Thandiwe Newton criticizes Star Wars for killing off her Solo character
"You don’t kill off the first Black woman to ever have a real role in a Star Wars movie. Like, are you fucking joking?”
When she joined the cast of 2018's Solo: A Star Wars Story, Thandiwe Newton became—a scant 41 years in—the first Black woman to have a major role in the franchise’s films. And by major, we of course mean “dies in the first act to ensure that Woody Harrelson looks properly bitter and unshaved for the rest of the movie.” Apparently, though, that wasn’t how it was meant to be—and now Newton has spoken up about her disappointment with Star Wars as a whole, after her character’s fate was altered from what was originally in the movie’s script.
This is per an interview Newton gave this week to Inverse, focused on her role in Hugh Jackman’s recent sci-fi noir Reminiscence. But Star Wars talk inevitably oozed into the conversation, and so Newton addressed the space elephant in the space room: “You don’t kill off the first Black woman to ever have a real role in a Star Wars movie. Like, are you fucking joking?”
In the film, Newton’s character Val dies at the end of the big heist that represents Alden Ehrenreich’s Han’s first big step into the criminal major leagues. In the script, though, Val’s fate was left far more ambiguous, opening up the possibility that she might return (if Solo’s lackluster box office performance hadn’t precluded possibilities of a sequel).
Actually, in the script, she wasn’t killed. It happened during filming. And it was much more just to do with the time we had to do the scenes. It’s much easier just to have me die than it is to have me fall into a vacuum of space so I can come back sometime. That’s what it originally was: that the explosion and she falls out and you don’t know where she’s gone. So I could have come back at some point. But when we came to filming, as far as I was concerned and was aware, when it came to filming that scene, it was too huge a set-piece to create, so they just had me blow up and I’m done. But I remembered at the time thinking, “This is a big, big mistake.”
In the interview, Newton doesn’t make it clear which of the film’s directors—Phil Lord and Chris Miller, or Ron Howard, who took over the film after Disney fired the pair—were responsible for the filming, and the subsequent change. And, again: The fact that there’s almost certainly not going to be a Solo sequel renders at least some of this academic. (Also, “sucked into the vacuum of space” still sounds pretty dead, but we grant that it’s less certain than what’s depicted in the film.)
[via NME]
189 Comments
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bishbah-av says: Quickly corrected in the text, but the URL lives forever…
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lookatallthepretties-av says:
“British”? fucking “British” you stuck up English Nazi MI6 cunt where the fuck do they get you fucking people from they breed you on some fucking estate in the Home Counties I thought my death squad officer child hitting grandfather was a awful person at least he had the excuse of being born in 1895 and spending two years in the trenches on the Western Front in World War I what the fuck is your excuse Ms. Newton
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castigere-av says:
Maybe let’s not be too precious about it. She only reverted to it, professionally, this year.
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doncae-av says:
Yes, if only the avclub were some sort of blog site focusing on pop culture of audio and visuals that mentioned the fact that she had changed her name.https://www.avclub.com/thandiwe-newton-reverts-to-original-spelling-of-her-nam-1846620042O right.
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castigere-av says:
Listen. There was an article yesterday that identified Jane Campion as Jane Champion four times in a row. Here, it’s not out of the realm of possibility that it was a typo EVERY TIME. Also, I think it’s fair to assume that MOST people don’t read every article and keep a spreadsheet. There’s that precious-ness I was talking about
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doncae-av says:
It’s not out of the realm of possibility, but1) four typos of a person’s name isn’t really a good thing 2) this typo just happened to be the name that the actress specifically did not want to go by. I don’t think Jane was like Don’t call me Campion3) it’s William Hughes4) for not paying attention to the spreadsheet: it’s literally in every link included in the article5) hughes
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castigere-av says:
How do you know it doesn’t gall Campion to no end when people call her Champion? Also, it isn’t the point. One can be priggish about things if one isn’t ever vigilant. The sheer amount of typos and editing problems on this site would lead one to think that a person who, for over 25 years in my recollection, had her name one way, would continue to have her name that way. Occam’s Razor would say typos. This time it turned out to be zebras, but it’s mostly horses. Newton has to assume that it’s gonna take some time to get the change around. So should everyone else. Hard to breathe with one’s chest all pumped up with air.
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recognitions-av says:
How come you’re upset about a white woman’s name being misspelled but you’re telling people not to make a big deal about a black woman’s name being misspelled?
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interlinked-av says:
They couldn’t afford editors as they blew all their money on journalists.
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toddisok-av says:
They couldn’t afford editors as they blew all their money on journalists Pop-Rocks. FTFY!
