Jerry Seinfeld ominously warns that “something is going to happen” with the Seinfeld finale
The show's finale wasn't great, but that's no reason to do a tired, legacy-tarnishing revival
Aux News Seinfeld
Maybe it’s simply because viewers at the time were unable to immediately get on the internet and register their disgust throughout the world after it aired, but in terms of divisive series finales, the end of Seinfeld pales in comparison to more recent objectionable endings like that of How I Met Your Mother or even Lost (which the general consensus seems to have flipped on in the years since). Still, it doesn’t have a particularly stellar reputation, and Jerry Seinfeld himself seems to have something in mind to change that—or at least make up for it.
In response to a question from an audience member at a show in Boston this weekend (via The Guardian), Seinfeld reportedly said that, “Something is going to happen that has to do with that ending” but that it “hasn’t happened yet.” He also vaguely teased that, “whatever you are thinking about,” he and Larry David “have also been thinking about it.” The implication seems to be that he wants to do some kind of revival, possibly as a second attempt at a finale that won’t make so many people mad, but he’d need a lot more people than just Larry David to be on board for that to happen.
But, to go back to that earlier point, is anyone still upset that Seinfeld ended with the main characters getting arrested in put in jail for a short time? It wasn’t “satisfying,” but what would’ve been? We flash-forward to see how each of them will die? We finally get to see Bob Sacamano? And how would those things land any better 25 years later than they would’ve at the time?
The finale as it aired is probably is misunderstanding of what people liked about the show late in its run—which is to say that it became more of a good-time show about funny people having fun as opposed to a subversive sitcom about funny people refusing to act according to the byzantine laws of social norms (and, for the record, it was never a “show about nothing,” that’s just the Jerry pilot they write, which is a parody of the show you’re watching not a literal recreation of it, as evidenced by the lack of a “the judge sentences a guy to be Jerry’s butler” storyline on Seinfeld).
The finale is a finale to what the show started as, where Jerry and his friends regularly suffer for their perceived crimes against society, with the final episode escalating it to them literally going to jail. That’s funny on paper, but it’s not all that funny in practice, and that’s fine. Seriously. Most of the other episodes are good, and you could easily skip the finale in a rewatch. It doesn’t negatively impact the show as a whole the way that, say, the Game Of Thrones finale does.
All of that is to say: Don’t do a Seinfeld revival, please. Curb Your Enthusiasm already did a whole thing about it, you don’t need to do it for real. If Seinfeld and David or so desperate to revisist that universe, do it as a novel or a comic book—you know, the way something like that is supposed to be done.
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Unless Crazy Joe Devola puts the kibosh on it.
SIC SEMPER TYRANNUS!
He’s always said he’d love to do a scene where the characters have just gotten out of jail, they sit down at the coffee table inside Monk’s, and George goes, “Boy, that was brutal.”At any rate, I thought Curb season 7 was all the revival that Seinfeld ever needed and everyone would be better off just leaving it at that.
It’s really the only thing that would make sense in the context of those characters. A brief complaint about how hard it was for them, followed by quickly moving on, having learned nothing.
I’d love to imagine that Larry David will, once again, be calling Julia Louis Dreyfus’ and Brad Hall’s house after the evening cut off time.
Yeah that was perfect, and in the context of a Curb season. Especially now with all their parents dead it wouldn’t be the same.
“At any rate, I thought Curb season 7 was all the revival that Seinfeld ever needed and everyone would be better off just leaving it at that.” Yup, it was the perfect way to apologize for it and do better. Don’t mess it up!
when the finale happened, I was 100% sure that they were taking one year offbecause that was the sentence! I was so sure about it..of course a year passed and nothing happened ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
It’ll be a cold day in hell before I agree to do this. OK maybe if they offer me authentic mink hats I might consider.
The best we can do is nutria.
That’s not going to be good for anybody.
Especially for the nutria.
rat hat
“It’ll be a cold day in hell before I agree to do this.”
Oof, this is kind of embarrasing, Bob, but you were not ever on the show.
Snapple?
The follow-up crossover with Oz was all I ever needed to forgive the sins of the finale.
Nope. May 1998 happened and that’s that.
Yikes. Would Michael Richards even be invited to take part? Kind of hard to not have Kramer, but…you know…the incident…
I guess it depends where it airs. Jerry had him as a guest on his comedian car show.
I enjoyed the show and was fine with the ending. The key thing to the show is that there isn’t a single actually likable or “good” person. They are all just awful people… and the finale just recognized that in a particular way.
Yeah, the legal plausibility of the trial wasn’t the point, it was to have them have to reckon with their actions throughout the series
What did they do that was so bad, though, really? For instance, why did Soup Nazi testify? What did they do to him that was so bad? What did Kramer ever do to anyone? He was probably the most decent of them all. And the stuff with Babu? Jerry actually tried his best to help Babu. Was his advice the best? No. But Babu was a grown man. Why was he taking business advice from a comedian? And it’s not Jerry’s fault he was deported, either. That was the post office (so maybe Newman!) and INS.They did drug the woman to play with her toys which was less than ideal, but not real drugs. Just Turkey and alcohol. She didn’t have to drink herself into unconsciousness.
Did you forget about Elaine? In regards to the soup nazi
No I didn’t. I know what she did to him, but I also know what he did to her and anyone else who didn’t follow his dumbass rules. He was a dick.
The Soup Nazi was blackmailed to shut down his business by Elaine. The source of the blackmail was his family recipes for soup that were in an armoire that he gave to Kramer to replace one that Kramer lost (not knowing it was intended for her). The problem was that he and Elaine also weren’t getting along because she was totally dismissive of the rules of his shop despite being repeatedly told what they were.
