Ms. Marvel ends with a focus on the power of community
Disney Plus' Ms. Marvel closes out with an emotionally intense episode that sets up Kamala's superhero future
TV Reviews Ms. Marvel
Well, that was quite something, wasn’t it?
When we left Kamala Khan (Iman Vellani) at the end of episode five, it seemed like Ms. Marvel had both concluded all its storylines and opened a massive new one that couldn’t possibly fit into the only episode left of the series. But I’m not too proud to admit I was wrong: That one storyline did fit, and Ms. Marvel’s season one finale was everything I could hope for. There was action, contemplation, laughter, pointed jabs at the government, and a family and community that stands up for its own. It’s an undoubtedly packed episode, but rather than feeling rushed, “No Normal” manages to combine big set pieces with the really touching and intimate family moments the show has excelled at since the beginning. I finally get to use the A grade I’ve been saving all season.
We open with Agent Deever (Alysia Reiner) putting out an order to catch the “kids” who blew up Circle Q, before cutting to Bruno (Matt Lintz) helping Kamran (Rish Shah) escape after the latter has accidentally unleashed his newfound powers. They’re on the PATH train (which, FYI, connects Jersey City to Manhattan) when Department of Damage Control agents catch up with them. They barely manage to escape, but not before Kamran shoots a few light beams out of his body that crystallize much like Kamala’s light does.
At home, Kamala is unaware of what is going on as she and Muneeba (Zenobia Shroff) have just returned from Pakistan, and Kamala has an important announcement to make. She apologizes for the wedding fiasco, and for not telling her family sooner before confessing she is “Light Girl” (or at Aamir’s insistent “You’re what?” she resignedly says she’s “Night Light.”) Aamir and Yusuf’s (Mohan Kapoor) reactions are priceless because they clearly knew in advance, thanks to the “classic Khan gossip train” i.e. Muneeba being a typical Pakistani mother who can’t keep a secret. She told Yusuf, who had his phone on speaker so Aamir and Tyesha (Travina Springer) overheard.
It’s in this scene we see how far Muneeba and Kamala’s relationship has come. Yusuf tells Kamala he’s proud of her but wants her to stay safe and not run into danger, while Muneeba points out that they trust Kamala. It’s a beautiful callback to the first episode—one of many—when Muneeba said she didn’t trust Kamala. It also speaks to how finding out about the family history has helped both Muneeba and Kamala understand each other better. Taking us to Pakistan may have felt odd at times, but that time in Pakistan has clearly changed both women. We further see just how supportive and on board Muneeba is when she gives Kamala a handmade Ms. Marvel costume: THE Ms. Marvel costume. All those elements they gathered in Pakistan have come together to create something beautiful, and Kamala immediately puts it on to go help Bruno and Kamran after finding out from Nakia (Yasmeen Fletcher) that they’re in danger.
Bruno and Kamran turn up, of all places, at the mosque. In some ways, it’s a logical choice. Bruno thinks as a place of worship, it should be a sanctuary, and he’s absolutely not wrong. In other ways, as Nakia points out, it’s a terrible choice, given that it’s a mosque in America and is therefore probably under surveillance by a myriad of government agencies. Still, they’re allowed to shelter there until they can safely make their way to the high school, which Nakia points out is the only place guaranteed to be empty on a Saturday.
Damage Control unsurprisingly heads to the mosque first, and Agent Deever, having learned nothing, still wears her shoes inside. I am outraged all over again, and I hate her. It’s the ultimate indication of the fact that she is a true villain, and I should never have considered anyone else after that first time SHE WORE HER SHOES INSIDE THE MOSQUE. She calls Kamran a “high-level threat” and then gives the most generic description of a brown person, saying he could be “Pakistani or Arab.” Because we’re all the same, right, Agent Deever? An extensive search fails to find anything but a community banding together to protect their own. Sneaking out of their hiding place behind a bookshelf, Sheikh Abdullah (Laith Nakli) gives them a disguise of (ingenious) halal/haram baseball caps and tells them to be careful.
As they make their way to the high school, a classic setting for a showdown, Kamala makes her way across Jersey City using her Noor to throw down stepping stones, and leaving everyone in the neighborhood staring up at her in awe, none more so than Bruno and Kamran. She finds them in an alleyway, and both of them are still obviously crushing on her and are stunned to see Kamala in her new costume. As Kamala and Bruno reunite and share a hug, Kamran loses control of his powers. He’s clearly in a huge amount of pain, saying that he feels like he’s “being crushed from the inside.” It’s obvious that he needs more help than Kamala can give, so when they arrive at the high school, Kamala rings Kareem (Aramis Knight) who agrees to smuggle Kamran out of Jersey City and over to Karachi and the Red Daggers.
After a short but sweet make-up scene between Kamala and Nakia, it’s on to the fun stuff. Suddenly, a gang of five has assembled in the school hallway to help out. Five, I hear you say? Kamala, Bruno, Kamran, and Nakia only equal four. But my math isn’t wrong because guess who’s turned up, having been making TikToks in the school auditorium because it has good lighting? Zoe (Laurel Marsden). It feels slightly strange to bring her back for this final episode since we’ve seen so little of her until now, but it’s also kind of fun, and I love this ragtag group of people that are going to come up with a ragtag plan to try and distract Damage Control so Kamran can get to the harbor.
It becomes even more ragtag when Aamir turns up, having been sent by Muneeba to keep an eye on Kamala, who is understandably whiny about how she doesn’t need to be chaperoned. It’s a lovely reminder that she’s still a teenager, and her parents, however supportive, are still worried and still Pakistani. She gets past it enough to describe her plan on a blackboard—another call back to episode one—and it’s charming and absolutely befitting of a group of teenagers (plus Aamir), consisting of distraction via softballs, lots of people dressed in the same hoodie, and school science experiments. The vibe, if I may say so, is very much Kevin in Home Alone. That’s a compliment.
Zoe gets on TikTok to tell her many, many followers to get down to the school because Damage Control is surrounding them. As agents in full body armor roam the school hallways, Kamala and co. try to confuse them. It works for a while, as they get covered in foam, pelted with softballs, and confused by some very amateur tricks. It’s a very un-Marvel-like fight, and it works because of that. It’s more realistic to have kids pulling these tricks than using sophisticated weaponry. The simplicity also serves to highlight how ridiculous Agent Deever is being, sending armored soldiers into a school under the guise of keeping people safe. And, if we want to, we can see the weapon imbalance as a metaphor for how ordinary Muslims are faced with disproportionate violence by government agencies.
Kamala’s plan soon falls apart when Bruno gets smashed in the face with a gun, and Nakia, Zoe, and Aamir get trapped on both sides by agents. All four end up handcuffed in a van, waiting and watching along with a huge crowd that includes Kamala’s parents and Tyesha to see what will happen next. For a moment, the action slows down and we zoom into Kamala and Kamran, walking down the empty school hallways. Kamran wants to know what happened to the Clandestines and, more importantly, to his mother Najma. Kamala is reluctant to tell him (having been advised by Bruno that wouldn’t be a good idea to do so before they get Kamran free). But there’s no time for secrets: Kamala reveals the Clandestines were set on destroying everything, and Kamran guesses his mother is dead, which obviously sets him off on a spiral.
As a Damage Control agent attacks, Kamran fights back and Kamala stops him using her giant arm of light. He shakes her off, and then we’re outside, in another one of those brilliant big scenes the show has proved to be so accomplished at. Instead of overlooking a crowded train station, we have Jersey City’s citizens clamoring for information. Plus, DDC agents with guns pointed at the school, and a van of teenagers all watch as an angry Kamran appears. When he refuses to get on his knees, Agent Deever orders her men to shoot, which they do without hesitation.
Luckily, Kamala leaps out of the window above and draws a shield to protect Kamran. It’s enough until Agent Deever pulls out the big guns, literally. A huge stun gun blasts away Kamala’s shield and sends her and Kamran flying. As Muneeba, Yusuf, and the rest of the crowd shout in worry and anger, Agent Deever prepares to shoot again. In some ways, this moment mirrors those Partition scenes from earlier episodes. Everything slows down to zoom in on the distress on everyone’s faces, especially Kamala’s family, and we register intimately the pain a community feels watching a detached entity trying to tear them apart. Kamala summons up some energy with a quiet but firm “Embiggen” as a nod to the comics, using her Noor to create a shield around her body, making her tall and big enough to crush the gun to smithereens.
As Kamala and Kamran continue to try to protect themselves from attacking agents, Kamran eventually again loses control, shooting out huge beams of light that solidify and expand, putting everyone in danger. The only thing Kamala can do is create a dome shield over them and try to talk Kamran down. “They’re never going to accept me, and they’ll never accept you either,” he tells Kamala. He’s not sure he’s ever going to be normal after what has happened, but Kamala points out that Najma saved this world for her son, and there is no such thing as normal. All he can do is escape and try to help himself. He agrees. In what I found to be the only confusing part of the finale, he punches a hole in the ground that presumably takes him to the harbor via a tunnel.
Kamran escapes, leaving Kamala to face Damage Control on her own. Or rather, she’s not on her own. As soon as Agent Deever gives the order for Kamala to be arrested, her friends, family, and community surround her. So do a line of local police, which is sweet, but also feels a bit message-y and unrealistic in an America where police officers are so often in the news for treating people of color in inhumane ways. But I did love how Ms. Marvel has always been about community, and it was really demonstrated here. When Muneeba tells Kamala, “Look, they’re all with you,” I might’ve cried.
It’s enough for Kamala to get away, and for Agent Deever to get a call from an incensed Agent Cleary (Arian Moayed) asking her to leave the scene immediately. And so, the day is saved, Kamala is protected, and everyone lives. There are still a few things to wrap up, namely the big question of who Kamala is, which has occupied so much of the series. There’s a beautiful scene that mirrors episode one, where Kamala looks in her mirror while dressed in her costume. Unlike back then, when she was dressed as Captain Marvel, she now looks comfortable and completely at ease in her own skin.
And then there’s a gorgeous moment between Yusuf and Kamala on the roof, where Kamala tells her dad she’s still “figuring it out” when it comes to her name. And if I’ve said in these recaps once that names are important, I’ve said it many times. Yusuf tells Kamala about her name: Yusuf and Muneeba struggled to have a second child, so when Kamala was born, they thought she was perfect. In Arabic, he says, “kamal” means perfect. In Urdu though, it means wonder or marvel. He tells Kamala she will always be “Our own little Ms. Marvel.” And voila! There it is, Kamala’s iconic superhero name.
Our final mystery is just what Kamala is, and Bruno helps with that, telling her that he looked at her genetic makeup again. He discovered that there’s something different, something “like a mutation.” Um, what is happening here? Is Kamala one of the X-Men? Either way, Kamala doesn’t care because all it means is adding another label to her. For now, she just wants to enjoy time with her friends. She also wants to avoid her science homework in the mid-credits scene, which her mother is shouting at her about. And that’s when Kamala’s bangle starts to glow. She’s suddenly thrust back into her closed closet door, but Kamala isn’t the one who steps back out. It’s her idol, Carol Danvers a.k.a. Captain Marvel (Brie Larson).