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toddisok-av says:
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antsnmyeyes-av says:
I commented “It’s Thandiwe.”Thats being “too precious about it”???
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castigere-av says:
Nope. Just an admonition for the future. That’s some incredulous question mark-ing, by the by.
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toddisok-av says:
This is the AV Club. If there’s a black person or a woman person or a black woman person, we gettin’ precious up in here!
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yourmovecrepe-av says:
Did you mean Thandiwe Newton?https://www.avclub.com/thandiwe-newton-reverts-to-original-spelling-of-her-nam-1846620042
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greyayanami-av says:
The script may have left it ambiguous but obviously alluded to her death during the heist because her character was no longer in the story after that scene right? And the film failed commercially so the chances of her character coming back even if she wasn’t killed onscreen were nil. And she had a chance to read the screenplay before she signed on. She is stirring shit to get some free hype. Killing her character was not racist.
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captain-splendid-av says:
Yeah, but at least you don’t have to appear in any more Solo movies, so there’s that.
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souzaphone-av says:
The movie overall was a lot of fun, but they introduced too many interesting characters like Val and then killed them.
Rogue One is hailed for killing off all of its characters, perhaps because none of them are interesting.
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theunnumberedone-av says:
But maybe they’ll retroactively BECOME interesting if we make a D+ series dramatically titled after one of their surnames, right?…right????
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jshrike-av says:
I mean The Clone Wars are at least partially responsible for gaslighting an entire generation into thinking the prequels are good, so who knows?
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laurenceq-av says:
It’s a horrible title if only because Cassian Andor isn’t a character who was particularly memorable (don’t get me wrong, I loved Rogue One) and his name hasn’t exactly been burned into the pop cultural firmament. They should have found a more story-appropriate, Star-Wars-y name (though “Rebels” was already taken.)
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aej6ysr6kjd576ikedkxbnag-av says:
In Rogue One they died for something. In Solo, Val just randomly decides to suicide in the middle of a heist, apparently out of boredom.
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adamtrevorjackson-av says:
luckily it’s star wars, so i’m sure she’ll have her own disney+ show that explains where her jacket came from by 2023.
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igotlickfootagain-av says:
You know who I want a series about? That one Imperial admin guy who randomly assigns people’s surnames. What’s his deal?
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thekinjacaffeinespider-av says:
“And you’re name shall be…’TK421′! Because you’re never at your post on time!”
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frankwalkerbarr-av says:
To be fair, a lot of officials at Ellis Island were kind of like that, giving people terribly mangled versions of their actual surnames on their official records or even giving days of the week (Joe Friday may have been a fictional character from ‘Dragnet’, but people were sometimes really given names like that by immigration officials).
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toddisok-av says:
“Welcome to Planet Ellis Island. You’re name is…Luke…uh, LaserBrains. You are…Chewie WalkingCarpet, and, oh Christ, you…um…Dack…*looks down* Stain-On-Tie. Enjoy the Empire, stay out of trouble!”
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anthonypirtle-av says:
To be fair, we didn’t actually see her body literally blown apart, did we? If Boba Fett can come back from certain digestion, who knows?
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westsidegrrl-av says:
And if Sith Lord from TPM who was literally sliced in half can come back, she can come back. Death is meaningless in that galaxy.
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hamiltonistrash-av says:
and even if you are dead, you can still use force lightning in the physical realm, which in hindsight just makes Obi-Wan look lazy in the originals
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toddisok-av says:
And if you are just lazy you can write a Star Wars movie!
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igotlickfootagain-av says:
Somehow, “Somehow, Palpatine survived” survived the editing process.
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toddisok-av says:
Yeah, um, it’s his father…I mean she’s his daughter…what, granddaughter? Fine, what ever…Faster, more energy!!!
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thekinjacaffeinespider-av says:
Everybody who knows about Zabrak anatomy could tell you they have absolutely NO vital organs below the navel.
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toddisok-av says:
Not as long as they insist on this “family-friendly violence”.
“Oh there’s no blood because lightsabers & blaster bolts cauterize as they cut or blast through your tender body!” I never cared for that one.
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cscurrie-av says:
Hopefully her character will live on in comics, prequel style stories, and animation, where she can do the voice. We’ll see?
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somethingwittyorwhatever-av says:
I cared so much less about Han Solo than literally every other person in (ostensibly) his own movie. Shit even Red Lines in Face Guy was more interesting.Newton was one of those much better characters stolen from us too soon.
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souzaphone-av says:
Solo is overflowing with interesting characters, which puts it over Rogue One for me. But yes, Han is definitely the lead interesting character in the movie.
