yeah, the general consensus even among the commentors here is that the site is a pale impersonation of its former self. i remember the days of The Hater and zero politics. now half the shit on here is soc jus twaddle.and i remember when we didn’t use kinja, but disqus, so yeah, i’ve been around a bit.i said i had been on the receiving end of these policies twice. that’s it. if that’s a victim narrative—to correctly point out how i was affected by these polices exactly twice—what do you call progressives who wallow in victimhood to the point of demanding censorship and fucking bias response teams, etc.? Victimhood aficionados? Victimhood cannibals? Victimhood Nazis? YEAH. THAT’S THE ONE. VICTIMHOOD NAZIS.
please continue to tell me about how great your life is while you clearly are addicted to the internet/smart phone and are a tireless stalker. i totes believe you.
Harry Potter and D%D still have nothing to so with sjw anythings. You never liked the content here, you are just a troll.Your entire fucking life revolves around being a victim! You were a victim at work, your a victim of DEI, progressives are racist against you, it’s all the books you read. It’s YOUR WHOLE FUCKING LIFE. It’s so all consuming that you seek out multiple websites devoted to topics you hate just to troll. No one who feels the need to go to places they dislike to be an asshole is mentally well or having a good life. And no one who throws around racial and homophobic slurs like you do isn’t a bigot.
Please continue to show what a loser you know you are by inventing things about me. It.s what pathetic people do when they have no facts on their side.
and are a tireless stalker.”
Like you tirelessly stalking progressives on websites you hate? LOL GET SOME SELF AWENESS STUPID.Liberalism is defined by sources other than you or me. Someone’s words or positions either conform to that definition or they do not. You want to add exceptions to the definition and make it different for some undefined period of time. Without a source, that’s just your retarded opinion. You have to prove your context is relevant with a source. You can’t because it is not relevant and everything in the universe grasps that but you.It makes no sense to say a PREVIOUSLY segregated society changed the definition liberal when it was invented during a far more segregated and racist time period. In order to be logically consistent you have to admit that either King isn’t liberal or the CRT proponents you vilify as illiberal are just as liberal as he is for having the same views.You are still a pussy in denial. Redlining is explicitly racist and happening now. That is systematic racism. That’s in addition to the previous science you had a meltdown over after you bothered to pay attention to the proof YOU put forth and realized it all said you were wrong.science > youYou are a tyrant, a bigot, and a pathetic fucking joke.
You shit on people for liking things like Harry Potter and D&D, this site was ALWAYS about that stuff and that has NOTHING to do with sjw anythings. You are just a bitter garbage person.
“redlining is not a socially accepted reality, you fucking freak.”
That doesn’t fucking matter, it’s STILL systematic racism.
“to call an entire financial system which only cares about credit scores systematically racist”
STAWMAN. I didn’t call the entire system anything, I said SYTEMATIC RACISM EXISTS IN SOME FORM. Because that’s actually correct.
You are engaging the the black-and-white fallacy again. You can’t say anything without it being a lie or a fallacy.
And seriously, who between us needs a life? I have friends and fun hobbies you try and make fun of me for because you are a jealous loser that no one likes and spends his time on websites he doesn’t even like just to be hateful to people.Your entire fucking life revolves around being a victim! You were a victim at work, your a victim of DEI, progressives are racist against you, it’s all the books you read. It’s YOUR WHOLE FUCKING LIFE. It’s so all consuming that you seek out multiple websites devoted to topics you hate just to troll. No one who feels the need to go to places they dislike to be an asshole is mentally well or having a good life. And no one who throws around racial and homophobic slurs like you do isn’t a bigot.
MAKING SENSE IS STILL A FUCKING OPINION YOU ABSOLUTE TWAT.
maybe redlining will make a comeback
What comeback, it’s happening now stupid.
“redlining is not a standard feature of our financial system”
NEITHER WAS SEGREGATION WHEN KING MAD MANY OF HIS STATEMENTS. OOPS.
So again, you are a hypocrite that things legality maters in one instance, but not another.
Systematic racism doesn’t require anything to be legal or standard. OOPS.
Yeah, that dude is stump-fuckingly dumb.I guess all the galvanized HP fans going after people who don’t like JKR are “leftists.” Totally makes sense.Also, love that the dude name checks Animal Farm, because absolutely all leftism must be arch communism, because these fucking morons haven’t had an original thought in decades. Guess it’s just easier to recycle what their parents and/or Redtube have told them.
The latest account from TheAutomator/vanheat/Leo VanHeat/who knows how many accounts. He has a raging hate hard-on for communism. Not sure why he felt the need to use bigoted slurs against Harry Potter readers in some of his other comments but dudes got issues.