Carol looks around the room to come face-to-face with a poster of herself, with a comical “Oh, no no no” slips out of her mouth as she leaves the room. I’d like to take this moment to gloat and say I predicted this cameo before the show premiered. We don’t get any interactions between Vellani and Larson, but I can’t wait to see how their dynamic will develop. With that, we’re told Kamala will be back in next year’s The Marvels, which I’m now looking forward to a whole lot more than I did before “No Normal.” It’s been a rollercoaster of a season, and while the djinn and villain storylines weren’t perfect, this episode is an illustration of everything that did work with the show. It’s great storytelling, with family (in many guises) at its heart, and if Marvel can keep some of this energy for future projects, we’ll all be a little more entertained and moved.
Stray observations
- Kamala might be a rubbish driver, but she respects the rules of the road, as we see when she stops in the sky at a red light on her way to find Bruno and Kamran.
- Is it me or were Nakia and Zoe a little flirty?
- Aamir attempting to give Kamran the talk and being disturbed while doing so feels very Aamir.
- My favorite part of the TikTok montage at the end has to be Auntie Ruby, who is on the typical Pakistani mom brand when she says it will be “very difficult for her to find a husband” when talking about Ms. Marvel.
- Among the other callbacks to episode one was the reuse of the fantastic song “Ko Ko Kareena.”
- Kamala and Kamran almost kissed! And Bruno interrupted them! Classic love triangle moment, and felt right.
- Adil and Bilall were back as directors for this finale, and you could see their touch in the return of graphics on the screen.
- Sheikh Abdullah was giving great advice this episode, including confusing Agent Deever by quoting from Abraham Lincoln and not the Quran.
- And, of course, the best advice came from Kamala’s dad, in a call out to one of the most famous lines from the comic books. Yusuf tells Kamala: “If you saved one life, well, you saved them all.”
- Speaking of comic books, this episode took its name from the title of the first volume of the Ms. Marvel comics.
- Thank you for following along with my recaps of the show.
271 Comments
Loved the little X-Men sting when they lampshaded ‘we’re not going to tell you what Kamala is nor does she care’. All in all the emotional beats hit really well even if the near heel-turn for Kamran was a little too trite and predictable.
I had called a Captain Marvel cameo but I had *not* expected it to be a Nega-Band situation between the two of them. Though I suppose it makes sense to go in that direction with the bangles.
Oh and I forgot to mention that, for being largely a bookend character only mattering in the first episode and this one, it actually does reveal a lot about Zoe’s character. Not only was she not willing to cooperate with Damage Control in general but the reveal that she knew, all along, it was Kamala and not only did not out her to DC but nor to anyone else either.
It did make a nice pace of change having the popular girl in school not being a super mean to everyone and only thinking about herself.
It did make a nice pace of change having the popular girl in school not being a super mean and self centred.
The creators of Miss Marvel have been on record that the only reason she is a Inhuman in the comics is because of the Marvels editorial at the time. I’m wondering if this reveal in the MCU is going to cause a retcon for comic Miss Marvel making her actual a mutant and it was just a fluke that her powers manifested the same day as a mass Terrigan mist exposure. I’m cool with that as long as she stays off the X teams. She can hang with them for cross overs but I really don’t want her on an X team
you talking about her on an x-team in the comics or mcu?i don’t read the comics but i wouldn’t be opposed to her mcu counterpart taking summer classes at xavier’s institute. would be an interesting framing to see her as a fanboy of superheroes that are accepted and then studying with those who are hated.then again by the time we get there the actor will probably be 40.
The comics mostly but the MCU as well a bit. I just want her to be her own thing and not part of a team where she may get overshadowed
I hope she does not become a mutant. Online X-Men fans are a different breed, to put it nicely.They will demand that Kamala join the X-Men and go to their cult island because they are her family.Yeah, as a Black man, every other Black person I don’t know is family and my actual blood family are nobodies.And I’m not exaggerating. Not too long ago, Dan Slott wrote an FF story that had the X-cult saying that Franklin Richards should go with them because he’s a mutant. Then they find out that he isn’t a mutant and lost interest in Franklin (IIRC). X-Men fans on CBR went nuts.
Yea, this is why it kinda rubbed me the wrong way when the reviewer asked “Is Kamala one of the X-Men?”“And I’m not exaggerating. Not too long ago, Dan Slott wrote an FF story that had the X-cult saying that Franklin Richards should go with them because he’s a mutant. Then they find out that he isn’t a mutant and lost interest in Franklin (IIRC). X-Men fans on CBR went nuts.”They did almost the same thing with Cloak and Dagger
X-Men fans on CBR went nuts.Yeaahh, CBR. That’s your problem right there.
“Not too long ago, Dan Slott wrote an FF story that had the X-cult saying that Franklin Richards should go with them because he’s a mutant. Then they find out that he isn’t a mutant and lost interest in Franklin (IIRC). X-Men fans on CBR went nuts.”The lesson here is to pretty much ignore any changes or new continuity that Dan Slott introduces in characters. He’s really bad at it.For example, in ASM #800 he introduced Emily Osborn, Norman’s wife and Harry’s mother. She had only appeared in flashback, and either died while giving birth to Harry or when he was very young. She was very much a non-character. But Slott decided to bring her back/introduce her and readers were like “Why? Who asked for this?” She has since been ignored and never mentioned again.
There was a nice beat in a recent Champions series where she and other Champions were on the Marauders ship (but not allowed to Krakoa). It was good dynamic that they should keep.
You mean like how Spiderman did when he met the X men?
They made ms marvel inhuman because at the time fox had the rights to all mutants and they didn’t want to introduce any mutants that would become popular enough that a movie/tv show could be made about them. Now its largy irrelevant, but don’t see it changing anytime soon.
They’re going to walk like Egyptians?
Really wish they could’ve done literally any character work on Kamran to make his turn less rote. The moment he got yellow/green light, it was apparent we were headed for another hero-fights-mirror-version climax.
He didn’t “turn” though. He just lashed out against the people who were trying to lock him up, attacked him and his friends, and were willing to shoot him in cold blood. I was dreading this too but they handled it really well.
Except that’s not what we got. Kamala resolved the situation by talking to Kamran, not by fighting him.
Despite the faults of the 6 episode template and some plot points and character stuff that seemed a little rushed here just to keep things tidy, I’m gonna say it! This is the best MCU show thus far! It made me feel things, happy things! It was joyful and fun and nuanced and heartfelt and, potentially most importantly, made me excited to see what happens next. It endeared me to an entire cast of characters rather than just the one or two titular main characters. It was diverse and progressive without being heavy handed. Tonally and thematically, it was completely cohesive. Just some great work all around. Look forward to seeing more
I’m still holding a torch for Agents of SHIELD as my #1 Marvel TV show (haven’t seen this one yet) which is still in the curious quantum state of the MCU being part of it but it not necessarily being part of the MCU (still waiting for the definitive declaration one way or the other). They’ve done years worth of not exactly X-Men with the Inhumans (not to be confused with the show).Still, it’s the MCU’s loss if it isn’t as far as I’m concerned.
The really tricky bit there is that no one bothered to tell the Agents crew that Endgame was going to permanently move the franchise five years into the future, which means the last two seasons are basically impossible to reconcile with the larger franchise.
It seems terribly unfair. The AoS people had to clear everything with the MCU film division (in case the films wanted to use something which would bar the TV show I guess) and they also had to hang around until Winter Soldier happened before they could do what they really wanted to do.I wouldn’t be surprised if that delay damaged the show because they lost viewers because of the wait that never came back.Anyway, if the MCU film division wanted to keep the Snap secret even from the TV people (even though it’s in the comics and Mark Ruffalo all but blurted it on in an interview well before the premiere), they could have at least told them “You see where you’ve written one year later? Make it 5 (or more) – no particular reason.” That’s all they had to do.As for reconciling it now, I guess the easiest way to do so could be saying a timeline where Coulson survived is one that was pruned by the TVA but it sprang back into existence after Kang was killed. As a result, something happened where Thanos was defeated within a year of Ebony Maw turning up in New York perhaps. Hence it reconciles the 1 year later stuff that way.It’s a shame because they were playing ball right up to Season 5 with Thanos being mentioned along with what must have been the New York battle but the people making AoS weren’t even trusted with the subsequent events or the very least told they might want to move their 1 year out by a few, they didn’t even have to be told why.
Could just go with their time travel stuff branching them off to a timeline that He Who Remains allowed in order to move the Darkhold around and put some things in place for the future. Then bring them back to a post ‘blip’ world all confused.
He Who Remains did say to Sylvie, “You can’t get to the end until you’ve been changed by the journey.”
My thoughts on resolving the AoS situation – Enoch pulling the AoS to the future dropped them into a new timeline, which they stayed in when they got back to the “present,” just in time to fly off to help defeat Thanos (picture a still hyper-powered Daisy and Yo-Yo pulling a “shake and take” on the Infinity Gauntlet). They branch into a new timeline in Season 7, but they ended the series back in the “Enoch” timeline. So maybe the events of “Loki” finally put them back in their original timeline…
a timeline where Coulson survived…is not a timeline in which Agents of SHIELD took place. It is extremely significant to the plot of the show that he actually died in The Avengers.
It’s significant to the plot of the show and The Avengers that they think he died in the events of that movie. Not necessarily quite the same thing …
This is true for the Avengers film but not AOS. Him dying and having been resurrected is a major plot of the show.
No, it’s important that he died. Finding out how he was resurrected after being “dead for days” (a character says that, WITH the emphasis) is a major motive for the season 1 villains, those same means build towards another reveal in season 2, it’s used to justify a plot point introduced at the end of season 4 (which then pays off in the back half of season 5), we see the method used again in the first half of season 5, & it informs LMD Coulson’s existential crisis in season 7.
(Also, it’s the means by which Carol Danvers’s life was saved after the lightspeed engine exploded on her in Captain Marvel.)
AoS is one of my favorite shows even outside of Marvel. I won’t ever deny its weaker spots, but it had heart, some great storylines, some shockers, and often excellent FX. Plus, the cast and crew genuinely seemed to care enough about it to see it all the way through and give it a pretty decent ending. It’s my one of my go-tos for Big Feels.
Nothing is actually contradicted. The only “problem” is that nobody talks about the blip.
My favourite explanation is that time travel shenanigans resulted in them branching off from the main timeline in season 5.
I very much enjoyed the stuff of Agents of Shield that I saw (fell off after awhile with the knowledge it will always be there for me to pick back up and enjoy at some point, canon be damned) so once I get around to finishing it, I may be right there with ya. I also hold Daredevil pretty high and probably think it is actually #1 for me, but until recently it, too, was in the same state of limbo (and still might be? idk if it’s been made completely clear yet if Netflix Daredevil and Kingpin are Disney+ Daredevil and Kingpin?)Regardless, enjoy Ms. Marvel when you get to it! It is, at this moment, my favorite of the MCU *Disney+* shows at least
idk if it’s been made completely clear yet if Netflix Daredevil and Kingpin are Disney+ Daredevil and Kingpin?D’Onofrio hasn’t been made to retract his statement that the producers told him it was the same, & the costume designer on Hawkeye deliberately mimicked elements of Fisk’s wardrobe from Daredevil, so I’m going with yes.