Babu got deported because Jerry and Elaine kept refusing get handle the mail transition. While it wasn’t intentional, the episode did touch on both of them making an issue about the mail then coming up with excuses not to handle it. On top of that, Jerry promised to aid Babu with a lawyer. Elaine caused the Lawyer’s cousin to get injured while delivering food. George was dating the Lawyer but was paranoid that since she found George funny, Jerry would be too funny and she’d leave him. Which led to George convincing Jerry to not be funny. The lawyer fell for the ‘dark’ Jerry personality and in response George revealed it was all an act. This caused the lawyer to give up entirely on the group in disgust, leaving Babu with no legal representation.
On screen, Kramer has roughed up someone for a statue, scammed several people, ruined a relationship or two, freeloaded off of just about everyone constantly, and always shifted blame from himself. The one thing about him is that he tends to always have good intentions and not be intentionally selfish like the others.
“The Soup Nazi was blackmailed to shut down his business by Elaine.”Because he was an asshole to her, though, and to everyone else. Also, the “rules of his shop” were arbitrary. No one could look him in the eye? Why did George not get bread?“Babu got deported because Jerry and Elaine kept refusing get handle the mail transition.”The mail transition took 2 weeks. INS was not deporting anybody with 2 weeks notice on the forms. And as you say, it wasn’t intentional. They aren’t bad people because Jerry didn’t open what he thought was his own mail. We don’t have a duty to other people to make sure their mail isn’t in hours. And none of what happened with the lawyer was Jerry’s or Elaine’s fault? She chose not to help him. And, again, Babu is a GROWN MAN. He could get his own lawyer.“Kramer has roughed up someone for a statue,”Not someone. The guy who stole the statue. And as you say, Kramer is the most genuinely good-hearted of the group. He freeloads, but he welcomes anyone to do the same off him. It’s just that he doesn’t have anything except chickenwire.
Jerry: Mugged an old lady for a marble rye
Got Elaine to try and accidentally grope a woman to see if her breasts were real.
Almost let a dude die at the pool
Called in a bomb threat to Yankee Stadium
Impersonated someone and stole their limo (even if it was a Nazi)
Elaine:
Conspiracy to kidnap/kill a dog w Newman and KramerGeorge:Fraudulent charity
Lies about being handicapped/parks in a handicapped spot
Buys a defective wheelchair (I think now you can’t buy used wheelchairs and medical supplies)
Tries to peep on Jerry’s girlfriend, then gives her lobster Kramer:Impersonated law enforcement
Impersonated a doctor
Illegally importing cigars
Criminal negligence/arson (the cabin)
Cement in laundry machines
Insurance Fraud with Jerry
Most of these have been addressed above so I’ll direct your attention to the other comments. Some of these really aren’t that bad. The bomb threat was pre-9/11. Not saying it’s a great thing to do, but it’s hardly the mark of the worst character. He was trying to help a friend. Impersonating someone and “stealing” their limo that they weren’t going to be using anyway? That’s “awful” to you? That’s a low bar.The fraudulent charity was only for gift-giving purposes. It’s not as if he was committing tax evasion. Illegally important cigars—who cares? Impersonating a doctor wasn’t great, but no harm was done. The “criminal negligence” was actually just an accident.You’re generally listing things that aren’t that great to do but don’t make you an awful person. A couple of them are actually bad, as discussed above, but for the most part I bet people could make a list about you of things that are untoward as well. Speeding. Jaywalking. Not saving receipts for deductions. Etc.
awful people?!? I bet most people would KILL to have 3 close friends like they all had. They were there for each other all the time, so they werent pc and disingenuous like most people, thats what made them so LIKEABLE.
Oh, how predictable: the incel edge-lord has emerged to explain that the people on the show were not awful at all, they were just being cancelled for not being woke enough!I seriously hope Trump and the rest of of his fascist goon squad get hit by a forking meteor.
Wow, overreacting much?I agree with him that these characters weren’t “awful” people. They weren’t great people, but weren’t awful, that’s why we as viewers can see so much of ourselves in them every episode.Its Always Sunny in Philadelphia – those are AWFUL people. Seinfeld – those are flawed people who take our thoughts to action and take our actions one step further.
For the record, I don’t think they were awful but not for anything having to do with the words “PC” or “woke.” LOL
Jesus shut the fuck up.
Well, Jerry had a Mac, so I guess he wasn’t PC. I don’t know what computer if any the other characters had.
Four awful people can still be good friends and still awful people… you don’t think Elon Musk has friends who are also awful? Ok, maybe bad example… not sure he has any actual friends.
Maybe he has some old friends from his paypal days? He’s insufferable but he likely knows some people he trusts. He seems exceptionally insecure. He claims he isn’t much of a drinker, but I don’t believe it for a minute. He just looks like he does.
God damn you guys are more obsessed with Elon than you are with Trump, aren’t you? lmao
Let’s put it another way: I’m sure the made-up personalities Elon Musk has given the Real Girl sex dolls he has in lieu of friends are awful.
I didn’t like the characters but putting them in jail was utterly bizarre. I don’t really remember the episode so I don’t even recall how they ended up in court anyway. But the sole premise that these people were any worse than any other person in the city (or anywhere else) was just preposterous. There’s so much blatant corruption in my small city there wouldn’t be room in our jail. And those are just the bigger players. Our nieghbor across the street is blatantly and openly running an illegal business and no one gives a damn. Whoever rats on him will face some small city ‘justice’ from someone he knows.They should have ended the series with a ‘whimper’. They all just continue with their weird lives, we just won’t be there anymore.