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toddisok-av says:
Every Star Wars character should get their own movie: Organa: Another Star WarsStory… Young Leia must balance her duties in the Imperial Senate with Alderaan Spring Break! Who hoooo!
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bagman818-av says:
There were so many things wrong with Solo. For starters, casting Dane DeHaan…that’s not right. Ansel Elgort? No. *checks notes* Ahem. Casting Alden Ehrenreich as Han Solo.
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gildie-av says:
Honestly, I don’t know what’s up with Alden Ehrenreich because there seems to be something… but he’s so, so good in Hail Caesar and just based on that I could see why they’d consider him for Han Solo.
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pubstub-av says:
He was AMAZINGLY good and funny in Hail Caesar. Just delightful and I hope Solo didn’t put too much of a stop in his career.
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bagman818-av says:
Understand, I have no issue with Ehrenreich as an actor, and I agree he was good in Hail Caesar, but Han Solo is forever linked with Harrison Ford, and Ford is a Movie Star, in addition to being a capable actor. When he’s on screen, he demands your attention. Ehrenreich not so much.Interestingly, they figured that out with the entirety of The Avengers (Jeremy Renner being the exception that proves the rule).
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laurenceq-av says:
I disliked Solo, but didn’t dislike Alden. But I can’t disagree with your sentiment. He was fine, but not exactly magnetic.However, weirdly one of the biggest champions of his performance was none other than…Harrison Ford.
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socratessaovicente-av says:
I mean….that’s what’s called contractual obligation. So long as Ford is getting those Star Trek checks, he’s not going to diss the kid who plays the younger version.
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avclub-0806ebf2ee5c90a0ca0fd59eddb039f5--disqus-av says:
All of the press said “Oh, he’s not that much shorter than Ford.” But onscreen he really seemed a little short to be a Han Solo. In the original movies Ford fills the frame, and Ehrenreich just didn’t. Part of that is because Ford was giant compared to Hamill and Fisher, but Ehrenreich had Clarke to tower over and it still didn’t work.
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laurenceq-av says:
There’s a fairly considerable 4 inch difference in height. Alden should have just been wearing MASSIVE lifts the whole time.
Ford is taller than notably Harrelson (who definitely always seems to “fill the frame” despite being less than 6″) Alden is shorter than Woody. It definitely felt off.
Ford is a full foot taller than Carrie Fisher. -
avclub-0806ebf2ee5c90a0ca0fd59eddb039f5--disqus-av says:
To a certain extent he had the same problem that DeHann had in Valerian: he just doesn’t look like a space cowboy. (although Dehann’s actual performance was much worse).
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egerz-av says:
It’s not a height issue, it’s a screen presence issue. Height doesn’t really read on film, they could have worked around that with blocking and set construction. The real problem was that prime Harrison Ford had one of the most compelling screen presences of all time, and unless you catch lightning in a bottle with the recasting, audiences are going to have a hard time accepting any performance. Disney could have surgically altered Ehrenreich to be 6’1” with bionic legs and he’d still have come up short.
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laurenceq-av says:
Don’t give them any ideas! There’s going to be a comic book series now explaining how Han Solo got bionic legs, hence the height difference between “Solo” and the original “Star Wars.”
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igotlickfootagain-av says:
I watched ‘A New Hope’ again just the other day, and every line reading by Ford is pitch perfect. He’s so famous for saying, “You can write this stuff, George, but you can’t say it”, while disproving himself again and again.
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thekinjacaffeinespider-av says:
“Faster…more energy! Faster more energy! FASTERMOREENEGRY!
aaand, cut, I think we got it!”
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imodok-av says:
He was brilliant in Hail Caesar. I can understand why he and his management thought playing Han was worth the risk, but he might have been better off doing more arthouse and indies than popping into a big franchise role where he had little to no say on how the character was portrayed.
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seinnhai-av says:
What the hell is an Ansel Elgort? Is that some obscure piece of abstract or surrealist art? A viral infection of the throat? Someone’s idea of a sick joke?
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grogthepissed-av says:
A type of fungal infestation of grain, known to cause spasms and hallucinations among medieval peasants.
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toddisok-av says:
No, sorry, we were looking for “What the hell is an Amber Ruffin?” Let’s see how much you wagered…ooh, too bad!
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seinnhai-av says:
That’s a better Star Wars name than any of the anagrams you listed so…
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ademonstwistrusts-av says:
In a movie with sooooo soooo many problems, Alden was ultimately one of the least problematic things in the movie.
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tokenaussie-av says:
..Dane DeHaan…Ansel Elgort…Alden EhrenreichSTOP MAKING UP NAMES, DAMMIT.