I liked Kamala, her friends, and family and I look forward to more of them. Everything with the government folks was kinda lame all season, though.I too liked that “very difficult to find a husband” joke. It’s kind of nice getting more “lower-deck” views in the MCU and how normal people react to all this crazy stuff.
Didn’t this show get the memo? This is MCUTV, the finale is supposed to suck!
I think the only finale that has been truly bad has been TFATWS. I could hear an argument about Wandavision as well as I think the show wussed out of portraying Wanda as an antagonist for her actions. But largely enjoyed Loki, Moon Knight, and Hawkeye.
wandavision’s was a little low rent looking but i chalked that up to finishing filming during very early pandemic.
WandaVision was hot trash IMO, great premise that ends without any actual examination into the ramifications of Wanda’s actions and turns an interesting villain into a generic baddy that lets Wanda be a hero. TFATWS is a weak ending to a weak series. Loki is directionless throughout and ends with a tease for the MCU instead of any sense of closure. Hawkeye builds up this massive confrontation that fizzles like a wet fart. Moon Knight was the best so far, but still ends on a cliffhanger despite no plans for a continuation.
right yeah i forgot how disappointed i was that loki wasn’t a one-and-done.you also forgot to mention what if, meaning that it must have had the best ending of them all.
Honestly What If was a decided “fine” throughout IMO, it’s its own beast next to the live action stuff.
it’s probably the only one i’ll ever rewatch any of.
Loki wasn’t meant to give you a sense of closure – it was never meant to be a one-season show. There were leaks when it was airing that there was a second season coming and that was announced pretty shortly after it ended. I thought Jonathon Majors was great and the episode set up season two well.And then I’ll just disagree with you on Hawkeye – I thought the majority of the action in the final episode was a lot of fun to watch and the only disappointing piece was with Kingpin. I liked the actual ending to the show, with Kate going to Clint’s house for Christmas a lot too.Moon Knight is quite obviously going to get a follow-up project no matter what Oscar says. In fact, I’d say the assumption going into any MCU project is that there will be some follow-up unless it’s an abject failure. With Moon Knight, the character, he fits in pretty neatly with the Midnight Suns that Marvel is clearly developing. But even if it doesn’t, I think the ending still works as more of an ambigous closure for the character – that he’s not truly free and may never be.
did you miss the memo…wanda vision was called out for not putting it to wanda for all she did…now that the movie came out multiverse of madness…wanda isn’t an anti hero that started out a villain but is now a misunderstood woman that got the shaft and should have been redeemed in the show people said was bad cause it redeemed her and she solved all her grief in the show people said was too short to solve all her grief and at the same time her grief unsolved and answering the issues people had is bad too cause they didn’t get enough time to learn why she turned evil all the while we made a show on why she’s sad but that show was too long and the movie too short and….and…marvel fans are so hard to please. Glad marvel just does what they want for the most part or we get rise of skywalker the movie that all the fanboys want to fix their issues while noticing oh yeah fanboys just complain and cant really write well either.
Imprisons a whole town and psychically tortures them for months if not years ‘They’ll never know what you sacrificed for them.’ – yeah no Monica, are you stupid?
“But you put things right in the end and that was never in doubt. I’m not here to talk about WestView.” – yeah no Stephen, are you stupid? (Actually given your actions in the last couple of movies you’ve been in, quite possibly!)Then after that, Wanda commits multiple spree killings and mass murder. What a fucking shitshow. Even Peacemaker has a consistent line of thought and reasoning for his actions and beliefs, however twisted. Plus a much more justifiable reason, it turns out.When Peacemaker’s kicking your ass in the morality stakes … well, once again like I said – fucking shitshow.
“Imprisons a whole town and psychically tortures them for months if not years”
No idea where you’re getting this timeline from. It was a matter of days, a week at most.
(I always wondered why no one in SWORD suggested just letting Wanda play the whole thing out, since she was so rapidly progressing through decades of television. What would have happened after she was done with the “Modern Family”-inspired sitcom setting? Does she start over from the 50s again, or would it just be out of her system?)
That line from Monica was pretty tone-deaf, though, and I had hoped the show would end with Wanda turning herself in.
I still think the way she was handled in Multiverse of Madness was a huge departure from what we saw in Wandavision, though. Monica shouldn’t have praised Wanda for her “sacrifice,” but it is true that Wanda gave up the family she had created because she felt bad about the fact that she was hurting people, and didn’t want to do that anymore. Then in MoM her entire plan is to murder America Chavez AND the other Wanda in order to kidnap the other Wanda’s children, just because they look like the ones she made, and she kills people left and right to accomplish that goal. Way too big a jump to me and it seemed like a worse repeat of the arc she had already finished in Wandavision.
“Imprisons a whole town and psychically tortures them for months if not years”
No idea where you’re getting this timeline from. It was a matter of days, a week at most. I honestly lost track as to how long she’d been there before SWORD got there, then how much time had passed before the characters we knew from Thor and Ant-Man among others turned up.Either way, even a few days of this would have been enough to scar people for life, especially children.
Rewatching the fourth episode now, and the SWORD director tells Monica it’s been three weeks since half the population came back at the end of Endgame. Agent Woo makes it sound like his witness protection guy went off the grid that day or the day before. And given how quickly Wanda starts cycling through the decades even before she’s aware of SWORD’s intervention, it just doesn’t make sense for the show to take place over the course of anything more than a week. (I will be forever curious about what would have happened if she had just been allowed to keep going. Would the modern sitcom be such a dissatisfying fantasy world that she just gets bored and snaps back to reality all by herself?)
Agreed that the people of Westview will have lasting damage, but Wanda didn’t know that when she inadvertently started the Hex, and by the time she started to realize it, she was in deep denial. Doesn’t justify any of what she did, especially once she had reason to suspect she was hurting people, but I still feel like her actions in Multiverse of Madness don’t track and basically ruin her arc from Wandavision.
You know what? You just convinced me to rewatch Peacemaker.
I am not your father but I’m glad something good came of out of all this.
What the fuck is up with these superlatives? Hot trash? I mean – you’re entitled to a (shitty) opinion but the hyperbole is just tiring and boring at this point.Fuck off with this nonsense – even if you disliked the episode it was better than 90% of released television content in the past decade.
Every single one of those shows, despite valid criticisms (although you’ve yet to provide any) – are still better than the vast majority of television released in the past decade. It’s amazing how extreme opinions like yours are.
How dare you knock TFATWS. You need to try harder, AKA!
The Loki finale goes near the top of the list for me just because it mostly eschews the typical finale bullshit and lets Jonathan Majors gnosh on the scenery
Agreed. On paper the Loki finale is a terrible idea, but it 100% worked for me.I even disagree with the people who say it offered no conclusion to what came before. Sylvie gets her revenge and Loki figures out what the TVA was up to. It ends on a cliffhanger that was mostly set up within the episode itself, as opposed to leaving plots from the overall season dangling.
I loved Hawkeye overall but was pretty disappointed by the finale
this was a nice show. nowhere near the top of my mcu stuff, but very comfortably atop the disney+ shows (wandavision will always be the one i had the most fun watching, but that mostly had to do with the pandemic of it all [and i preferred the friday release])i understand why they did it, but i think the india stuff really zapped the momentum from the show. that being said they definitely stuck the landing with this final episode.however, with all of that, i still feel the same way i felt about moon knight: i think it would have been better as a movie. last year, the shows were all about expanding movie characters and the movies were introducing new ones. they’ve flipped that this year and i don’t think it works as well, even in a case like this where i think they did a pretty damn good job.
also after seeing what adil and bilall did here i am very stoked to see their take on batgirl
Well, this comment didn’t age well.
The Karachi episodes had great stuff with the mother/daughter relationships and flashback, but Kamala felt like a passenger in both and the show sorely missed the Jersey supporting cast. This show should’ve been eight episodes.
i would have rather either seen the karachi stuff expanded upon to be a whole ‘kamala in india’ second season or excised completely and done 2-episodes about late homework or something really grounded.
Be a bit weird to extend Karachi to a season in India instead of Pakistan.
got my ass!
To unget your ass a bit, the sequence in the past was in India!
The back-in-time scenes were in India, no?
I feel like the Karachi episodes would have worked better with more of the sketchbook flourishes that the Jersey episodes had. They should have felt more like we were still seeing things from inside Kamala’s head. The one exception should have been the flashback to her Great-Grandma’s youth, which would have stood out all the more due to breaking us out of Kamala’s perspective.Also yes, both this show and Moon Knight really needed to be 8 episodes. Hell, Wandavision was 9 episodes! I wonder why the episode counts shrank so quickly. Was it a Covid thing?
“ but i think the india stuff really zapped the momentum from the show”It was incredibly important that partition be explained and shown. It’s always forgotten as a major event where estimates vary between 1 – 2 MILLION people who died. Yet, people barely know about it or acknowledge it. I don’t give a flying fuck that it slowed the momentum down, I’m glad it’s becoming a part of actual mainstream discussion, because seriously – FUCK the British. That entire fucking country deserves to have a full on economic crash.
How did you even type this? Did you write it in Notebook or something, then c/p it into the comment? Because you would have to, stupidly, an actively fight against any other program or browser that would have you properly capitalize words.
uh nah man i just hit reply and i type and then i hit publish.
The mutation line also had a riff from xmen 97 as it was said. Make of that what you will
“Hey Perlmutter, remember when you made us sideline the FF and downplay X-Men so we tried miserably to make Inhumans happen? WELP”
Might have been the best season finale for a MCU show yet and really stuck that landing. The return to New Jersey really helped to snap things into focus after the detour in Pakistan, especially since this was returning to the cast and relationships established successfully in the first three episodes, giving things weight and meaning on a very different level.The Damage Control stuff was so weird, though, that I wondered if there had been a mandated rewrite late in the process there. Like I don’t find a rogue difficult to believe, but they didn’t really build that up for Deever in the previous episodes. Thus it ended up feeling like this bizarre crammed element here to make it clear how it was an individual going against orders instead of being a larger element of that government organization.
Ah, you’re right — not quite the trainwreck that cutting out the ‘release a plague’ thing seemed to be for TFATWS, because that show was a pile of loose dorknobs, villain-wise, but maybe it does explain some of the later-half wonkiness for this show that the higher-ups suddenly told them ‘wait, we’re spinning DoDC in a different direction, cut all that’?
Thank you, I felt very similar. Deever was incredibly hostile and obsessive… but there wasn’t any story to give her that motivation or sell it to us, the audience. We’ve seen Damage Control twice before. It was very weird, like part of an entirely different story we hadn’t been privy to. Damage Control are dumb.
I totally forgot they were even part of the Spider-Man movie.
I’m not sure we need to see a reason to understand how or why Deevers is such an asshole. She’s a heavy handed and over the top villain who nevertheless feels extremely real today, and I don’t doubt there are a hundred of them roaming the halls at TSA and various other government agencies right this second. It’s enough that we know there are still governmental agencies want to maintain control in a world with powered people, and that some of the people they employ are also racist bullies.
This exactly. Marvel’s mutants have always been used for metaphors on bigotry, so it makes sense for the final antagonist of this show to be a bigot.