They should have ended the series with a ‘whimper’. They all just continue with their weird lives, we just won’t be there anymore.They kind of do in a sense. In the final pre-credits scene George complains about the placement of a button on his shirt which is a callback to the pilot episode. It kind of shows that in jail things will just go on as they always have.
They were in court for not helping a carjacking victim, and in fact mocking and filming them. It’s rather prescient, really.
“They were in court for not helping a carjacking victim, and in fact mocking and filming them.”Yeah, that’s another problem I had with it, that was just really out of character for them. The whole episode just felt off, someone else on here said that the original script leaked, and they quickly rewrote it. If that’s true, it would make sense, it really feels like they were working from a first draft, maybe even just some notes.
you sound like fun
They caught themselves on video watching a heavyset guy get carjacked and providing mocking commentary. The state they were in had just passed a controversial bystander law that I think required them to either provide aid or try to seek help. They did neither.
Then the prosecutor, doubting he had a good case, but wanting a win for the first case tried under this new law, decided to look them up and found a goldmine of crap full of multiple incidents showcasing that they were pretty awful people.
So they wound up in jail for what I think was a year or three after their character (and defense) was destroyed in court.
So they were actually in the right place at the right time, for once?
Yup. Everything caught up with them once they all left NYC. The only reason they were there was because Jerry and George’s NBC sitcom was getting another chance so they got on a plane to meet someone. Kramer started bouncing around trying to get water out of his ear and I think he fell into the cockpit and contributed to something breaking, causing them to land and have to wait for new transportation in the town with the new bystander law.
The real sad thing is I remember all this and I don’t even like Seinfeld, it just reruns so much on networks I leave on in the background.
Thanks for the details. I was a sometime watcher and I only caught the end of the episode.
Lol you have no friends so you have to envy the characters from SEINFELD, you pathetic little bitch.
They hung around each other out of habit and they would frequently let each other down. Elaine in particular wanted a new friend group but didn’t get along with other people. I think their friendship was relatable for many people in their thirties, but you have to overlook a lot to portray their friendship as aspirational.
I think that’s part of it too. I always viewed it as kind of a mirror. You genuinely do like the characters and relate to them, which is why I think people negatively reacted to the finale. The show was kind of saying, “just to be clear, they’re kind of shitty people” to the audience, knowing full well how relatable they are, and making you realize that you and everyone is kind of shitty sometimes.
you’re in control of whether or not you have friends.
“They were there for each other all the time”
Tell me you’’ve never watched a single episode of Seinfeld without telling me.
I can’t think of a SINGLE time ANY one of them had ANY other one’s back.
You didn’t understand the show at all.
The problem is that every episode acknowledges this, as at least one of them suffers some kind of consequences. So to bring up their past misdeeds and punishing them again just feels unnecessary.
I dunno, even though they would face minor consequences, their past misdeeds ruined a lot of lives. Plus there was a lot of misdeeds and a pretty big variety of offenses. Deportation, closed businesses, lost jobs, ruined careers, burnt down property, ruined relationships, killed pets, severe injury, at least two deaths… they had a lot to answer for and generally only faced mild inconveniences. The episode where Elaine turned out to have another set of friends who were like ‘Bizzaro’ versions of Kramer, Jerry, and George showcased how negative the main group was.
Plus, even though it isn’t confirmed canon, I like the theory that the plane crashed and they are in purgatory.
That idea best stays lost.
WE NEED TO GET BACK TO MANHATTAN ISLAND!
The extent to which the primary Seinfeld characters are awful has been greatly exaggerated over the years. They’re often petty and selfish, but they’re rarely malicious. And they’re frequently surrounded by people who are worse than them who initiate the various conflicts they find themselves embroiled in. Even George, who is the most selfish and craven of the cast, ultimately just wants a stable, well-paying office job where he can be slack off and not get fired and a hot girlfriend. Who among us can’t relate to that?
I agree. I think a lot of perfectly normal and pleasant people have done things that the Seinfeld characters did or have at least thought about doing some of those things.
Plus you have to judge them by the heightened reality they exist in. People like to isolate a single moment and say, “Only a psychopath would do X in real life,” but a real life person wouldn’t have suffered through the series of comic mishaps that lead up to that point because none of us live in a sitcom.
I think that’s what draws us to them, they sort of represent some of our worst instincts. In addition to Seinfeld I’m a big fan of Curb, and I often think I would pretty much be Larry David (the character) if I lacked self-restraint. You can also see my reply to the poster you were responding to, all 4 main characters on Seinfeld were absolutely malicious at times.
I feel like a lot of us would very quickly be Larry David if we had Larry David money.
My most real life Larry David moment was pointed out to me by a friend. At my son’s 1st birthday party a friend’s 2 year old kid had some sort of seizure. As you can imagine all sorts of panic (understandably) ensued from his parents. I was definitely terrified as well and calmly called 911. The operator seemed to know exactly what was going on, that it was almost certainly something called a ferbrile seizure, and that he would be fine. The operator also told me that there was a high likelihood he would throw up when he woke up. As we waited for the ambulance to arrive I tried to calm his parents with the information I was given. At that point I was also very concerned about the kid barfing all over my carpet. I got a towel with the intention of putting it under him to control the mess. The parents thought I got it to cover him up to keep him warm. I failed in trying to explain to them the real reason for the towel. When I recounted the story to a coworker he summed up my attitude, saying, “I’m sorry your kid is dying, but please put this towel down because I don’t want a mess on my floor”. He then pointed out how that was such a Larry David move. I’ll end by nothing that the kid ended up being fine. Febrile seizures tend to occur when a kid has a fever from some illness. He was apparently sick with a fever the day of my son’s party. The boy’s mom decided it would be a good idea to simply give him medicine and bring him to an outdoor birthday party on a 90+ degree July day.