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slyvstr-av says:
Honestly, I don’t remember neither what happened to her character nor anything else that happened in Solo. It wasn’t the worst Star Wars movie (unfortunately I remember Attack of the Clones and The Rise of Skywalker all too well) but it was the most unnecessary and forgettable.
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scottsummers76-av says:
i keep forgetting that i saw it. I think she was partners with the woody harrelson character, part of his gang?
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storklor-av says:
This, 100%. I know I’ve seen Solo. But I’d be hard pressed to describe the plot in any way beyond “how Han meets Chewie and gets the Falcon and other stuff also happens but who cares”.
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igotlickfootagain-av says:
Don’t forget that we get the story behind the Kessel Run, because that was something we always needed to know full details about and not, say, an effectively thrown-away line of colour text that assures you the Millennium Falcon is a fast ship that Han is proud of.
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toddisok-av says:
He’s made it pretty far as a space captain without really knowing what a parsec is
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inspectorhammer-av says:
I don’t have a problem with a Han Solo movie in theory, but in practice it was pretty disappointing that everything we knew about his backstory from the original trilogy was the results of one hectic week.
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sgt-makak-av says:
Also, “sucked into the vacuum of space” still sounds pretty dead, but we grant that it’s less certain than what’s depicted in the film.I love Thandiwe Newton and I’m super happy that her career is having somewhat of a resurgence, but I find her argument pretty far fetched. As you wrote, the character died in the script, just differently.
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galvatronguy-av says:
But we all know the vacuum of space is livable whereas explosions are not, it’s just basic film science.
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paulfields77-av says:
Basic film science is “everything is survivable if survival will help squeeze more cash out of the IP”.
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galvatronguy-av says:
Haha, yes exactly! There’s literally infinite ways the character could be brought back.
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toddisok-av says:
Yeah, they could stick her in a bacta tank and stitch her back together as some sort of Zombwie Thandiwe.
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martyfunkhouser1-av says:
Was her character killed off because she was Black? Or was her character treated like any other?
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it-has-a-super-flavor--it-is-super-calming-av says:
Thanks for just asking questions. /s
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it-has-a-super-flavor--it-is-super-calming-av says:
You’re probably missing that the article is about industry representation and you’re talking about choices in writing fictional characters.
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it-has-a-super-flavor--it-is-super-calming-av says:
Considering her initial quote is “You don’t kill off the first Black woman to ever have a real role in a Star Wars movie.”, then it’s pretty clear she’s talking about Black employment and representation in movies.
The choice could have just as easily been made not to write her character’s death and then there wouldn’t be any problem, perceived or otherwise. -
galvatronguy-av says:
They should have just cast her as another white character, and totally short-circuited the whole representation thing, right?As others mentioned there’s no reason she couldn’t come back in future Star Wars media, it’s not like it had her head launch into Woody’s hands after the explosion or some shit. This is an academic exercise in pointless speculation. Ray Park, whose character was literally, and explicitly shown to be bisected in one of the earlier Star Wars movies was in this movie, for fuck’s sake.
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it-has-a-super-flavor--it-is-super-calming-av says:
Putting aside your ridiculous question, the point is she has a problem with it and has her reasons. How about listening to the woman who was actually there, instead of these “others” you mention.
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laserfacefanclub-av says:
It’s a good thing you and your shitty ass opinions don’t matter to anyone
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it-has-a-super-flavor--it-is-super-calming-av says:
I’ll assume you dismissed my previous reply, so I’ll repeat it for posterity.
Putting aside your ridiculous question, the point is she has a problem with it and has her reasons.Perhaps try listening to the woman who was actually there, instead of these “others” you mention.
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galvatronguy-av says:
I dismissed it because it’s a loud, wet fart of a reply. It offers no substantiative rebuttal other than “well, it doesn’t matter what other people think about this because they’re not Thandiwe Newton.”
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it-has-a-super-flavor--it-is-super-calming-av says:
There’s no “rebuttal” because you’re arguing a different point to the one she’s making.
She’s talking about her experience of being “the first Black woman to ever have a real role in a Star Wars movie.” You and others are basically dismissing this by saying “There’s literally infinite ways the character could be brought back.” It literally doesn’t matter what you and others speculate about her character, with respect to what she said and actually experienced as a working actor and real-life human . -
galvatronguy-av says:
What she said and experienced as a real-life human and working actor is derived from what happened to her character— so yes, it does, quite literally, matter.
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it-has-a-super-flavor--it-is-super-calming-av says:
Derived in the past isn’t the same as speculating about the future.