We know from set photos taken from the streets where they filmed that Deever and the DODC agents were originally N.I.C.E., so there were definitely some rewrites happening here. Probably just an occasion where they realized that it was superfluous to have a separate org when it could just be part of DODC, but yeah.
Agent Deever has the look and acting style of an antagonist from a bad Disney Channel/Nickelodeon kids “sitcom.” Someone named something along the lines of Vice Principal Fartz. It is unfortunate.
Yeah, it’s the same “only six episodes” problem they keep having: not enough time to develop all the elements. This should have been eight episodes, which would have given them time to have the DODC subplot be more than a handwave, and given the djinn subplot room to avoid such a rapid resolution.I thought the rest of the show (Kamala’s arc, her family, etc.) was delightful and I’m really looking forward to The Marvels now because of her.
The Damage Control stuff with Deevers smells like a 6 episode limit problem to me. They likely had all kind of good ideas and plot points planned out, but as with episode 5, they had to rush a lot of stuff into the finish. Deevers seems like one of those things (as was Zoe just popping back up). I’ve read that Disney+ doesn’t have a “mandate” supposedly, but its no accident all these shows keep having 6 episodes. And its becoming a trend that each of these series ends up having some pacing issues because of it.
I wonder if the problem is that they don’t have an episode limit, but they do have a budget limit, and that becomes a de facto episode limit. The only ones so far to deviate are Wandavision and What If…?. The second was probably pretty cheap to make comparably, and if I had to pick a show or two to spend a little more time and effort on it would have been Wandavision and Loki.
Then again, She-Hulk is apparently nine episodes, and whatever you think of the effects, it probably cost a lot more than anything else recently.
It felt like they realised they needed DC for something more sympathetic somewhere else later on so suddenly switched to a rogue agent being the antagonist rather than the whole organisation.
WandaVision and What If also had shorter episodes than the others: The first few of the former were mirroring sitcom format, & the latter was half-hour the whole way through. Given the advertised comedic tone of She-Hulk, it’ll probably also have shorter episodes. The total runtime across the board is about the same, though.
The more I think on it, the more I think it is not the 6 episode order, but rather the Karachi detour that was the issue here as those two episodes really don’t fit that well with the story in the other four episodes. Actually not only that, but they contradict certain plot elements introduced in the first three episodes, for example the Clandestine needing two bangles, and really rush through an odd amount of stuff. It also led to there being some notable character pieces missing here such as with Deevers and Zoe.This next is complete speculation, but I do wonder if the original plan was there to be two seasons, first in New Jersey and second in Karachi, but they for some reason ended up cramming them together? As without the Karachi stuff, I actually think the show would have had an excellent pace and overall arc.
The Karachi detour would’ve been fine in a longer season or as a longer arc. We barely met the leader of the Red Daggers before he’s killed. Both my wife and I jokingly lamented oh no, not that guy!! because we barely had time to even learn his name.
Marvel Studios would never commit to two seasons from the get go. That said Ali, the head writer, is giving interviews, and she’s quite frank about why some plot points feel disjointed:
No. I would say that a lot is missing. There are, like, essays we’ve written about the Clandestines, the Noor dimension, the Red Daggers and about how it’s all connected to everything else. There are huge swathes of character arcs that for the purpose of being able to make this in the time that we had, with the situation that changed [due to] COVID — I think we miss out a lot on some of the parallels between the two different kinds of families. I think we’ve missed out a lot on some of the character development for the Clandestines. I wish I could have shown you more of what we had.The interviewer doesn’t follow up with question as to exactly why the pandemic would’ve changed the original scripts (which were written pre-Covid), but it certainly seems like Ali expected to have more episodes than what she ended up with, and then had to condense the script to fit. The obvious answer would be D+ needed productions to get content out faster as soon as Covid protocols were lifted, because they were already behind, so they cut production time on already greenlighted projects. Falcon and the Winter Soldier certainly seemed to suffer that same fate, as it felt like their were entire episodes of character arcs missing as well.
Marvel Studios would never commit to two seasons from the get go. They actually did commit to 2 seasons in advance on Loki and What If, but those also both take place outside of the main timeline, so maybe that’s a factor?
Well, those two shows are not taking a chance on a new character. Loki was already an established – and extremely popular – character, and What If? was alternate versions of established characters/stories.“Loki? Hell yeah, you can have 2 seasons of that. The fans will eat that up! Ms. Marvel? Hmm, well, we’ll give you a first season and see what the reaction is, then we’ll talk about more.”
They could have really done a Deever episode, perhaps showing her being personally affected by a superhero event, may be something new that we haven’t seen rather than the attack on New York.
I think they might be building up momentum for the introduction of the Xmen and the suspicion and fear they generate. Now, it’s just this one rogue agent going overkill on a couple of kids with powers, but when it’s a whole bunch of mutants, there’s going to be enough people at Damage Control who’re going to be more on the rogue agent’s side.
Premiere and finale aside, as much as I loved Ms. Marvel it was such an uneven show. Some parts (high school/Jersey City) worked incredibly well and others (Clandestine, Red Daggers, Djinn, Damage Control) felt tacked on or like they were rushing through seasons worth of story in a few episodes.I don’t mind any one thing in a vacuum but tonally it felt like the show was all over the place. Even the fun artwork from the opening eps completely disappeared in the middle.
I’m torn on the hint that Kamala might be a mutant. One hand, it is a genuinely intriguing indication how they might introduce the mutants to MCU and while I don’t know how they would Xavier, Magneto and Logan in that scenario, it is exciting to think how they would handle such a rising new force there. Also it would be great to see someone finally do justice to Scott on the big screen.However, it just doesn’t make sense from the perspective of the story as it tied her powers so much to the bangle and Kamran ended up getting the same powers.
FWIW, I thought the mutant tag was deeply cringe and I wonder if it wasn’t part of the original script. Bruno’s earlier explanation (that it was genetic rather than entirely the bangle) was plenty for narrative handwavery.I’ve never read the comics so I have no idea how X-Men has treated mutation vs. a heritable trait, but Kamala with her non-human lineage and magical artifact feels incredibly overcooked, and Kamran makes even less sense than that. Like, what is a mutation supposed to mean in this context and how would Bruno even spot it? These are questions I do not want to ask, not least because the show certainly doesn’t appear to have considered the answers.[edit to add: I was generally happy with the series/enjoyed the final, that first tag just landed really sour for me]
I didn’t even think about it at first, but it really does feel like something added really late in the process. Like at a point when everything else was done.Just look Bruno in that scene. In the montage before that we see Bruno slipping a letter to someone’s locker as he is leaving, the implication being that it his farewell to Kamala. However, then in that first tag scene, he’s just chilling with everyone again there. Like it made no sense.And that isn’t even to start how utterly non-sensical Kamala being a mutant in the context of the show is.
In the montage before that we see Bruno slipping a letter to someone’s locker as he is leavingWhen was that? Bruno wasn’t in the montage. The closest thing I can see is when he was hooking up something before Zoe’s distress call.
He’s in the final montage before that tag (the one that also shows Nakia and Zoe doing social media videos together) – he’s wearing a blue CalTech hoodie and he slips a note into (presumably) Kamala’s locker with a sad face.
Oh, I don’t know how I missed that. Thanks.
Bruno’s section in the montage is probably after that stinger scene chronologically.
The montage at the very end of the show, not during the fight with Damage Control preparation. I double-checked it before making that comment.
Yeah, that letter was completely abandoned. It looked like he was slipping it into Kamala’s locker before leaving to Caltech without saying goodbye to her personally. But then it just is not mentioned or referenced to anymore. We’ll never find out what he wrote. 😉 (Actually, I had also forgotten that letter until you mentioned it in your comment!)
The x-gene in the comics is a genetic mutation heralding the beginning of the next stage in human evolution. Homo superior (mutant) children are born to homo sapiens (regular human) parents.MCU Kamala’s “noor” heritage determined what her power is, but not that she got a power. Surely Sana & Muneeba, both also descended from Aisha, would also have worn the bangle at some point in their youths, but neither of them ever activated superpowers; they didn’t have the x-gene.Kamran is a different case, because his “noor” mother deliberately used her abilities to empower him as she died. He doesn’t have the x-gene.
I don’t have an issue with the reveal, but the idea that this is something Bruno discovered was a little silly.
Bruno “noticed” it, I doubt he actually “discovered” it. The fact that he noticed makes it very likely that others already have, it’s just not public knowledge yet. I agree it would be ridiculous for him to be the first person to discover the x-gene.I actually thought he was gonna be like “There’s something different about you. Something… inhuman.”
It’s not realistic that an orphan high school kid is doing full genomic sequencing and analysis at home using equipment he bought with his convenience store salary?
It actually explains some things though. Much of her family has the same ancestry, but somehow either no one else ever wore the bangle, or no one else who wore the bangle exhibited powers. What makes Kamala so special? Her having a mutation that allows her to access Noor even in this dimension is a cool way to explain that. The show established back in episode 2 that the bangle isn’t the source of her powers anyway.
My guess is Marvel will root mutation in complications from the Snap and the Blip, assuming they continue to reference those events in their properties as new content drifts further and further away from Endgame.
– What a delight this show has been! Hands down the best finale of all Disney+ Marvel shows. Well deserved A grade.- Totally adore Kamala and all her friends and family. Give or take Kamran and Kareem. Team Bruno all the way. And yes, shipping Nakia and Zoe hard.- Is this the first teenage protagonist of any genre to have not only a happy and healthy family, but also accept her hero role?- I am glad they clarified the meaning of Kamala’s name, and was pleasantly surprised to have it tied to Marvel directly. In spite of being a fluent Hindi speaker, which is close to Urdu, I did not catch that. The name Kamala is way more common among Hindus (Hello, VP Harris), and it means lotus. Also while pronouncing the Hindu version, the ‘a’ sound after m is not prolonged. All 3 syllables are short syllables with no extended sounds. My ignorant self was annoyed at the apparent mispronunciation of the name. Every time they pointed that her name was unusual among Muslims, I thought of course, because it is a Hindu name. But clearly they knew what they were doing.Lastly, to every review bomber out there – continue wallowing in hatred, your existence is pitiful and you don’t deserve joy or any such good things.
“Is this the first teenage protagonist of any genre to have not only a happy and healthy family, but also accept her hero role?”Stargirl has done this well (check it out if you haven’t, it’s a good DC series)
I liked this episode for the most part, but the most sci-fi beat by far was the idea that NYPD would back up a Muslim community against government aggression.
It’s the Jersey City PD, asserting their jurisdiction once they realized the feds from DoDC fucked up.
The only thing local cops hate more than brown people is the feds pissing all over their jurisdiction.
Yeah, I took this as the Jersey cops were locals who lived and worked in this community. When Kamala was using her powers and you saw the crowd applauding, there was a shot of one of the cops applauding too.
So the MCU is just officially a secret ID free zone. I’m okay with that. It was always a super hero convention that outlived its use for most characters. I think it works for Batman and Superman but for most Marvel characters it was just silly. I think there are far better stories to be told about parents of a superhero worrying about them then the “Three Company” level antics of hiding a secret identify from everyone
except spider-man, who ironically no longer has anyone in his life to protect that would necessitate a secret identity.