Sure, sure, the kid was fine, but what about the carpet?!
The carpet was fine that day, and was replaced a year or so later. I now have an elderly dog who is doing his best to ruin it. The carpet will be next to go after he does.
I don’t know, they could certainly be malicious. George poisoned Rick Barr with Elaine’s help, and Kramer helped Jerry destroy a washing machine in a laundromat. Elaine also kidnapped a dog with Kramer’s help. Those are just a few examples I thought of off the top of my head.
Yeah I think describing them as “flawed to terrible people who get karmic payback” describes early Seinfeld, where you have situations like “Jerry and George screw up their chance with hot women because of their hangups” or “their car gets smashed up because they parked in a handicapped space”, but over the entire run I see the argument that they both got worse and they were less punished for it. While Larry David going “well that’s what should happen to these assholes” with the finale makes a certain sense, it also was never going to be a satisfying ending because you’d at the very least enjoyed watching their antics, if not sympathized with their flaws over the course of years of watching them.
My opinion of the finale has really changed over the years. I initially hated it, and felt that way for along time. My wife and I would even skip it when watching the series. A while back once I sort of “got” what they were trying to accomplish I started to feel differently. I certainly wouldn’t include it among my favorite episodes, but I definitely like it more than I used to.
Yeah, but Rick Barr was an asshole.They thought the laundromat owner stole Jerry’s money. (He hadn’t, but it’s not as if they set out to destroy his machine for no reason, and he paid him back for the damage.)The dog was barking all fucking night and the owner wasn’t doing anything!
The drugging thing really stood out as odd during a recent re-watch.The dryer though, I think it’s worth remembering that when Jerry then found the money he thought the laundromat owner stole, he owned up to the crime and paid for the machine. The dog thing is terrible, yeah.
Yeah, I never quite understood the takeaway that the core characters were maniacs in a sane world. Nearly everyone they encounter is insane to some degree – in fact, I’m having a hard time thinking of characters that were even slightly normal through-and-through.
I feel like a lot of Jerry’s love interests are pretty reasonable. But otherwise, everyone is insane.
I’m not sure that’s how the world was portrayed.
I think it wasn’t so much that they were maniacs so much as the sheer amount of incidents involving them as the common factor. They were involved in a lot of lives being ruined, a number of deliberate criminal acts, a few scams, a few accidental deaths, and some severe injuries.
Well said.The only thing I’d add is that whatever ways they were unsavory were, and were meant to be, reflections of the smaller sides we all embody. It’s what made the show hum. We could judge these characters but really, we loved them because they made us feel better about our own worst impulses.
This. They’re not what you would call “good,” but they’re…normal? Petty and selfish is correct. But that’s hardly “awful.” And in most cases their petty revenge is against someone who really did commit an actual wrong against them. A petty wrong and gets a petty revenge and the world moves on. No lives were ruined.Maybe the girl who got the oil dropped on her head, but that was an accident.
Yeah. They’re honestly not much worse than most sitcom characters.
I’ve maintained for a while that George is actually a highly moral character … for a given value of moral. Which is to say, he has his own view of what is right in the world, and he sticks to it fiercely, even when it’s disadvantageous for him. It’s just that his moral system is severely out of synch with what’s considered standard by the world at large.
I would say that implies even more to Larry David in Curb.
I don’t know that they were awful. They were mostly fine? They did do some shitty things from time to time but on the whole I think they were basically neutral. They weren’t good, certainly, but they weren’t awful.Or maybe I’m also awful.
Jerry essentially mugged an old lady for a loaf of bread. Kramer mugged a guy for a statue. Jerry and George left a cop car open and freed a serial killer, who immediately killed someone else (which got Kramer freed from suspicion). George got Susan killed by being cheap.
George poisoned his boss.
Elaine contributed to the death of the NBC exec. George and Kramer gave a handicapped woman a used wheelchair and almost got her killed. George almost killed that mountain climber guy..
Jerry and Elaine being dumb about mail got one guy deported after Jerry convinced the guy to ruin his restaurant.
They all got convicted for filming a guy getting carjacked and mocking him the entire time.So yeah, they’re awful but not blatantly so?
The Always Sunny crew is blatantly awful. The Seinfeld crew is just ‘don’t hang out with them’ awful.
One that didn’t occur to me in my earlier reply was Jerry drugging his girlfriend so he could play with her toys. I love Seinfeld, but that storyline has definitely not aged well.
“Jerry essentially mugged an old lady for a loaf of bread.”Okay this one does count as awful. lol But he did offer to pay her. LOLKramer mugged a thief for the statute he stole.“Jerry and George left a cop car open and freed a serial killer”That was an accident.“George got Susan killed by being cheap.”WTF? How was he supposed to know the envelopes were poisonous? That was the fault of the manufacturer.“George poisoned his boss.”The boss was an asshole. And it’s not like it was killing poison.“Elaine contributed to the death of the NBC exec. George”This is 100% bullshit. She decided she didn’t want to go out with him. That’s literally it.“George and Kramer gave a handicapped woman a used wheelchair and almost got her killed. George almost killed that mountain climber guy..”The wheelchair was unfortunate. The mountain climber guy shouldn’t have put his life in the hands of an inexperienced climber. That was literally an accident.“Jerry and Elaine being dumb about mail got one guy deported after Jerry convinced the guy to ruin his restaurant.”IT WAS HIS OWN MAIL. As far as he knew. He’s allowed to not open his own fucking mail. Plus, INS isn’t deporting anyone because they are two weeks late on filing papers. Babu had been ignoring that shit for months.“They all got convicted for filming a guy getting carjacked and mocking him the entire time.”That was bad writing. It was out of character for them.