Also doesn’t address why you want to dismiss her concerns.
Her personal experience is based on so much more than just what happened to her character. -
galvatronguy-av says:
What concerns? That it was a mistake for reasons that aren’t actually expounded upon in any fashion other than the character “could have come back at some point?”
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it-has-a-super-flavor--it-is-super-calming-av says:
Sure, that’s her only concern when she says “You don’t kill off the first Black woman to ever have a real role in a Star Wars movie.” /s
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toddisok-av says:
Just like any other : hacky-ass writing and no apparent reason for her to be there.
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posigrade-av says:
I mean, they also killed off the first old white man to have a real role in a Star Wars movie too.
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souzaphone-av says:
Old white men are everywhere in Star Wars, though. Black women are not.
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toddisok-av says:
I know, right? Throw a force pike, you’re bound to hit an old white man.
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it-has-a-super-flavor--it-is-super-calming-av says:
Yes, poor old white men, they have had it rough.
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igotlickfootagain-av says:
And that was the end of Alec Guinness’ promising space opera fantasy wizard career.
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elgeneralludd-av says:
God, you baby progressives really are a joyless lot.
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edkedfromavc-av says:
Did anyone else think that they were going to reveal that young woman at the end (from the rebel group or whatever on that last planet) as her & Woody Harrelson’s character’s daughter?
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worsehorse-av says:
THANK YOU. I thought I was the only one. . . I was very distracted waiting (incorrectly, it seems) for that shoe to drop.
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garland137-av says:
I was trying to figure out if they were implying she’s Lando’s daughter or if he’s just trying to charm his way into her space pants.
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igotlickfootagain-av says:
I remember I couldn’t figure out which option I’d hate more. “Gee, do we get another tortured, unnecessary family connection for the sake of it, or are they gonna freshen things up with a dash of horny ol’ Lando?”
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toddisok-av says:
“Space pants”? You know, according to the Law of Lucas, there’s no such thing as bras in this galaxy. I wonder if they have Spanx…
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souzaphone-av says:
The way the camera focused on her and then Woody Harrelson’s reaction made me think the same thing! Also I kept expecting him to bring up Val again, and he just…never did. It was weird.
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laurenceq-av says:
Totally. I mean, I don’t want to sound racist, but she’s a biracial actress and Woody and Thandie were a biracial couple and Star Wars loves its familial connections no matter how terrible and stupid (TROS.)
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yesidrivea240-av says:
You’re okay, that’s not dead naming, just a mistake.
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erikveland-av says:
A mistake in the original headline as well judging by the URL
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yesidrivea240-av says:
She just announced the change a few months ago, so there’s a high chance that most people are unaware of it.
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erikveland-av says:
A pop culture website (that also covered the name change) ought to be.
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yesidrivea240-av says:
Good point. I read about it on CNN, didn’t realize AV Club had a story about it.
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yesidrivea240-av says:
Doesn’t the phrase “dead naming” only apply to calling a trans person by their former birth name. I get it, spell her name right, but that’s not dead naming. It’s still pronounced the same way.
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brickstarter-av says:
The way it was shot it felt like there should have been a scene earlier in the film that introduces her maskless for SOME reason…but just another thing left out when they switched directors.
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laurenceq-av says:
Nah, because even if it wasn’t a familial reveal, the reveal was supposed to be: Here’s this horrible marauder who’s actually a sweet-looking young woman, so she can’t possibly be evil!
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bigbydub-av says:
“spoken up about her disappointment with Star Wars as a whole”The AV Club
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igotlickfootagain-av says:
But I remembered at the time thinking, “This is a big, big mistake.”The AV Club
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toddisok-av says:
I seem to vaguely recall having a baaad feeling about this…
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normchomsky1-av says:
If she survived she would’ve been paired with Lando and made to ride weird horses into battle for some reason, and yell “Han!” comically.
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send-in-the-drones-av says:
I considered watching “Solo” but decided there was no need for answers to questions I’d not had and skipped it as its only ability then would be to disappoint me by being a checklist movie – where did this come from, and so forth. Much like the circus snake scene in another franchise was.
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frankwalkerbarr-av says:
I’ll save you the trouble. Here are the answers:1. Origin of the name “Solo”. Han is really good at beer pong, so they named him after the maker of those red cups.2. Origin of the Millennium Falcon. Hatched from an egg laid by the Eon Falcon.3. Origin of the Kessel Run. Han was at a party where they ran out of kessel. So they asked him to go and bring back some more.4. Origin of his clothing choices with the vest. Han has poor taste in clothing.