I really dislike the modern beliefs that superheroes don’t need to keep their identity a secret and can share it with friends and family, or just have it be public knowledge, and there are no consequences.The Flash is the worst offender of this, as pretty much everyone knows Barry is the Flash, and he reveals his identity to new characters after he’s known them for 1-2 episodes. Has Barry forgotten that Thawne killed his mother after he learned that Barry was the Flash?I don’t want anything to happen to Kamala’s family, but a small part of me kinda hopes some established/future MCU hero shares their identity (either with friends/family or the public) and it has disastrous consequences.
So many people pretending they care about the Inhumans right now. Guys, just say you hate the show because you’re racist. I’d actually have more respect for that position.
I’ve been a comics fan since I was five, and I’m in my forties now. Anybody who says they care about the Inhumans is a liar. They’ve always been at best weird foils/allies for the FF. Black Bolt and Medusa are cool, but the tv show was total garbage and the only reason Kamala was INhuman in the first place was Perlmutter’s insanity. OH NO WHAT ABOUT THE INHUMANSSee, nobody cares. Almost guarantee Kamala would have been a mutant had things been “normal.”
There are two times I’ve actually liked the Inhumans. Most recently was the arc in Ultimate Fantastic Four (where Johnny is convinced he loves Crystal but in the end when she has to go back.. well, maybe it wasn’t REALLY love, there are other girls.The other time was a Neal Adams run, I think in Amazing Adventures, back in the 70s. All I have to say to defend my liking of that is: it was Neal Adams, goddamnit. Just beautiful artwork, with a script that actually humanized Black Bolt, Medusa, Gorgon and Karnak. I wouldn’t say Lockjaw was humanized, but he was a very good dog.
Saladin Ahmed’s Black Bolt mini series is a wonderful trippy read where Blackagar and Absorbing Man wake up on a punitive space prison and together work out how to escape their external and internal captivity. Warren Ellis’s Karnak mini series is a decisive update of the character and makes the missed opportunity of Ken Leung’s casting all the more shameful.
For me Dan Abnett & Andy Lanning made them work in their War Of Kings space crossover, especially Crystal, but they were on a roll back then.
I mean, not that you care, but this is wrong. I’m absolutely sad about no Inhumans. I have always loved those characters and their narrative – also, LOCKJAW. I’m not going to rage online about it, but I don’t need like the Inhumans to feel smart; a sweeping psychic assuredness of everyone else’s true feelings seems a lot more like that need. My decades-old Kirby Black Bolt shirt has nothing to do with Perlmutter being a racist fuck.
I’m def over generalizing. The current screaming about WHY NO INHUMANS is eyerolling. Lockjaw RULES.
Totally fair. I can be sad about no Inhumans and have a normal understanding about no Inhumans.
No one cares
“also, LOCKJAW”I loved the story where it was revealed that Lockjaw could talk, and have never forgiven Marvel for retconning that by saying the other Inhumans were playing a joke on The Thing and that Lockjaw couldn’t really talk.
I care.I will stand by saying Agents of SHIELD did a very good job with the Inhumans and I’m Sri Lankan so there’s a chance I’m not racist towards people from Pakistan on top of that.
The Inhumans stuff on AoS was great, and I love that show to death, but I don’t think that it necessarily needs to continue on. It would be a little hard to reconcile it going forward anyway, since the Terrigen leak happened like a decade ago in this timeline. Although what a way to tie up that loose Vijay thread if they did try it.
Vijay’s the one who was chained by his ankle and thrown overboard, right? Which is a terrible way to dispose of a corpse, the ankle is a weak point which is why so many shoes with human feet in them kept washing up on the Canadian coastline because that’s where the feet separate from the rest of the body because of decomposition and they also didn’t stab the abdomen several times to prevent the build up of gas that combined with the chain to the ankle would inevitably have led to the had he been a regular human now dead corpse unavoidably floating to surface and I just realised I’m revealing that I know far too much about how to dispose of a body in a body of water, aren’t I?
The more I learn about you, the more shit starts making sense.
To give Perlmutter a bit of a break, that whole Inhumans thing came down from up high. They didn’t want new characters introduced as mutants because Fox had all the rights to mutants at the time, and it would forgo the characters being able to be adapted into the MCU. That’s also why they retconned Squirrel Girl into not being a mutant. Now with the merger, that’s not an issue any more.
That doesn’t give him a break; Perlmutter was the “up high” of Marvel at the time.
…… Perlmutter IS up high.
Perlmutter was (and still IS) the CEO of Marvel, what “up high” would he answer to? Did the shareholders themselves suddenly decide to micromanage?
My problem with The Inhumans, what little I know about them, is it seems to me that Black Bolt and Medusa are basically the Massa and Missus of a slave plantation on the moon. Am I wrong about this? When the TV show was on the air, I was just thinking “Why am I supposed to sympathise with slavemasters?”I liked what AoS did with them a whole lot better.Maybe a tiny part of the people who don’t like the show have a valid reason, but for 90+ percent of them it’s just good old fashioned racism and misogyny/
I never watched the show, so as a comics guy I will admit this reading seems a bit insane.
If I remember the show right, anyone who didn’t get a cool power after Terrigenesis ended up working in the mines, for whatever they mined up there. The only reason Maximus wasn’t in the mines was because he was Black Bolt’s brother. Maximus was essentially right, other than being a kinda rapey wierdo. Also, trying to make anyone sympathize with any royal family in this day and age is a hard task.
I’ve always been a huge fan of the Inhumans, and they’ve had lots of real peaks (the Paul Jenkins/Jae Lee series, War of Kings, everything about them in Earth X, etc.), but I didn’t enjoy much about the “Inhumans are the new X-Men” initiative, and, since that isn’t in play in the MCU, I’m not in the least upset that they separated Kamala from Inhumans. If mutants are now going to be the mutants in the MCU (instead of the originally planned Inhumans), it makes more sense that Kamala is a mutant than otherwise.But this was a great show, and the haters are the exact same boys who complain about women and POC in their media. Even more than with Star Wars or something like that, it boggles the mind that there are Marvel “fans” who are like that, given that the “wokeness” messages they object to have been pretty central to Marvel since jump.
Okay, I *really* like your point. I’m being hyperbolic about “nobody liking the Inhumans.” What you say about “Inhumans are the new X-Men” nails it for me! It was a weird initiative and… Black Bolt and Medusa and company don’t really work in that context, that’s not what makes their best stories work. They have this weird, regal, separate status and they’re clearly more Cosmic Kirby! Yeah Stan Lee and Marvel have been “woke” since the 60s. But I mean Star Trek has always envisioned a utopian progressive future, and their fanbase has reactionary bigots as well. I don’t have a lot of hope anymore.
I remember that issue going way back to a letter to the editor in an X-Men comic way back, I think, in the wake of the X-Cutioner’s Song crossover. This absolute idiot wrote in complaining that Xavier’s speech about fear and hatred against minorities specifically mentioned homosexuals. He was legit reading a comic about how it’s fucked up to discriminate against people, even those that are literal human bombs or other kinds of actual, legitimate menaces, and was on board with that message, but refused to acknowledge that that also applied to gay people. I mean, we all know that bigots are never bright, but that all requires such willful stupidity.
Oh come on, everyone loves the Inhumans and their great lineup of characters. There’s, uh, you know, Guy Who Can’t Talk, and um, the other ones who are also there sometimes, like Tiny Mustache Man, and Dog. And fans love how they only have one villain, and how every Inhumans story is just about him showing up and conquering Inhumanland and then the other Inhumans retake it and then a couple of years later he comes back and does the exact same thing again. Compelling!
And don’t forget all the exciting new Inhumans they introduced alongside Kamala! There was…um, I think one of them could shoot fire or something. Cutting-edge stuff.The important thing is, Marvel would be lost without Guy Who Can’t Talk, and his important role of getting beaten up (even after he resorts to talking!) at the start of every major crossover to establish that the villain is a really big deal.
not to play devil’s advocate, but is it that people actually care about the inhumans or more that people on the internet just like feeling smart about themselves for pointing out that something is different?
I find the change hilarious, honestly. Real “LeBron goes to the Heat” vibes there…
I grew up on comic book bullshit and wasn’t even aware of what the Inhumans were until my late 20s.
Hey I’m not racist, I have plenty of mutant friends!
You’re not intelligent
If you don’t agree with me you’re raaaaacist!
I like to point out that same thing happened to Wanda as well. They changed her origin, her powers (for the most part), even took away her mutant status and yet we heard nary a peep of outrage. Gee, I wonder why that is. Hmmm what is the biggest difference between Wanda and Kamala? The world may never know.
I mean, there were definitely complaints when Wanda was first being introduced. But that was 8+ years ago
Seriously, so many people online making jokes about Marvel turning everyone into a mutant and waahhh the inhumans. You never cared about the inhumans and you still don’t–just like everyone else.
Loved this episode (and the whole show) and glad they got Carol in there at the end.I know Kamala’s origin is way different from the comics, but it works for me. One reason it really works for me is… recently, after hearing how bad it was, I gave The Inhumans series a chance. It starts out really clunky, and stays clunky. Maybe I’m not being fair, I only gave it like 5 or 10 minutes. But the MCU is wise to steer clear of Inhuman-related anything, since they somehow messed it up so badly with that show. The djinn stuff seems more true to the spirit of Ms Marvel anyway, and they could leave it there or go a bit further afield if they want(there is that Kree arm in the archaeological dig, so…). I like it being left like Kamala leaves it – mutant? djinn? little Muslim girl? All labels, and none of them matter.
I’d rather get caught watching porn than Inhumans. It would be easier to explain.
The few minutes I watched of The Inhumans made me honestly wonder if it was even an MCU show. I mean… even in the worst of Marvel shows, I have never seen such wooden actors, uttering such wooden dialogue.I never thought an Inhumans show would be a slam dunk, but it should have been relatively easy to do. Just weird that they got it so, so wrong.
I think it’s turning out that the Inhumans (Black Bolt and the other royals) have the same adaptation problem that the FF have had: they’re rooted in a specific weird 1960s/SF/superhero aesthetic that stubbornly resists being removed from the comic-book medium. (The “Inhumans” on SHIELD were just some other characters with that label on them.)
The “Inhumans” on SHIELD were just some other characters with that label on them.But with that said, Inhumans worked on AoS because they removed that Kirby-esque aesthetic that you reference.
Oh, for sure.
I dunno, would it really have been easy to write a show about spoiled nobles in a hereditary monarchy that practices eugenics trying to reclaim their throne from the undeserving normie?
No one cares
The definitive live action Inhumans depictions was Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. They take their sweet time and the budget shows its strains from time to time, but at least the writing and acting were decent to great. Inhumans added nothing and was just superfluous.
– Yes, Night Light is sticking.
– Those hats are definitely from the Mosque Bros.
– Is it me, or do the police have their logos in the same colors and fonts as the Ms. Marvel logo?
– Zoe did know that it was Kamala. (Glad that she’s back.)
– What is Damage Control doing while they’re setting up the school caper?
– Zoe getting the fire extinguisher was funny. (PS – there’s a hammer for that, Zoe.)
– Ice Cream Pizza For Life!