Jerry also repeatedly drugged a girl to play with her toys. George and Elaine became accomplices in this. Jerry also left a pool boy to possibly die because he was too grossed out to give him mouth to mouth.
“Jerry also repeatedly drugged a girl to play with her toys.”“Drugged” as in offered her turkey and wine. Did he force her to drink herself into unconsciousness?I’ll allow the pool boy episode. That was bad.
To be honest I’m also a very germ-conscious person, so I would struggle in that situation as well. I like to think I’d jump in and try to help though.
Yeah and I think that’s some of the point, that they have the same impulses a lot of us have. We don’t usually act on them, but it’s kind of fun to see other people act on them, isn’t it? Plus, the other point the “they are awful” people are missing is that they nearly always suffer consequences for this stuff. He got kicked out of the club for not helping that guy. And let’s keep in mind that the pool guy had been harassing Jerry which is how he ended up in the pool in the first place. Which doesn’t mean he needed to die, obviously, but he didn’t have clean hands. If he had minded his own business he wouldn’t have nearly drowned.
I think they are mostly bad people, or at the very least selfish, but if they weren’t the show wouldn’t have been funny. As you point out with the pool boy, most of the recurring and one-off characters were not so great either. In my observation Kramer is the most well-intentioned of the 4 main characters, but his good intentions don’t turn out well most of the time.
They are definitely selfish (until they’re not, though—they had lots and lots of times when they were helping people or being nice). I just think there’s a lot of space between “selfish a lot of the time” and “awful human beings who need to be in jail.” An “awful human being” is, for instance, trump. He’s at that end of the spectrum. Here they’re just minor-league a-holes sometimes, but also really nice and helpful sometimes with truly good intentions. As someone else pointed out this is a heightened reality where the show itself was focusing on all of the characters’ weaker impulses because that’s what’s funny, but they weren’t just on the whole bad folks.Kramer was definitely the best of the bunch in his efforts. But even George tried to paint himself as some sort of psychopath and even he never did anything *that* bad.
I think we have a disagreement that we won’t resolve regarding George. While Rick Barr was an asshole, I don’t think that justifies poisoning him. George definitely tried to be nice from time to time, an example is getting the chair for the security guard at Ross’s. It seems like with George his baser instincts usually won out though, an early example is in The Stock Tip when he pays for everyone’s meal, then starts taking money back from the tip he was going to leave for the waitress. You can’t completely blame George for who he is though, look at the parents who raised him. I like to think that George would have become more and more like Frank as he got older. They certainly share some of the same traits, those being paranoia, short-temper, etc.
I mean…”poisoning” him. Barely. And the guy publicly insulted him twice. Like a string of insults. *Obviously* poisoning someone is a crime and you shouldn’t do it, but Rick Barr was a bully and an asshole. I don’t feel sorry for him. But I’m an Aries, so revenge is foremost in my mind at all times. If I know someone whose boss was a bully and mean, I wouldn’t grab my pearls because they put some visine in his coffee and gave him diarrhea or whatever. “an early example is in The Stock Tip when he pays for everyone’s meal, then starts taking money back from the tip he was going to leave for the waitress”He’s cheap, definitely. But does not over-tipping make him “awful,” or does it just make him cheap? I have a hard time getting to “awful” from “cheap.” And yeah, in the words of Elaine, his parents really did a number on him.
I didn’t mean to suggest that being a bad tipper made him an awful person, it was just an example of how George’s worst instincts usually win out. He was trying to be generous but just couldn’t bring himself to go all the way. I do think George is probably the worst of the bunch, and in my eyes there is enough evidence to say that he is a bad person. I’d also probably choose him as my favorite of the 4 if I had to pick one.
Yeah, it’s debatable (obviously, as we are debating it lol). Maybe it’s just a case of one’s tolerance for people’s weaker impulses. You have a lower tolerance for it, and that’s probably correct. One should not have a high tolerance for some of this stuff. I will say that a lot of the examples people are giving, though, like Jerry giving Babu bad business advice (that he thought was good) or not opening his mail, or Elaine causing Dalrimple’s death because she mentioned Greenpeace?? are pretty silly. But at least you stuck with ones that I can’t deny are moral failings, like not giving mouth-to-mouth or poisoning a guy (even though the guy deserved it lol). So there’s that. George is probably my favorite too, I think because he was just the most kind of downtrodden, starting with being raised by his parents. Honestly if I had to pick a “worst,” I’d say Elaine. Don’t get me wrong—I love her—but she had everything going for her. A reasonable upbringing (though her dad was scary), a sibling she got along with, friends, a good job, an education, good looks, so she really had no reason to be an a-hole, but she still was a good bit of the time. But she seemed to try to be good. All in all I think I identify with them because while I would never do most or maybe even any of the stuff they did, it makes me feel less crazy for thinking about doing that stuff.
I most definitely relate to some of their impulses as well. I agree on your assessment of Elaine, I think she’s a close second to George. She’s also a close second as to who I would name as my favorite character, and on some days she would be first. I’ve grown to appreciate her more and more over the years, mostly because I’ve become more aware of Julia’s amazing comedic acting skills.
I sometimes can’t get over how good the acting was on that show. Not Jerry, obviously, though he did his best. But between Louis-Dreyfuss, Alexander, and Richards they were putting on a masterclass in comic acting every week. I hope Jerry Seinfeld and Larry David thank their lucky stars every day that they got those three.