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send-in-the-drones-av says:
Thanks – I was worried the answers would be far worse.
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thekinjacaffeinespider-av says:
“Reboots…why’s it always have to be reboots?!”
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scottsummers76-av says:
she has a point. And even if that was the end of Solo they could’ve brought her back in the extended universe.
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anguavonuberwald-av says:
I completely agree with her, and in fact rewrote the plot of the movie in the car on the way home in a way that she would have been a key member of the group for the rest of the movie, making it more interesting and more diverse. Such a waste of an opportunity, she is such a great actor and the character was a badass.
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garland137-av says:
My problem is that her death didn’t even really mean anything. It was set up like this noble sacrifice, but the thing she gave up her life to complete was. . . a regular-ass heist, for money. Yeah, failing to deliver to the Crimson Dawn would mean serious repercussions, but ultimately it was just a job stealing shit so they could get a big case full of credits. Hardly something deserving of that kind of self-sacrifice. Especially since the heist failed anyways and Han worked out a new deal with Crimson Dawn, so it just felt pointless. Beckett was upset for like 5 minutes before he moved on, so it didn’t even have any real effect on the surviving characters’ motivations.
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avclub-0806ebf2ee5c90a0ca0fd59eddb039f5--disqus-av says:
Rogue One needed to work towards the endpoint of (spoilers?) everyone dying. And given those constraints it works pretty well.Solo needed to work towards the endpoint of Solo being solo (+ chewie), and I think it did a much uglier job of it. It’s not just Newton’s character: everyone in that movie gets killed off in pointless ways. They to wring some pathos from L3, but that death is still very plothammery.
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garland137-av says:
That annoyed me too. L3’s “death” and subsequent upload into the Falcon’s computer system was done purely to explain Threepio’s “peculiar dialect” line in Empire. I found it doubly cringey because L3 was real big on droid independence and led a robot rebellion on Kessel, just for her supposed friends to integrate her into a starship, basically enslaving her. Makes me wonder if the Falcon constantly breaking down in the OT isn’t a maintenance issue but L3 trying to assert her independence again.
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avclub-0806ebf2ee5c90a0ca0fd59eddb039f5--disqus-av says:
I think the script could/should be rewritten so that Favreau’s & Newton’s characters didn’t die during the trainheist. Instead let the whole crew hang around for all of the shenanigans.Make L3 the movie’s big death, so that it actually feels like it matters. By that point in the actual movie we’ve already lost the other two, and honestly no one seems to care about them.So keep Favreau & Newton around until Harrelson’s big doublecross; Han shoots Harrelson; and then Favreau & Newton split because Harrelson doublecrossed them too, but they don’t actually like Han.I dunno. I didn’t hate the movie, but I’ve rewatched it a few times now, and it’s always just a big meh.
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toddisok-av says:
You mean you never heard of the Millennium Falcon? It’s the most passive-aggressive ship in the galaxy!
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triohead-av says:
“uh, only because you wanted to come to this galaxy. Like, in a normal, not lame, galaxy I wouldn’t even be in the top 1000. But then, I don’t get to enter the coordinates, do I? I just figure out how to get you there without getting turned into black hole spaghetti.”
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toddisok-av says:
Yeah but Newton is black and a woman so it’s fuel for the performative outrage machine that is the AV Club.
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dxanders-av says:
Are you really being performatively outraged about the alleged performative outrage machine?
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bikebrh-av says:
The sad thing is it wasn’t always this way. Joining Gizmedia and crosspollinating with Jezebel and The Root (both of which were good ideas that have long since gone off the rails)has been nothing but bad for The A.V. Club.
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arrowe77-av says:
But when we came to filming, as far as I was concerned and was aware,
when it came to filming that scene, it was too huge a set-piece to
create, so they just had me blow up and I’m done.That feels like a good reason to kill her off, or at least a forgivable one. They initially had good intentions but they ran out of time and/or money. At some point, you have to do what you can, even if it’s not what you want.
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toddisok-av says:
It’s not what you want; it’s what Thandiwe wants.
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castigere-av says:
She’s an employee. It’s not what she wants either. The movie was bad. Her character didn’t get an arc. The whoop ain’t all that big.
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fanburner-av says:
Erin Kellyman might have something to say about that.
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systemmastert-av says:
Hey at least they didn’t kill off Jannah, the black woman character they introduced in ROS to… oh right to be a love interest to a black male lead so that they could keep Rose Tico out of the proceedings entirely, avoid the popular gay interpretation with Poe… oh and to quell any American fears of chifforobe bustin’ on Rey’s behalf… actually nevermind, fuck Star Wars.