– Hmmmm…She didn’t actually adopt the Ms. Marvel title, so she’s still Night Light.
– She traded places with Vers. It’s the Nega-Bands!
What is Damage Control doing while they’re setting up the school caper?
Oh, you know, setting up a pErImEtEr and maybe waiting for an official go-ahead for Ladyboss MacBigot (which she was obviously denied.)
She summoned “all available units”, so probably waited for them to arrive.
Oh I loved that moment with Zoe breaking the glass.
eh… it made her come off as a little bit of a dainty princess, so it was strange that the next line was, “Zoe, you’re on the [previously unmentioned] softball team, right?”
I was hoping she’d say “Um, yeah, I’m the equipment manager.”
I’m so tired of people screaming about the fact that the government agents didn’t take their shoes off when they went into the mosque. If I was in charge of any law enforcement people, and they took their shoes off in order to search a mosque, I’d fire them. What would happen if they find a suspect, and then the suspect ducks out the back? Should the officers stop to put their shoes back on or just chase them down the street barefoot?
Yes. Or, more rationally even, only send a few agents inside while the rest form a perimeter. The agents inside can follow the rules and be respectful, because that’s what you do for people who you don’t think are beneath you.
This is standard ops for the RCMP. If questioning needs to be done inside a mosque, the questioning officers remove their shoes, while two officers remain outside if needed.
Or….not have them take off their shoes so that THEY can respond to something if they need to, instead of HOPING that the perimeter catches it. For instance, if there is a service tunnel under the mosque.
Are you sure you’re not already in charge of LEOs? Because you seem to be strongly in favor of bad policing tactics. If a suspect manages to avoid capture, as happens from time to time in the real world, the officer always has the option of doing actual police work to find them.
Also, like six agents walked in with their shoes on, and they still lost their target. So I guess maybe err on the side of being respectful if you’re going to be awful at your job anyway.
No LEOs would ever take their shoes off when entering a mosque if they were doing so to actively search for a suspect or if they are responding to an incident call. This has actually come up before and most larger police forces have protocols for this stuff. They would remove their shoes if they were just coming to take a statement, doing liaison work, etc.
“Sheikh, I’m deeply sorry for any disrespect to the mosque, but I can’t have my officers out of uniform on duty and that means they have to keep their shoes on.* I would be happy to take my shoes off, however.** The most important thing is that we find the suspect as quickly as possible so we can be out of your way. We just want to assess whether the suspect is a threat to themselves or others and hope to make that as painless as possible for all involved. I would also like to come back at a future time when we are not in active pursuit of a suspect to discuss DoDC’s mission with you and your congregation so we can better understand each other and how we can work together. Thank you for your time and patience.”*TBF, people in combat gear would not be easily able to remove their boots.**The officer in charge, who’s wearing heels (as I’m pretty sure she was) could take those off as she’s clearly not planning to chase down a suspect.
We’re tired of racist bigots like you spewing your unwanted, asinine and garbage opinions. Here’s a fucking thought: shut the flying fuck up. For eternity. Fuckwad.
Also, sincerely go and fuck yourself.
You really seem like an asshole.
Making her a mutant instead of an Inhuman is the only thing that makes sense. The Inhumans are too similar to the mutants for it not to be confusing in the MCU. Comics have bazillions of issues to differentiate the nuance between the two, but the general public is not interested in geeking out over something that even comic nerds barely care about. Add to that the fact that the Inhumans have mostly been used as an alternative to mutants, and it would be insane for them to be what’s up in the MCU. I have plenty of issues with the MCU juggernaut and Feige, but the people angry at him for not going there are being very silly
There hasn’t been an MCU Juggernaut. There was the Singerverse one in X3, and the one in Deadpool 2, which is … different, but the same universe somehow.
lolololol I’m using “juggernaut” as a word, not the name of the X-Men villain.
Yeah, but just think about how many kids first heard the word “juggernaut” in reference to Cain Marko, and then later find out it’s a real word.
I remember the day I found out (as an Indian) that the word has a Sanskrit root (Jagannath). Mind blown.
Yeah, the name comes from the large images of the deity that are placed on chariots and paraded through the streets during festivals. The British used them as a metaphor for a large, malicious, unstoppable force, and the name stuck.
Sure, like “minions” and “despicable”
It’s funny how the Deadpool films did a more comics accurate (and more integral to the plot) Colossus and Juggernaut.
It’s been known for awhile now that Iman Vellani is in The Marvels. People were surprised by this cameo on a show called Ms. Marvel?
It’s still pretty rare for the big movie stars to dip their toes into this small screen stuff for no reason. I thought this show had the best chance of a cameo than anything else, but people were predicting a possible Dr Strange appearance in Wandavision and nothing panned out there or in any other series (besides Sif in Loki, which wasn’t a real huge get). Bruce is set to actually be in She-Hulk, but this is the biggest crossover so far.
I wasn’t surprised by the cameo – I expected it. I was surprised that it was a Rick Jones style body swap.
Monica Rambeau is in The Marvels too but we never got our Carol cameo in WandaVision.
For what it’s worth I’m grateful for the Pakistan episodes. It made the story and storytelling much bigger around Kamala’s intimate narrative, adding the weights of history and family legacy, and fleshed out Sana and Mureeba. When we return to New Jersey Kamala’s life, home, and family are that much more worth appreciating and defending.While I hoped they would brave making Aamir more faithful to the comics, I love that he’s an ally for his sister. Which he is in the comics too, under a more pious veneer. Honestly I could enjoy just the regular domestic escapades of the Khan family.The police lining up against Damage Control felt cloying and unlikely BUT they had seen Jersey City hometown hero Night Light save multiple lives by that point.
At some point a friend who knows Arabic will call her Little Miss Perfect.
In the end credits teaser, I love that the Nega-Bands effect elicited a “yipe!” from Kamala and Carol crashing through a closet door. That’s on brand for both of them.
Is it the Incursions activating the X-gene in the 616 universe? Because from the stinger, it appears that this is an alt Carol?
What makes you think that? I wouldn’t say it’s wrong, but it’s just been a few years since we’ve seen Carol, and small adjustments are common to characters in between appearances.
I love how Brodie (sic?) called her out for her changing hairstyles in Endgame.
…Brodie? you mean….Rocket?
The flying Don Cheadle one.
“Rhodey”, aka James Rhodes.
F——udge. Lol
Calling him Brodie from now on!
That’s not an alt-Carol. The bangle is the MCU version on the Nega-Bands, which allowed Rick Jones to literally switch places with Captain Marvel. The catch was though, that whoever wasn’t wearing them was stuck in the Negative Zone, which looks an awful lot like the Noor Dimension we see when Kamala first manifests her powers.
boy, that community talk sounds so fucking condescending
Can I make it up to you with Brie Larson in Community?Her best role bar none!
I love the fact that they played the music from the ‘90s X-Men cartoons when Bruno told Kamala what he had discovered. I love this comic. I love this show. Also, I hope this somehow segues into The Unbeatable Squirrel Girl popping up somewhere.
This was just so joyful and fun, and exactly what I needed. The full circle family moments, like her mom giving her the final costume after the hulk costume debacle, was just incredibly touching and sweet. This show also managed to completely blindside me with the mutant line. I was fully expecting him to say “inhuman”, so hearing the M word was maybe the most shocked I’ve ever been watching anything MCU. As a kid who grew up watching the X-Men cartoon, I am so, so excited. Serious props to everyone involved in this show, and I really hope if they do a season 2 that they get Adil and Bilall back to direct a whole season. Their work is just a perfect match for this show.
For some reason, once Bruno got rolling, I was sure he was going for mutant instead of inhuman. Not only is it sort of hard to roll out with “There’s something… inhuman about your DNA” to your friend (AoS was in a much better position for their inhuman storyline, where Quake was a friend, but very much still a threat) but it also just seemed like the right move to very subtly introduce the notion of mutants.
It’s probably for the best to not have to describe their brown girl Muslim superhero as “inhuman” anyway.
An A for that? Really? While I wouldn’t call it a terrible show, or even a bad show, I think it’s the worst of the Didneyplop Marvel offerings. I would also call it a bad adaptation. There was much I liked, such as the cast, how lived in Kamala’s relationships with her friends and family feel, and its minor exploration of Pakistani culture.
At the same time, that exploration feels superficial and uninterested in discussing the issues mentioned in any way that would be impactful, on the audience or its characters. It’s more window dressing than anything else. The (very very expensive) impromptu trip to Karachi felt shoehorned into the story just to have some more window dressing, with characters like Kamala’s cousins who don’t really do much, just to set up an exit for Kamran in the final episode with the Red Daggers, who Kamala seems fine that they murdered the shit out of several Clandestines, and the one surviving Red Dagger seems awful chill about everyone he knows being dead. There’s nothing that happened there that couldn’t have happened anywhere else.
Kamala also confesses that she has powers to her family, and sure, that’s nice that they’re so open and accepting of her being a superhero, even after the DODC are shooting at her with actual guns, but it’s also very boring to deliberately avoid drama just because there isn’t time for it, other than
Nakia: I’m mad! Friends are not entitled to secrets! This is about me!
Zoe: I’m also here.
That entire sequence in the school was so lacking in stakes. The sonic weapons that sometimes behaved like a strong gust of wind made it seem like no one was ever in danger, until one of the blasts busted through a concrete wall. It was more like a Scooby Doo Home Alone Nickelodeon than something that should be suspenseful, or at least fun. Kamran’s rampage and stand against the DODC doesn’t really make sense. He did all these dumb things to intimidate them, and then whines, “Look at everything I’ve done!” Maybe don’t do that, then. And then Kamala’s friends, who were cuffed in a custody vehicle just let themselves out? Mmkay.
There are many good and interesting ideas, but none of them are fleshed out in a satisfying way. The action is infrequent and pretty uninteresting to look at. And the villains are the worst villains in the entire MCU. At least Malekith, Lash, Hammer, Stane, the Mandarin, General Ross, and Abomination had believable motivations that required the hero to use everything in their bag of tricks to defeat them. Both Najma and DODC lady were basically the same character, completely unreasonable to the point of self harm. Crazed, with little to nothing about them that’s interesting or entertaining.
It doesn’t much matter that Kamala is a mutant instead of an Inhuman, outside of Marvel trying to distance themselves from that failed TV show instead of adapting those stories in a way that resonates with audiences. But changing her powers was a mistake. She can basically do everything she can do in the comics, plus generate some shields and platforms. But it doesn’t look good. It looks cheap. The stretching and growing isn’t even used that much, she uses the shields and platforms more than anything. Changing such a pivotal aspect of the character would be like making a Superman movie where he can’t fly. Wolverine with no claws. At no point is this decision justified. Changes should be for the better. Her “hard light” limbs don’t look like stretching so much as they look like Armor from the X-Men, a character who probably has no chance of appearing anytime soon if she just looks like a more VFX intensive version of this Ms. Marvel.
This could have been a great show that connects the dots between culture, family, and characters that are interesting, tragic, and have more to them besides a being a basic teen show trope, culminating in a meaningful, emotional payoff. Kamala Khan and Iman Vellani deserved a better show than this.
It was a great show. You didn’t like it, but you’re in the minority here bub. Also, go fuck yourself!
