Picard is on a good little run right now. “The Impossible Box” continues last week’s focus, moving the plot forward by feet instead of inches, and if that means the return of everyone’s favorite Romulan siblings, well, at least they don’t simply repeat the same conversation again. (Well, okay, they sort of do, but there’s a cool prop this time.) The episode ends with Picard finally catching up with Soji, and, with Hugh’s help, rescuing her from the Romulans through a secret Borg Queen escape teleporter. Agnes struggles with the fallout from killing her ex, Raffi is on a bender but still manages to do some good, and Elnor is endearing and possibly also dies at the end? It’s a good time.
But it didn’t entirely work for me. If all you want is a decent sci-fi series that tugs on nostalgia while vaguely nodding towards some Big Ideas, you could do worse, and I’ll admit to feeling ambivalent about my ambivalence; as with Star Trek: Discovery, there’s always the chance that me not being completely on board for all for this is less about the quality of the series itself and more about my inability to let go of the past. A friend on Twitter recently pointed out that saying something “isn’t Star Trek” isn’t really an effective criticism. Franchises change over time, and that’s honestly a good thing—or at least, better than a franchise incapable of change. (You could ask if “franchises” are good for art in general, but that’s too big a question to deal with right now, I think.)
So, if you’re enjoying this, please take my frustrations as not an attack on your enjoyment, or as an attempt to convince you out of liking something, and more as me struggling to explain a gut reaction I barely understand myself. I thought the pilot was good. I’ve been trying to engage with the show as it introduces new characters, and I’ve appreciated its efforts to present a more morally complex few of the Federation, stripping anyway the utopian vision of the earlier series for a more complicated view of a feature where people (of all species) are just as messed up and struggling as they ever were.
Those things are still worth praising, and the performances remain strong. Michelle Hurd does some great work this week, and Allison Pill is fantastic; I’m glad we got to spend a little more time with Jonathan Del Arco as Hugh, one of the few bright spots in this future (or at least, one of the few characters who seems to be doing actively better than when we saw him last). Hell, I still don’t think the Soji/Narek relationship works as well as the writers do, but I’ll be damned if Isa Briones and Harry Treadway don’t do their best to sell it.
It’s just—well, take Picard himself. Patrick Stewart is as charming as ever, but the longer this goes on, the less the character he plays seems to be written as an extension of what we saw in Next Gen, and the more he looks like a representation of someone’s idea of what “Picard” represents. This Picard bullheaded, arrogant, and naive, charging forward into crises and assuming other people will see the nobility of his cause and protect him. He’s not a monster or a fool, and we have reason to believe he’s not entirely well—but he’s also frustratingly lacking in self-awareness or introspection, as though he spent the vast majority of his career unwilling (or unable) to think of the potential consequences of his actions.
Is this the Next Gen Picard? I don’t think so. It’s hard to make a case one way or the other with absolute authority, given that this is art, and art is subjective, and I’m not trying to accuse the writers of skimping on research or not being fans of the series they’re riffing on. But it feels off to me. The original Picard (excluding the movies which are, to be kind, a bit of a mess character-wise) believed in things and had his failings, but one of things that defined him was his thoughtfulness; he took action when necessary, but he was rarely rash or foolish, and his compassion worked in conjunction with his judgment. There was a reason Q found him fascinating, and it wasn’t because he was brash. The argument that Kirk was an action hero and Picard was a thinker was always too over-simplified to really stick, but it came from somewhere. When I had the good fortune of watching and reviewing the whole series, what struck me most is how well it functioned as a rich, complex character study of a man working to understand his place in the universe, and how he could best serve himself and others in his work.
Yet here we have a Picard who has spent a decade and a half as a recluse because something didn’t work out that one time. A Picard who has no idea what’s going on in the places that used to be important to him but blunders forward anyway, because he’s convinced he’s right. I don’t think the original character was above reproach, but it would require a defter touch than “he’s arrogant and out of touch but still a hero!” It’s an archetype that’s been grafted onto a familiar face, and the longer I watch the show, the more I feel like it’s nearly all archetypes, not-terrible pulp ideas without much interest in real subversion or depth.