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mozzdog-av says:
Oh spare us.The figure of Rose – a later inclusion into the script – was just a pathetic attempt to mask the horrible optics of moving on from a Rey-Finn focus to Rey and Kylo.I felt sorry for Tran: both for the racist and sexist online sentiments as well as the transparency of her function in the film.Johnson had totally dismantled Finn and pushed the Ren-Rey romantic relationship as the key one in this trilogy. Johnson admitted that he saw Rey and Kylo in TFA as the beginning of a “romantic” and “intimate” dynamic. She saw him murder his father and her mentor and Johnson felt that was “romantic” and “intimate”? Jesus. Without pointing fingers at persons, placing the two white characters as a “romantic” and “intimate” coupling is simply what institutional racism looks like. When Kylo and Rey first speak to each other in TLJ, she doesn’t even mention Finn even though he sacrificed himself to protect her, her was in a coma the last time she saw him and he could be dead for all she knows. This is the casual erasure of Finn in favor of a dynamic that was considered more palatable. Racism may have not been the intention but it is the result. Boyega had every right to speak out against the blatant and insidious undermining of his character. The only glimmer of hope from Johnson’s film is that his creative failure was so overwhelming that the smirking and patronising Johnson won’t be darkening the doors of LucasFilm again.
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laurenceq-av says:
Narratively speaking, the death of Val was so friggin’ pointless and carried zero dramatic weight. It was pretty terrible in the context of the movie itself, let alone all the real-world issues that Thandie pointed out.
Bleh, Solo was such a friggin’ whiff. -
hamiltonistrash-av says:
I thought Solo was the one we don’t talk about
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it-has-a-super-flavor--it-is-super-calming-av says:
It’s actually pretty good.
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hamiltonistrash-av says:
I’m not in the business of telling people their subjective value judgements are wrong.But if I was…
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it-has-a-super-flavor--it-is-super-calming-av says:
How about compared to other movies, it’s actually surprisingly good. (problems with production, recasting beloved characters, etc. and it still comes together, entertains and is good. Not great, but ok.)
But compared to other Star Wars movies, it’s still actually pretty good. (prequels generally sucked, sequels generally sucked, even the additional material in the special editions generally sucked.) Don’t forget, at this point in time there’s more bad Star Wars than good.-
hamiltonistrash-av says:
So we went from “it’s actually pretty good” to “how about compared to other movies”. One suggestion moved your goalposts?
There’s 2 1/2 good star wars movies out of 11. You don’t have to qualify the ones that are bad. Solo is the “Thor 2″ of the Star Wars universe. -
it-has-a-super-flavor--it-is-super-calming-av says:
Your own OP indirectly compares Solo to at least other Star Wars movies.
You’re pulling out the “moved your goalposts” card? Really?
More painted the goalposts a different color rather than moved them.
I still maintain it’s a good movie. Good being the operative word. I just provide further explanation by comparing to all other movies. How else would you qualify a movie? What don’t you like about it? I’d say there are a few other Star Wars movies that could be called the “Thor 2″ of the Star Wars universe before Solo. -
inspectorhammer-av says:
Solo’s biggest problem was in being a Star Wars movie that did way too much ‘look at this thing you remember!’ If someone was somehow unfamiliar with Star Wars, yet liked science fiction/fantasy, then Solo would have been plenty fun as a standalone heist movie in a colorful universe.
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lurklen-av says:
Yep, huge waste of a potentially interesting character. But then that was basically that whole movie, they were in such a hurry to get to the fireworks factory they forgot to do anything interesting with all the elements along the way. The movie was a series of “how” but was awful short on “why”. Good opportunity to give us the “why” of Han Solo through the foundational characters of his story, spent instead on the “how” he got his name, his ship, his gun, his look, his Wookie, his rival/friend, his rep.
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toddisok-av says:
I can’t remember anything about this movie or that she was in it
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igotlickfootagain-av says:
I just can’t see any part or stage of this movie’s creation that warranted wasting an actor of Newton’s abilities like they did all over. Killing her character was bad optics and boring creatively, but nothing else here indicates they had good plans in store for Newton.
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robgrizzly-av says:
Mixed feelings. Not that I remember much about this movie, but I recall having a similar reaction to that scene for similar reasons. I assumed because of the very status Newton is talking about, that this character would more or less be immune from peril.