You realize that opening with stupid crap like “Didneyplop” is going to make everyone skip the rest of your rant, right?
Why would I care about people so up their own ass that something like that would bother them? I’m here to talk TV, not cater to the unknown aversions of, frankly, children.
He remarked, with zero self-awareness.
Long-winded, pontificating dude is pretty sure that only children (who are up their own ass, unlike him!) wouldn’t care for his inane, childish pun.If you just want to “talk TV”and don’t care about other people reading and responding, there’s no need to post your ramblings.
Just like bringing back the 70’s Spider-Man theme has worked very well I’m very very happy the MCU seems like it’s resurrecting the 90’s X-Men theme for its mutants. Also, given the timing, I can’t help but wonder if that little musical reminder presages projects to be revealed at SDCC?
https://mattthecatania.wordpress.com/2022/07/13/how-marvelous-is-ms-marvel/
I really liked the vibe of the series when it was just Kamala being a
friendly neighborhood superheroine. They just couldn’t resist going big
so soon. Learning about her heritage would’ve been a great hook for
season two once they’d established her. Cramming it in now shortchanges both the Jersey City & Karachi storylines. They could’ve made it work if this was more like thirteen episodes, but it’s too much for just six.
Kamala’s crew gets arrested but not processed, so we’re just supposed to presume
that both the feds & cops gave them a mulligan for meaning well.
That feels like it’s giving law enforcement too much credit for being
mind readers. Did Matt Murdock make their serious charges vanish overnight too?
Making Kamala a mutant (on top of a ClanDestine hybrid with an alien artifact) is ironic since she was created to be an Inhuman during the period when
Marvel & Disney were mad Fox had the X-Men adaption rights.
“Kamala’s crew gets arrested but not processed, so we’re just supposed to presume that both the feds & cops gave them a mulligan for meaning well.”Deever’s partner realized this was a PR nightmare for Damage Control. He literally fired her and told everyone to back down. It’s pretty safe to say that anyone arrested there was let go on the spot and not charged. At that point DC just wanted to pretend the whole thing never happened.
Those fucking hats, tho. Why did he even have them? Now I desperately want a spin off with Kamran and Bruno as Halal and Haram, ala Heroes for Hire.
Absolutely loved this episode and this series. I wonder if a rewatch will recontextualize last week’s episode, which I thought was the weakest for the same reasons as Sarah. Any sudden reservations I had about the pace faded away with this conclusion. I do think they could have added an episode or two to add some more detail without hampering the pace, but it’s hard to argue with the results.Also, I’m 100% on board with Zoe Zoidberging in on everything from now on.
One of my favorite small moments was when Deever returns to the mosque. The cookies thing was wonderful “I don’t think they like cookies.” “They will like MY cookies!”
The man clearly takes pride in his cookies, made me really want to try his cookies!
They had nutmeg!
Meh. It was definitely not an ‘A’ for me. The Home Alone stuff was silly and took me out of it; it was obviously there to give Kamala’s friends something to do because, what was the plan, exactly? Kamran and Kamala got out by the front of the school!And the final battle wasn’t amazing either. Agent Deever was not an awful villain but she wasn’t developed enough to be considered a good one either. The show’s villains was just an Achille heel from beginning to end.The scene where Kamala’s mom gives her her new costume was touching. I didn’t really like the character throughout the season but this went a long way to redeem her in my eyes. I also liked the family being supportive. And Nakia and Zoe had good moments too.About the mutant bit… I don’t necessarily care all that much that Kamala is not an Inhuman. During the marketing of the show, we were told that her powers would come from her bracelet, which we assumed was because Marvel Studios wanted to stay clear from the Inhumans, because of how poorly that show was received. Fine. But if it’s coming from her bracelet, why would she be a mutant? Which mutant needs an object to activate its powers? This look like another example of Marvel pushing a larger-universe connection where none is needed.
P.S.: As far as I know, no one ever called Carol Danvers “Captain Marvel” in the MCU, and I don’t know why she would use that nickname and not “Captain Danvers”. Having Kamala saying that she has the same name has her on an Earth that doesn’t even know Groot’s name is weird. Another larger-universe connection that wasn’t needed.
The name “Captain Marvel” was already used in Far From Home 3 years ago.
And it was teased IN Captain Marvel, when Carol & Fury are discussing Mar-Vell at the end.
It is a bit weird that we’ve never seen the actual moment when Carol adopted the name Captain Marvel, though. Superhero origins usually make such a big deal of that part (I thought Ms. Marvel did the best job of it that I’ve seen in a long time.)
My wife had never seen any of the show and watched the finale with me. Her main feedback was, “This feels like an episode of Odd Squad.”
But if it’s coming from her bracelet, why would she be a mutant? Which mutant needs an object to activate its powers?I don’t know, there’s a bunch of X-men/mutant related “toys” that are used to enhance/control mutant abilities. I don’t think it’s too far fetched for a bracelet to let a mutant have full access to deep down latent abilities or something.Professor X uses Cerebro all the time. Cyclop’s visor. Havok. I’m going to say that Gateway needs his yo-yo to work his powers. I think that at some point Pyro could only control flames, so he always needed a flamethrower to be useful.
That’s not a yo-yo.
Correct, it’s a bullroarer.Incidentally, that makes TWO Aboriginal Australian heroes who use a bullroarer as part of their power set, the other being Talisman, who appeared in Contest of Champions and like… twice since. I’m genuinely surprised no one’s dug him up in recent years.
Professor X is already extremely powerful, even without Cerebro, and Pyro can still control flames, so it’s not like Kamala who needed her bracelet to do anything at all. As for Cyclops and Havok, they need equipment to contain their powers, not enhance it. And their equipment and powers are different, even though they are brothers. I am not familiar with Gateway but I couldn’t find any info online saying that he needs a yo-yo to work his powers.
Spider-Man is a mutate who can do “whatever a spider can,” but it’s only with the help of a bangle that he’s able to spin webs.
The showrunners said from the beginning that Kamala’s powers were not going to come from the bangle, but would instead be tied to her heritage. This is also made explicit in the second episode when Bruno tells Kamala that her powers are coming from her, not the bangle, and that the bangle just seemed to awaken something that was already there. There’s nothing that says she needs to be wearing the bangle to use her powers (though there are mutants in the comics that need objects/tech to focus their powers.) Also, in the comics a mutants powers tend to manifest in their teens due to some particular emotional or traumatic event, so that’s not unusual.Kamala being a mutant also makes sense in the context of the show. The discovery is prompted by Aamir bugging Bruno to test him to see if he could have powers as well, since he shares the same heritage, but it turns out the rest of her family are regular humans. Which makes sense given that the bangle has been in her family for generations, worn by other relatives, but they never got powers from it.Kamala switching places with Carol at the end also shows they are making the bangle somewhat like the Kree Nega-Bands from the comics and the Noor dimension we see is an MCU version of the Negative Zone.
There’s nothing that says she needs to be wearing the bangle to use her powers (though there are mutants in the comics that need objects/tech to focus their powers.)
As I said above, “focusing” isn’t the same as activating: Cyclops doesn’t need his visor to shoot laser beams. And the Djinns really seemed to think that it’s the bangle that would bring them back home, not Kamala specifically.So, yeah, I understand what you’re saying: they didn’t outright say that she needed the bangle. But I spent the whole season satisfied with the explanation that Kamala could do what she did because she was a Djinn using Djinn technology. Bruno’s mutant explanation right at the very end felt superfluous, like he was answering a question no one asked.
On the one hand, the bangle seems like a perfectly reasonable explanation for why Kamala has powers but her mom and brother don’t, so it’s weird that Bruno even thought the question was worth looking into. Maybe if Kamala had taken off the bangle and given it to Aamir and then nothing happened, but that doesn’t seem to have occurred. So the mutant thing does feel like the answer to a question no one asked.On the other hand, I can’t deny that a little thrill ran down my spine when he said the word “mutation” and we got the music cue, and it worked because it was a surprise. If “why does Kamala have powers” was still an open question, then I’d have seen it coming. So in terms of storytelling, the mutant thing isn’t great, but in terms of teasing the viewer for the next big Marvel thing (which was, after all, the purpose of that scene) it worked brilliantly. I also like that Kamala just brushes it off at the end. It shows how she’s come to accept herself more.
“As far as I know, no one ever called Carol Danvers ‘Captain Marvel’ in the MCU”Spider-Man calls her this in Far From Home. The fact that he knows her by this name shows that she is known by this name in the Avengers community.
I could be wrong, but I think I heard a lil callback to the X-Men theme when Bruno tells her she’s a mutant which makes me think they’re teasing some kind of crossover at some point? I mean Charles Xavier was in Doctor Strange, right? So they’ve gotta be part of the MCU at some point. Also… Was I the only one who was super confused by the ending xD I couldn’t tell if Kamala shapeshifted into Captain Marvel like in the comics (I haven’t read the comics so I might be wrong abt that but I thought I read that that’s what happened) or if she swapped places with her or what xD Anyway… This show was awesome! Can’t wait to see her in more stuff
I love her Mom doing a Ma Kent and making her costume. It even looks like an S when she opens the toffee box.
I got a real Lois and Clark pilot vibe when Kamala’s mother gave her the suit.“Nice suit.”
“Thanks. My mother made it for me.”
I know this is almost definitely a hot take, but I don’t like the mutant thing one bit. Not just because we spent multiple episodes talking about how she gets this from her Clandestine ancestry, though I admit that’s a major part, but because making her a mutant makes her feel less special. Like, I know not every mutant automatically gets drafted to the X-Men (to me at least) like they changed her powers in the first place to avoid having them overlap with Mr. Fantastic whenever that movie comes out, so why have her power origin overlap with so many other heroes’?
And I know the counter-argument to that is that in the comics she’s an Inhuman and there are a bunch of them, but for one, the Inhumans aren’t nearly as… centralized, I guess you’d say, around a particular group as mutants are with X-Men. Also from a meta standpoint, Marvel tried developing a lot of Inhuman heroes around the mid-2010s and Kamala’s basically the only one that managed to actually stick around and make it big, which makes “successful Inhuman superhero” basically special unto itself.
The X-Men factor:Starting at 41:07 of the last episode of Ms. Marvel if you listen closely you’ll hear a brief blurb of the X-men theme song. In the comics Kamala has an Inhumans origin story.Here its been reworked to more directly reference the X-men(the Inhumans were a work around for them as Marvel didn’t have the rights to use them during that time.)Before the 41:07 mark her friend told her he did some further investigating of her because he said something felt off with hus prior assessment. He then said he discovered a mutation in her genetic makeup cue the X-men (1997) animation theme song blurb. Between this and Prof. Xavier(played once again by Patrick Stewart) showing up in a cameo* in Dr. Strange and the Multiverse of madness(also accompanied with the Xmen’97 theme cue from 1:05:00 – 1:05:10. the X men are all but confirmed to be apart of the MCU. Also did you catch her using embiggen? Last episode is pure fan service. I’m still not too crazy about the tying of her powers solely to the bangle but there’s hope. The bangle seems to be what gives her the energy based powers and if her friend is right about her being a mutant that means she could still stretch, shapeshift, and embiggen without it.