Like: Soji and Narek. Why does Narek have feelings for her? I believe we’ve seen enough of their time together to get the jist of their relationship, and it’s fine as far as those things go, but nothing about Soji stands out in particular; she has no apparent insight into his character, and we know so little about him apart from his creepy relationship with his sister that there’s nothing to get a purchase on, nothing to make this connection have weight beyond providing an excuse for meaningless ambiguity. Narek falls for Soji because undercover agents in stories tend to fall for their targets, so they can get all weepy when it comes time to betray them. It’s no more than that. This isn’t a trope so bad it ruins the show, but the fact that we spent as much time with them as we did, and it adds up to exactly what it appears to be, is disappointing.
Then there’s Picard’s visit to the Artifact. This was something you knew was coming since the first episode ended on a reveal of the Borg cube. Picard’s history as Locutus is one of the most easily exploitable fracture points in his character, so of course he was going to end up on the cube eventually. And of course when he got there, he’d be upset. Which he is. (For some bizarre reason, the Romulan government insists that Picard beam to a specific spot on the cube where he gets to stand by himself for a few minutes and have some really uncomfortable flashbacks.) And it’s fine, but it’s also exactly what you’d imagine it would be. There’s no depth here, no greater understanding of why Picard is making the choices he’s making. The biggest relief is the warmth with which he greets Hugh, and the small scraps of information we get about Hugh’s work to reintegrate the ex-Bs back into society. Everything else feels like anyone could’ve written it.
What I’m looking for is a reason to engage with this story beyond familiarity, beyond it existing simply because revisiting a popular character is a good way to pull in an audience. I want a valid reason for this to exist that isn’t purely financial. Even the criticism of the Federation feels rote; none of it is harsher than what we saw in Deep Space 9, and even Next Gen had its share of bad politics getting in the way of good behavior. There are flashes of inspiration, moments where you can see things almost coming into their own, but they’ve yet to coalesce into anything but moments. It’s competent, mostly, but the decision to spend an entire season on this single storyline makes everything feel like a long pilot, as though we’re just waiting for things to really get started. And that structure means that interesting ideas, like the Borg ship or Elnor’s home or Dr. Jurati’s work or Raffi’s past or what in the hell Rios’s whole deal is, never really get a chance to come into their own.
I’m invested enough to want to see what the “truth” Bruce Maddox was searching for is all about, and now that Picard and Soji are teamed up, we’ll probably get some fun “Soji struggling with her identity” scenes. Her escape from Narek’s death trap was thrilling, as was her horror at discovering that she, and everything she owns, is only 37 months old. But I want this series to find a perspective, and soon. Right now, it’s just skimming over a tasteful surface, artfully crafted but not quite able to cover for the emptiness below.
Stray observations
- I would’ve liked seeing Agnes struggling a little more to cover for the murder. Pill does a great job of playing up the emotional fallout, but spending some time seeing the practical steps required to hide such a big crime in a fancy future ship would’ve been cool (and, as opposed to the weird Romulan CSI interlude from a few episodes back, been actually character relevant).
- If Elnor actually dies, it’s going to be a horrible waste of a fun character. “Was I in-butting?”
- They play goofy comedy music as a drunken Raffi strongarms a Starfleet contact into getting Picard diplomatic credentials, and then everyone applauds when she succeeds. Hurd is excellent in the scene, but everything else is pushing way too hard to make it a bonding moment.
- Narek using Soji’s dreams to crack the secret of where she came from is clever, but it would’ve been more interesting if he hadn’t minded killing her at all.
227 Comments
This Picard bullheaded, arrogant, and naive, charging forward into crises and assuming other people will see the nobility of his cause and protect him.He’s been like this from the beginning so I’m giving the writers the benefit of the doubt right now. That would/could be the real reason why he didn’t go asking Riker, LaForge, or even Crusher for help: They’d call him out on it cuz they’re fam.But yeah, if episode ten wraps up and he’s still a self-absorbed idjit then I’ll agree it was a fundamental case of altering the character fit the plot. If Elnor actually dies…Getting rid of the likable Spock/Data/Odo/EMH/Phlox/Saru character would be a really bad idea.