Jerry was certainly the weakest, but I think he did alright in his own way. Michael Richards was amazing. So much of it with him was physical comedy which is a niche skill, but he was a master. I don’t know if you have the dvd’s and the attached interviews, but it’s clear when he talks that he was so committed to his performance and took it very seriously, to the point that he got very annoyed when other broke up and ruined a scene. That show really had it all from the writing, to the cast, and to the casting for the recurring and guest roles.
I think the degree to which they were awful has now paled in comparison to how awful people in contemporary sitcoms behave – IASIP comes most immediately to mind. They’d still be awful people irl, of course.
The ending helped us realize that we had been rooting for sociopaths the entire time. Like when so many people came up to the trial to dig up all the ways they were terrible in the past, it was a nice little rug-pull that just because they’re our main characters and there’s a laugh track doesn’t make them good people.
What’s the deal with the Seinfeld finale? I’ll tell you why it landed with a thud. If you were watching it the night it aired, there was an hour long clip show that ran before it, and then however many minutes into the final episode, the plot vanishes and we’re just in a courtroom recapping past incidents again. So not only did it feel redundant, but the episode barely gave us any new story. When you’re seeing the gang for the final time, you don’t just want a recap of everything that happened in past episodes. If you’re gonna put them on trial, don’t just make it about bringing back old guests. Give us something new in the courtroom. That at least would have had some potential.
Was 12 when I watched it live and I remember too feeling a bit ripped off that they did more clips in the actual episode.
It also *felt* like (to me) using “Good Riddance” for a big send-off had been done to death, even if it hadn’t, and it felt kind of weird for Seinfeld, of all shows, to use it for the clip show, given its “no hugging and no learning” ethos.
It’s also one of those songs that sounds sentimental, but wasn’t written as such (as noted by the title).
I distinctly remember Seinfeld being the first one to do that. That is the iconic usage of that song. Everything after that is what made it cliche.
My thoughts exactly. It was jarring, actually. Also, Seinfeld seemed to exist in a music-free universe (other than Elaine’s infamous dancing to “Slow Ride” and George’s singing show tunes making Elaine’s dad think he was gay). The characters just never seemed to be all that interested in music at all, so a current popular rock song interlude was weird.
It would have been better to see them up on the stand having to defend their actions. Maybe they come up with a plan to get out of it, but George or Kramer messes it up. How about Newman gives the testimony that puts them away for good, and doesn’t mind sacrificing Kramer to screw Jerry. Just so much potential.
That might be why I was fine with the finale. I didn’t see the preceding clip show (not sure it even aired in my country), so none of it felt redundant. It felt appropriate to wrap up the show with a look back at the arseholes they’ve always been, and cap it off with a bit of evidence that not even jail will change them.
I reckon David and Seinfeld wanted to kill them all in the plane crash – never to return – but The Network wouldn’t have it.
You’re saying a show about nothing ended with a finale in which nothing happened?
That clip show was awful. And then they ended it with a montage while playing Green Day’s Good Riddance, which is the absolute worst tonal choice for Seinfeld.Of course, the only good clip shows I can think of are The Simpsons 138th Spectacular and episode 2 of the animated Clerks show.
Maybe they should have just ended it with an asteroid. A funny one like Don’t Look Up. I think it could have worked!
I thought the parts with past characters was funny, but conclusion in the jail seemed kind of stupid. Supposedly, there was another finale written, but it leaked, so they changed it. Maybe they should have stuck with the original.The show had a very particular rhythm, so the show lost its rhythm with a longer run time. I’m sure the network wanted the ratings over a longer episode, but perhaps a half-hour finale would have worked better.
The finale overall just wasn’t funny. Like, it’s almost laugh-free. Them ending up in jail wasn’t the issue; it was that the last episode just had no creative juice to it. It was like the writers just went:
I agree, but the thing is, there is NOTHING funny about jail, nadda, nothing.
The Longest Yard, O Brother Where Art Thou, I Love You Philip Morris, and Bronson – among others – would disagree with this sentiment.
Seeing your beloved orange cult leader get shipped off to jail would be pretty fucking funny.
I feel like you’re not allowing yourself to be creative. Obviously, IRL prison is a nightmare, but within the Seinfeld universe, there is humor to be mined. Heck, there already was an episode where George dated a female inmate and that whole storyline was hilarious!
I’m sure there are all sorts of interviews/oral histories that shed some light on what happened, but it really felt like the whole creative team overthought things and got the yips.
Only laugh I got was George’s dad screaming at George’s mom about wanting to beat the traffic so they had to leave without saying goodbye.
Was it written solo by a J. Seinfeld, perhaps?
It was written by the series co-creator, Larry David.
I was just talking about this after finding out about the Frasier reboot. I said that I couldn’t imagine Seinfeld ever coming back due to what Jerry and Larry have said in the past, but I guess things change. It can’t be for the money though, Larry and Jerry and both like billionaires.
The funny thing about billionaires is that they like making more money even more than poor people do. That’s why they’re billionaires.
Its tough to impress 16 year olds when you haven’t been on TV in so long.
JLD was like a billionaire before she even started acting.
Probably best if the A.V. Club doesn’t mention “the byzantine laws of social norms”.
They finally broke him, after years and truckloads of money being thrown at him to do it. He’s not made of stone!
Krusty Chomsky has a nice ring to it.
Jerry goes to the bathroom at Monk’s, cut to black. “Don’t Stop Believin’ starts playing…
Yeah, then you can just tell people who don’t like it they’re stupid.
I don’t know how you talk about bad endings without that one.