But I also recall feeling ashamed I reacted that way. It’s the sort of thing that usually doesn’t matter to me, because I don’t think any character should be ‘safe’ just because of arbitrary factors. It’s annoying. I’m a proponent of serving the story, and nobody should exempt. So, on that note, I also recall concluding it took guts to kill her off, because surely they might take some heat for it. Funnily enough, in the end, it didn’t matter too much to the story, and nobody cared anyway, which sums up Solo in a nutshell, I guess. -
m0rtsleam-av says:
Think I mentioned this before, but I was really bored one night and caught Solo on TBS or something, broken up into 7 minute minute chunks over the course of 3 or 4 hours, I realized – they never should have made it a movie. Too much backstory to plow through, too many new characters that don’t get enough time. However, especially after the success of the Mandalorian, they should have made it a series. One season of Han and Beckett and Val pulling capers, leading up to the climactic train robbery. That way, even if Newton’s character still dies, she has more of an arc, and they explore more of her relationship with Beckett, so you understand his bitterness. Then go on to a full season with Lando. Hell, I still think they could take whatever ideas they had for the second movie (Duet?) and make show out of it, get Donald Glover and Emilia Clarke and even Alden Ehrenreich back. He was fine as young Han, much the same way Tyler Hoechlin is fine as Superman, but not necessarily a movie version.
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imodok-av says:
Not only was Newton the first black woman to have significant role in a Star Wars film, she brought ambiguities and qualities to the part that made the character more than what was in the script. I had the feeling Newton could handle Harrelson’s gang as well as he could. And as loyal as she seemed, there was also a sense that she as or even more ruthless than Harrelson’s character, and perfectly capable of doing whatever she deemed necessary to care of her interests. That ambiguity made her more intriguing than a devoted girlfriend willing to sacrifice herself for Harrelson’s crime boss. The filmmaker’s were so focused on Solo that they missed the opportunity for some entertaining double and triple crosses.William, there are a couple of interesting listicle ideas here: a) what character in movie died too soon or should not have died at all and b) what character in a supporting role had the most wasted potential? Bodhi in Rogue One, for example, is a good character and great actor that is largely wasted imo.
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rogersachingticker-av says:
Then again, part of what’s good about Rogue One is that, aside from Jyn and maybe Cassian, every other major character is someone we’d be interested to spend more time with. You’re right that Bohdi is a special case, though, since it seemed like they were going somewhere with him being damaged by his encounter with Bor Gullet, but then it just turns out to not be such a big deal.
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cjob3-av says:
And why did Lando Calrissian have to betray the heroes? Couldn’t he have just been like, a great guy?
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toddisok-av says:
Lando is an effective manager! He knows when a deal is getting irretrievably worst.
All the time.
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soundlogic-av says:
Characters die in movies, that’s just how it works, it generates drama and tension. No reason to bring race into it, don’t they typically tell you your character is going to die before you take the role to let you know you won’t be in a sequel if there ever is one?
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toddisok-av says:
“No reason to bring race into it”?! Buddy, this is the AV Club!
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wrecksracer-av says:
I think she dodged a bullet. Who wants to be in any new Star Wars film?
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frankwalkerbarr-av says:
He can play Han Solo! But rather than the jokey, charismatic character that he’s been portrayed as before (even by Ehrenreich, but not as well as by Ford), he can play him as a uncharismatic, overserious bore just as he portrayed Bond!
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toddisok-av says:
You’ve given it more thought than I have. Craig’s Solo would ALWAYS shoot first.
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frankwalkerbarr-av says:
But would frown afterwards indicating that he was morally conflicted (or possibly had indigestion).
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bembrob-av says:
To be fair, most, if not all of the Star Wars movies over the last 10 years have been disappointments.Solo wasn’t terrible. It was mostly a fun, heist movie but wholly unnecessary.
People rave about Rogue One and while it certainly looked and felt like a Star Wars movie, none of the characters particularly resonated and the only part most people remember are the last 20 minutes.
The sequel trilogy speaks for itself.-
toddisok-av says:
Damn, Cranston’s making sense over here…GIT ‘IM!!!
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themightymanotaur-av says:
Maybe if the character had been well written and had some presence they’d have kept her alive but i think she was written with the intent of her being killed off for plot purposes. Love Thandiwe, she’s an amazing actress but this was just a poor role that she really struggled to get anything out of. I honestly do not know why she thought she’d go further into the series.
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coldsavage-av says:
I say this somewhat flippantly, but JJ Abrams should have done Solo instead of the ST. Solo was an exercise in over-explaining a backstory I think few fans actually wanted and thus served as a lot of nostalgic fan-wanking. And the end (i.e. how Han gets to Star Wars) is already pre-determined, so whatever mystery box he would choose to use already had an endpoint where the OT picks up.
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lenoceur-av says:
Solo was a terrible movie in many respects, just add this to the list.
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