I’m more hung up on the fact that he’s calling out “leftists” for making overblown hay out of what he considers to be minor issues, while doing the same goddamned thing.DEI is having a moment, just like any other sociopolitical trend in history. It is being appraised midstream, from multiple angles, just like any other sociopolitical trend in history. Some of it will be revealed to be beneficial, some of it will be found wanting, some of it will be found to be a haven for various grifters, just like any other sociopolitical trend in history.IDK, I’m more worried about the Christian nationalists trying to seize the reins of control, because their weak asses want it to be easier (on them) to practice their faith/”train up” their children, so they figure they’ll sociopolitically terraform the entire country. To any reasonable person, *that* would be the threat.But no, totally need to rail against trans visibility, queer characters in video games, DEI programs, etc. Clearly.
Major hypocrite, for sure.
You are correct though that Christian nationalists are far more worrisome as is the general fascism on the right.
With an attempted insurrectionist possibly retaking control in November, the wars abroad, and teachers getting fired for reading Anne Frank’s diary, adults shouldn’t be told what they shouldn’t enjoy. Harry Potter is fun escapism where the bad guys are easily identifiable and defeated in the end. In defense of the fans, Harry Potter’s world still feels very underdeveloped. If Rowling could let go of Harry and Dumbledore, there are more stories she could write that would be compelling. I’d like to know where magic came from and how it is kept secret in the age of the internet. I might even read it if she reverses her TERFy viewpoints.
Funko Pop Adults need to let go and grow up.
I don’t think there’s anything wrong per se with an adult enjoying a piece of culture originally intended for children or young adults. I think it becomes an issue when your cultural intake or taste doesn’t broaden as you grow up.Put slightly differently, culture is like food for the soul. As a little kid, you just want to eat pizza and hot dogs and mac & cheese all the time, and you look at grown up food like it’s poison. And you can still enjoy those foods when you get older. But if that’s all you eat as an adult, you’re going to be in bad shape.
She’s right and she should say it
Like the big difference between Harry Potter and the rest of “stories intended for a younger audience repackaged for older fans who refuse to let go of it” is that the author of Harry Potter became the spokesperson for a hate movement. Like Walt Disney was chummy with some prominent Nazis, but he didn’t regularly advertise this fact.I assume for people who are *still* hanging on to the Wizarding World, the hate movement is part of the draw.
I am getting strong Alec Guinness from Star Wars energy.
I think Millenials attachment to Harry Potter is weird , but its basically the same as Gen X and Star Wars (except no body shits on the floor and magics it away in Star Wars.)
no body shits on the floor and magics it away in Star Wars.
That’s quitter talk.
I’ll be honest , Palpatine might have squeezed out a dookie , and forced that into a trash can in ROTS , I never made it that far.
all he had to do was hang his ass over that giant pit he later gets chucked down
Maybe not, but I would not want to be on cleanup duty for Vader’s suit.
I just found out today that she was the voice of the Cadburys Caramel rabbit in the UK during the 80s.
Okay but the world doesn’t revolve around you and your opinions, granny Karen.
I mean, TBF, Dickens was mass market entertainment that we think of as great literature now partially because it’s really old.
And because it’s quite good.Fun fact: there were hundreds of other books written at that same time that don’t get the Dickens treatment. It’s almost like there was something different about those books.Likewise, there are other wildly popular books of the last 20 years that have a much better chance of living on than HP.
“Likewise, there are other wildly popular books of the last 20 years that have a much better chance of living on than HP.”Like what?
Wow, these comments are CRAWLING with bitter little Harry Potter faggots. She’s right about you. Kill yourselves.
I get people want JK Rowling to be over because they hate her, but my nieces and nephews age 5 to 12 and all of their friends have read all of Harry Potter and want to go to/have gone to Wizarding World. The books are all still bestsellers. The phenomenon is not going anywhere anytime soon.
Lol, the irony of adults on the internet being like “yeah, she’s right!” and then next time some shit Marvel movie comes out flipping out over “OMG DOCTOR DOOM IS SHOWING UP!!!11!”
You know, this brings up a…philosophical/hypothetical question/scenario. There’s things like HP, which is meant for kids and is then “aged up” along with its audience – forcibly imo. Then you have kids stuff that can still be enjoyed by adults.And then you have…”kids” stuff like Courage the Cowardly Dog.I would really, really like to see her watch a few episodes of that and see how her definition of “children’s entertainment” slowly changes as her pupils dilate. Mind you, purely for science. Not because I’m mean or anything.