Well, there were people who thought the abrupt ending was some technical malfunction, despite the perfect syncopation to the music and the immediate credit roll. After all the hype of “this audience is so sophisticated”, it was revealing how many of them were actually dolts.
David?
See I don’t remember an immediate credit roll. I remember maybe four or five seconds of silent black screen. Back in a period where that would happen sometimes watching cable and then the show would resume, pixelated for a second.
You’re right. There was a few second pause before the credits rolled.
I’m pretty sure I’m not a “dolt”, but I thought, “Wait, what? Did I miss something?” after that happened. Did you magically figure out without a moment’s hesitation or questioning that it was supposed to mean that Tony was killed? If so, you may be the only one. I know plenty of perfectly intelligent and educated people who were baffled by it, myself included.
That’s just it: there was not an immediate credit roll. It was black and silent for ten whole seconds.I liked it but it absolutely seemed to at least possibly be a malfunction.It’s also debatable whether it was in “perfect syncopation” (which doesn’t mean what you think it means — syncopation would but jarring and off-beat) It cuts right after “Don’t stop” which is the opening of a repeat of the chorus.
people forget the reason the sopranos was so successful was because normal morons watched it as a straightforward gangster show, so they were able to sneak in the more sophisticated stuff because it was so successful, not the other way around.
If you don’t capitalize the first word in a sentence and you write run-on sentences, you don’t get to call anyone a moron.
Give it a shot. If it sucks, it will be very easy to pretend it didnt happen. Its not going to tarnish itself like HIMYM, which is now so beyond watchable its not even in syndication. Giving them a shot to see what happens after jail would be fun and people want to see it. Better than all the garbage on TV now.
If you absolutely have to bring them back, do it in the It’s Always Sunny In Philadelphia universe.
“So, hear me out… what if we add talking bees to the finale episode?”
Beads!?!
Carl Geraghty’s not on board.
That finale was TERRIBLE, pure garbage Jerry. Such a great series really blew it with it that one.
Oh, god please no more Seinfeld. Jerry has become an even more insufferable douchebag since it ended. Don’t give him any more airtime than he has already.
It really sucks that Seinfeld the show is so transcendent while Seinfeld the comedian is so average and Seinfeld the person is such a self-centered grouch.
for the record, it was never a “show about nothing,” Yeah. I have to laugh at people who took that seriously.I remember social critics scolding us about what a sad state of affairs it is that the most popular show in America was “a show about nothing”, and what that said about how empty we’d become.The sad thing was how gullible those critics were.
We just call it “slice of life” now.
“for the record, it was never a “show about nothing,”Yeah. I have to laugh at people who took that seriously.”
*sigh*
Yes. It was. There was nothing driving the show beyond “friends live in New York”.
The problem is that morons like you and the AVClub writers don’t understand that a show that isn’t a family comedy or a workplace comedy *IS* a show that is about nothing.
This is giving big “It’s gonna be a Super Bowl ad” energy
that gang files out through the jail passing those going in. kramer rubbernecking whos going in runs in to a sam bankman fried lookalike. outside the jail the gang wait for a taxi and wondering how to pay to get home. kramer excitedly exclaims “crypto!” the rest groan and shake their head while they start riffling through their pockets. jerry pulls out a mastercard, “how about this?”
Love it except I bet Larry David would balk at any mention of crypto.
huge call.
Matthew Broderick is coming back as Ferris Bueller!
Or maybe not so much…
Oh bollocks, that’s exactly what it’s gonna be isn’t it? Sigh.
I just hope they finally admit that Jerry and everyone were in Purgatory all along.
“Whatever you are thinking about,” he and Larry David “have also been thinking about it.”
That’s flattering, but I don’t think NBC will be willing to air my Seinfeld slashfic.
“These pretzels are making me horny!”
has Senifeld run out of places to get coffee?
Jerry will be dead and buried before he goes out for a chai!
All you have to do to fix the finale is take out all the flashback clips everytime some character from the past shows up. Having those clearly showed that they were making the finale for the millions of people who would be watching who barely had watched the show before that, rather than actual fans.And the idea of it being a show about nothing only holds up if you compare it to other late 80’s sitcoms, where they were either a family show or a work show, and they always had some weird hook about the main character to make them original. Seinfeld wasn’t a show about a family or a workplace he was just a regular guy who hung out with his friends. But even then he still had the hook since the original idea was that stuff in his life inspired his stand up act.
You’re a comedian, you make people laugh. You think this is all a big joke, don’t you? I saw you on T.V. once; I remembered your name from my list. I looked it up. Sure enough, it checked out. You think because you’re a celebrity that somehow the law doesn’t apply to you, that you’re above the law? Well, let me tell you something, funny boy. Y’know that little script direction, the one that says “Fin”? Well that may not mean anything to you, but that means a lot to me. One whole hell of a lot. Sure, go ahead, laugh if you want to. I’ve seen your type before: Flashy, making the scene, flaunting convention. Yeah, I know what you’re thinking. What’s this guy making such a big stink about old sitcom revivals? Well, let me give you a hint, junior. Maybe we can live without new sitcoms, people like you and me. Maybe. Sure, we’re too old to change the world, but what about that kid, sitting down, opening a streaming app, right now, in a branch at the local library and finding revived thirty year old sitcoms making jokes about pee-pees and wee-wees on the box? Doesn’t HE deserve better? Look. If you think this is about diminishing returns and over-laboured ideas, you’d better think again. This is about that kid’s right to watch a TV without getting his mind warped! Or maybe that turns you on, Seinfeld; maybe that’s how y’get your kicks. You and your good-time buddies. Well I got a flash for ya, joy-boy: Party time is over. Hard feelings? What do you know about hard feelings? Y’ever have a man die in your arms? Y’ever kill somebody? What’s my problem? Punks like you, that’s my problem. And you better not screw up again Seinfeld, because if you do, I’ll be all over you like a pitbull on a poodle.