However the energy based stuff is a nice addition to it.
But imagine how many mire stories they could tell if her shapeshifting powers worked without the bangle as well.
Sure the bangle might become an additional mcguffin but so what?SPOILERLet’s talk about that stinger… you know the one where she looks at her bangle. Sees it glow then somehow either shapeshifts into or bodyswaps with the real Captain Marvel who then proceeds to look around Kamala’s room in shock. I’m leaning towards the other unless that’s still Kamala(which would be in line with what she experienced in the comics)
But somehow I’m convinced its not her.*replete with a live action version of the same mechanized hovering yellow chair he used in the Xmen(1997). In case you missed them both cues were from the animated Xmen series which aired on Fox in 1997.Btw at one point they teased bringing back the animated Xmen’97 series to Disney+. These Xmen’97 cameos and theme cues all but confirm the possible continuation of the Xmen’97 animated series. But one wonders will Kamala somehow guest star in the sequel series? She did time travel within her own series after all.
Been really digging these recaps and all the explanations of cultural shit that’d otherwise go way over my head. Rad work, Sarah.
“Pakistani or Arab.” She’s not just a racist clown, but an infant racist clown. Did she describe her previous target either Ainu or Tocharian?re: mutant or inhuman. Let’s face it, the Inhumans are just mutants with the serial numbers filed off.
So I just googled nega-bands. If they make them switch places then where in the (universe) might Kamala be? And will that scene just be a gag or will we see her start in some foreign galaxy then next time on screen
I thought the show was an enjoyable diversion, which is pretty much the best you can say about all the MCU Disney+ shows with the possible exception of WandaVision. I thought the exploration of heritage deepened the show significantly, but I also think this show (and all the others) is severely constrained by the “six episodes and done” template. It was overstuffed and there is a whole lot of fridge logic involved, from the fact that they now imply she’s just going to be left alone by the authorities to Bruno’s inexplicable mastery of all science (and apparent emancipation, and his apparent lack of need for a f**king HOME) to the severe lack of understandable motivation from the main antagonists to the (very redundant) “powers cause someone to do a heel turn until he’s redeemed by the power of love.”As someone who stopped reading comics 15 years ago (and was never a Marvel person) I found it more enjoyable because I had no stake in it. Her powers looked less silly then they would if she had giant limbs (and I still have no idea how that would even work without super strength since joints and muscles decidedly don’t work that way). Her origin seemed fine to me…UNTIL the mutant reveal, which was (confirmed to be) tacked on and which just muddies things up. I hope they plan on not bringing it up again like they sort of implied, because what little I know about Marvel mutants is that…they don’t need weapons to unlock their powers.I’m saying nothing new, here, but pretty much every story in the MCU now feels like it’s either a trailer for the next story or a coda for the last rather than a proper story. Moon Knight escaped that (except that it ended on a really inappropriate cliffhanger considering Oscar Isaac is not contracted to return again). This almost escaped that, but since the show is over and we will apparently never see her again without her Amazing Friends, it was diminished by the ending.
I think they stuck the landing really well here, but the ClanDestines made the show worse overall.(Kamala made the escape hole, by the way, not Kamran.)
Finally an “embiggen”! I was one of those who was disappointed that her comics stretchy powers weren’t use, but I appreciate that they have tried to come close with her powers here. The show is just charming as hell, in no small part becuase of it’s lead. I know her next outing is a team-up in “The Marvels” but i would love to see her meet on of her other heroes, Ant-Man. Rudd and Vellani would be great together.
Really enjoyed this finale. They really stuck the landing after looking a little shaky in episode 5. I’d have to put Ms. Marvel near or at the top for me as best MCU show so far (its this or Loki imo). It was a lot of fun and felt like its own unique thing. The only stumbling block was the feeling of things being rushed along in episode 5. Maybe another episode would have helped and its becoming a trend where the Disney+ 6 episode series order is causing some bumps in the road for the SW/MCU shows.
But even with that hiccup, I’d still rate the series overall as an A-. I went in with casual knowledge of Kamala Khan (never read the comics but knew the general idea around her) and came away a big fan.
It is truly hilarious to see Marvel, now that it has the X-Men/Fantastic Four rights back in-house, bending over backwards to undo the nonsense that was the original Ms. Marvel concept. No more bendy powers (since Mr. Fantastic is in the MCU), and no more Inhuman (since they can just make her a mutant now, which they would have done in the first place if not for Marvel trying to make the Inhumans the “new” X-Men).
Thanks for your recaps! I really enjoyed reading what you think of the show and I very much appreciate your insight. I definitely may teared up a few times watching this one. The relationships are awesome, and it’s really nice having a show where everyone just likes each other.
I really like the characters. I especially like Kamala’s dad. But everything was just so rushed.
They meet the Clandestines and the Clandestines are revealed as villains 15 minutes later, and then they’re captured by Damage Control after another 15 minutes.
Kamala meets a mentor and he dies 15 minutes later. The Clandestines escape and one episode later, they’re dead.
Come on, develop some of those characters and plot threads. Heck, there are lots of shows about teenage superheroes they could have taken inspiration from, Static Shock, Batman Beyond, X-Men Evolution, Spectacular Spider-Man, etc.
The Clandestines and Pakistan stuff should’ve really been season 2, and they could’ve brought more than just Kamala’s mom over with her. First season really should’ve stayed in Jersey and been more focused on a friendly neighborhood Night Light.
“Is it me or were Nakia and Zoe a little flirty?”Isn’t Nakia lesbian in the comics? Or at least bi? There was definitely someone in a hijab who was.
Comic Zoe is gay but i don’t think Nakia is.
True, Zoe started off dating a guy (Josh) in the comics but eventually came out as gay, and at least for a while she had a crush on Nakia. I’m pretty sure that we were getting numerous hints as to Zoe’s (possibly) closeted nature in the show, if you go back and look at some of her dialogue. I really hope that in a second season, we get to see more of this.
After name-dropping him and referencing him a bunch, I thought for sure we’d get a Paul Rudd cameo at some point. Maybe a clip from his podcast as a post-credit scene.
What a series. Something I thought I’d have no interest in ended up having so much heart, and being so fun, that I was sucked in. And they really stuck the landing. Props to you Sarah also, as these reviews have been an absolutely essential complement to every episode, especially deconstructing the finer cultural points which help old white people like me understand what I’m seeing. Fantastic stuff.
Hey! Disney+ finally made a finale for an MCU show that wasn’t a deflated letdown. Yay!
Overall, I consider Ms. Marvel a success. Great characters. An illuminating (if somewhat cursory) glance at South Asian Islamic life. Cool setup for an actual MCU film. I’m satisifed.
I will, however, agree with others that we need more than six episodes of these series.Also, the DODC inclusion was weak. What is their motivation? Why is their field boss such an unrepentantly campy baddy? For a show that did decently with nuance and shades for its characters, the DODC stuff was as if it came from another show.
“If you saved one life, well, you saved them all.”Is that a line from Ms Marvel’s comic? The first thing it brought me to was the most recent Spider-Man film, and the headstone marker that read “If you help somebody, you help everybody.”
It’s similar to a quote from the Talmud: “He who saves one life, saves the entire world.”
That also appears in the Quran, 5:32:
That is why We ordained for the Children of Israel that whoever takes a life—unless as a punishment for murder or mischief in the land—it will be as if they killed all of humanity; and whoever saves a life, it will be as if they saved all of humanity.But the inclusion of that formulation in the Quran is almost certainly a borrowing from Talmudic thought.
That inclusion in No Way Home was a homage to Aunt May’s “catchphrase” in the Spider-Man PS4 game.
Knowing that She-Hulk is playing into the legal side of the MCU, I hope her office is handling the multi-million dollar lawsuit that Bruno’s parents should be filing against the Department of Damage Control.
Bruno doesn’t have parents (the show was vague about the details, but they’re explicitly not around anymore) but on the spirit of the point we’re agreed.
“Is Kamala one of the X-Men?”Just cuz she’s a mutant doesn’t automatically mean she’s part of the X-Men. But Marvel really wanted to make sure we got what they were hinting at by playing the riff from the 90s X-Men theme at that moment lol.
very fun overall episode. I felt DDC is now overwhelmingly a bad force in the MCU. Ironically helped by a major donation from Tony Stark. Funding our own destruction.I don’t think that the local constabulary would back Ms. Marvel as a brand new meta in the area. I felt early on that the bangle would turn out to be one of the ____________. Then the mid-credits scene happened, and, aha!! Nice.
I like the one dude from DDC who was in NWH but man, the lady who was prominently featured in this show was awful. If their vision for the DDC is dull government agents who step in when true antagonists aren’t around – no thanks.The only part of Ms Marvel I didn’t like was the DDC.
This show doesn’t have Muslim characters — it has Muslim-American characters.And that is awesome. 😁
On a completely different subject, when did all the old recaps disappear from the AV Club? I was finally watching Russian Doll, and looked to see if there were any recaps, and it looks like every show that ended their run before 2021 has had their recaps disappeared. That’s a goddamn shame.
Russian Doll’s reviews only look at each season as a whole and not per episode.
Yeah I’m bummed about it too, but it seems like nowadays, streaming series that drop all episodes at once just get one review.
I couldn’t even find that. Any show that is not currently in production seems to have been tossed into the bit bucket.
Season 2: https://www.avclub.com/russian-doll-season-2-review-netflix-natasha-lyonne-1848762818Season 1: https://www.avclub.com/acerbic-yet-warm-russian-doll-is-more-rewarding-than-a-1832204442
Was there a menu that got you there? Or did you do a site search?
So, it looks like the old reviews are still here, but the easy drop down menu is gone? I wonder if that’s on purpose, or just another Kinja screwup.(Comes back from searching for Battlestar Galactica as an experiment) Looks like stuff is still there, but searching gets you all sorts of irrelevant stuff before it gets to what you are looking for. Looks like they have made accessing old reviews/recaps a real pain in the ass unless I’m blind and there is some dropdown menu I am not seeing.
Seeing Kamala running across the sky will never get old, loved it.
Nakia and Zoe appear to be longtime best friends in real life so that probably explains their chemistry and interactions
We unreservedly loved this show.My son sat on my knee and my wife shoulder surfed every episode, finally sitting down halfway through.
“In what I found to be the only confusing part of the finale, he punches a hole in the ground that presumably takes him to the harbor via a tunnel.”Kamala is the that punches a hole in the ground (with her embiggened fist), not Kamran. And I assume the hole was to connect with the sewers, and that’s how Kamran was able to make it to the harbor.
“her friends, family, and community surround her. So do a line of local police, which is sweet, but also feels a bit message-y and unrealistic in an America where police officers are so often in the news for treating people of color in inhumane ways.”I took this as a sign that the police officers were local cops who lived and worked in this neighborhood, while Damage Control were federal outsiders. The cops were standing up for their own community – when the crowd was applauding Kamala using her powers, you could see one of the Jersey cops applauding too.
“He tells Kamala she will always be ‘Our own little Ms. Marvel.’ And voila! There it is, Kamala’s iconic superhero name.”Was it just me or did Yusuf say “Miss Marvel” here? Wouldn’t a father call his teenager daughter “Miss” instead of “Ms.”?