They’re kidnapped by aliens? Kidnapped by some Qanoners? They all get on a plane to Miami but end up on the Lost island?
The jail story was fine, it was the clip show aspect that killed it.
My dad has always been adamant that a brilliant move would have been for them to just bring it back 25 years later without making a big deal about it. Unfortunately that milestone has passed.
I’m intrigued about the original finale. I decided a while back that Seinfeld was a blind spot in my cultural history that I needed to address. It has taken until season 7 (which I am up to now) for me to start to low-key enjoy it, but I’m still bemused that it is considered an all-time great sitcom.
Out of curiosity, how old are you?
92…
Old enough to have watched the original run of Cheers. And I know a lot of Seinfeld fans can be scathing about Friends – but that was a show I did watch regularly, and I don’t think it’s just me being nostalgic when I say that show was way funnier than Seinfeld.
I remember getting into Friends for one season and thinking Joey Tribbiani was a hilarious character so I guess it was not without its charms to me. But, I also stopped watching after one season because I don’t remember the show offering anything more than just comfort. Obviously, humor is subjective and many people found Friends funnier than Seinfeld, but one of those shows was formulaic and the other was groundbreaking.
So people tell me, but I just don’t see it. Although every time John O’Hurley opens his mouth as Peterman, it cracks me up.
I liked Friends, but I can’t think of any particular episode that stands out to me as funniest. Meanwhile, Seinfeld has lots of episodes I can easily recall as classics. Maybe some don’t make as much sense in the age of cell phones being everywhere, but if you’re old enough to have watched Cheers, you’re old enough to remember that time. I’m not sure why someone in that age range who liked sitcoms wouldn’t have at least tried one episode of Seinfeld back in the day.The Chinese Restaurant was comparable to the actual aggravations of life pre-Open Table, and the characters trying to get food from other customers was funny, among other parts. The Parking Garage is still my life, as I can never find my car in those things. I have referenced The Summer of George and George sleeping under his desk in everyday life.The Contest was groundbreaking and funny. When Kramer slams down the money? I always laugh, no matter that I’ve seen it easily 20 times. Same with where Elaine throws George’s toupee out the window. Or the Soup Nazi yelling. Or Elaine’s dancing. Or George’s dad celebrating Festivus.
In the UK, Seinfeld was quickly shunted to late nights slots so never really took off the way Friends did (Friday night prime time) so that’s why I never got into it at the time. None of those classics (OK, maybe the Soup Nazi) have really registered as something special with me. I think Friends was more consistent so episodes stand out less, but off the top of my head, the Brad Pitt episode, the quiz for possession of the apartment, Monica and Ross dancing on the TV show, and the trip to the beach hut would be some of my favourites.
Jerry wakes up and tells his wife Elaine that he’s had the most awful dream where he lived in New York and was a complete jerk. She then wakes up George and Kramer, also in the same bed, who are their poly lovers.
See, that I would watch.
A comic book, or excuse me, a graphic novel?? Nobody is going to pay $24.95 for a thing they can read in 15 minutes.
If they do this thing, I hope I get a call to have a quick guest spot on it. Times are hard!
I’d give you a million-to-one shot.
I would presume it will be connected to the (eventual, maybe?) finale of Curb
I’ll speak for me: I don’t need this. I’m good. The monoculture is dead anyway.Jerry really should just retire into a scrooge mcduck vault of gold coins. What he has to say carries less and less value.David is busy running Curb as far as it will go. I dropped off before the original run ended so unsure how good it even is these days. I’m not sure I need an elderly Michael Richards doing an apology tour about his (almost 20 yr old) racist remarks so this can get made.Jason Alexander seems to be fine but vaguely alludes to never being able to get out of the Seinfeld shadow in every interview he is asked about it- don’t drag him back into George.and JLD (the best!) will forever be Selena Meyer first, Elaine Benes second IMO. Also, Check out JLD in a really nice little film this year call You Hurt My Feelings.So please, don’t. My hope is when this Fraiser reboot pulls abysmal numbers this week, maybe the reboot-of-blockbuster-sitcom trend will cool down a bit.
I doubt whatever it is would be an actual reboot. Maybe they would do something on Curb again. As far as Curb goes, you are absolutely missing out on some hilarious episodes if you tuned out a while ago. In particular you missed out on an amazing performance by Tracy Ullman as a recurring character in the most recent season.
“I’ll speak for me: I don’t need this.
Hurry! Someone tell Jerry.
The problem with the finale isn’t the jail or the farcical trial or anything. It’s that it’s a clip show. The final episode is a clip show.
did you watch the finale? The problem with it that everyone hated, is that it was a fucking clip-show, that aired directly after a lead-in clip show.
Whatever it is, I hope they can fit in the joke Funkhouser (RIP) told at the Seinfeld reunion table-read.
The general consensus on the Lost finale has flipped? Last time I remember seeing it discussed, everybody still agreed it was horrible.
I dunno – I’ve always thought the finale was fitting. Subversive, a little cruel, mostly funny, and a twist of the karmic knife for the characters.
I do enjoy the irony of Sam Barsanti accusing something else of being tired and legacy-tarnishing.
The finale of Lost, then and now, is fine, and a fairly decent cap for (most) of the characters on what was always actually a character-driven show to which the ‘’puzzle box’ nonsense was marketing hype.
The final season of Lost, however, is bloody awful.
If it’s anything more than a Super Bowl commercial, I’ll be shocked.