I think Picard’s characterization rings true, for the most part. Any arrogance he has, he came by honestly, with a history of being able to warp in and take control of the fleet with a single word. Without the Starfleet structure, he’s flailing. That all works for me.I’ve said before, though, that I’d like to see some sign that he tried (and failed) to do something else for the Romulans after resigning from Starfleet, before he became a hermit. I do feel like he would have.
Arrogant is one thing, but sortof dumb is another.Picard can certainly be absolutely convinced of the righteousness of his cause. But he’s also the type of character who really should have a plan for when things don’t go his way.He doesn’t need to be Batman; thinking 100 steps ahead of his enemies. But he really shouldn’t be completely blindsided every time that people don’t agree with him. Although maybe the show is just making a specific point about his age.
I don’t think it’s a point about his age per se, but rather about how different his situation is. He’s not used to working without a support network – in the past, even if he defied Starfleet, he knew his crew had his back.Now, he’s deliberately keeping them out of it, and is flailing a little. Frankly, I think anyone would, with the limited resources available to him.
Picard’s behavior in this show is pretty similar to his behavior in “All Good Things, both in the past timeline and the guy timeline. In the past timeline, he just ordered everyone around to go on all these wild errands without explanation. He was lucky that the crew were willing to lay down their lives for him no matter how crazy he acted.In the future timeline, everyone humored him and took him on this one last mission. Whenever he ran into a wall, he ranted and people gave in out of deference. At least until Crusher’s ship got destroyed. Then they had enough of his crap and sedated him.
He is over 80 years old and thrown into this out of nowhere after 15 years of retirement. It is understandable he feel this way and finally has a little mea culpa moment the first time he meets his old friends who know him extremely well and can call him out on his actions.
His resignation was supposed to be a bluff/callout, they just took him up on it.
We do know that the VULCANS apparently tried to help the Romulans, at least. We know this from the first Abrams film, where Spock and the vulcans built a ship that was going to try and *stop* the thing that ultimately destroyed Romulus.
There’s no evidence that any Vulcan other than Spock himself was involved. For all we know, he stole that ship.
No, we know that LaForge and the Vulcan Science Academy built the ship. We also know it was programmed to recognize *only* Spock as it’s pilot, which means he couldn’t have stolen it. It was meant to be piloted by *him*. This is all on the Memory Alpha, Beta and official wikis.
LaForgeFrom a comic book that was never canon, and has been explicitly retconned by this show.I’m willing to allow that the Vulcan Science Academy certainly may have given him the ship to use, but even in that non-canon comic you’re referencing, Spock and La Forge went rogue, without the Vulcans’ help.
I know they’d never come out and say this but I just sorta assume the prime universe from the JJ movies is not actually the main Star Trek universe. It’s a similar one where Data did re-emerge in B4 and the supernova was a lot more sudden and somehow a danger to the whole galaxy.
No, from the Star Trek Universe supplemental material they’ve stated is canon.
No supplemental material is Star Trek canon.
That is absolutely incorrect. The Star Trek Picard comics are 100% canon, for instance.
It is absolutely not incorrect, and I challenge you to find a single statement from CBS that says, “these comics are canon.”Hint: there isn’t one.
https://screenrant.com/star-trek-comic-books-canon-picard/
https://www.polygon.com/comics/2020/1/23/21077131/star-trek-picard-comics-idw-marvel-dc-historyDo I actually have a quote from a CBS exec regarding Picard? No, I do not.
Do I actually have a quote from a CBS exec regarding Picard? No, I do not.Yeah, exactly. Because they’re not canon.Now, to be clear, I don’t think it matters much. They’re unquestionably being coordinated with the writers of the shows much more closely than has ever been the case before, and it’s worth looking at them to consider the intent of the shows’ writers.But they’re still not canon, and one of the “Discovery” novels has already been thrown onto the canonical trash heap. Because it was never really canon to begin with.
Or you could look at them as canon until they are contradicted by a show/movie.
Sure, look at them however you like. Look at Star Trek/X-Men as canon if you want to, nobody’s stopping you.
Right, but you can’t objectively say they aren’t canon at this point.
come to think of it, what i was talking about where he definitely stole the ship might have been in a deleted scene
I thought the Vulcans decided they weren;t going to help the romulans, allegedly because if the technology fell into their hands it would be to dangerous, but really because they weren’t sure Romulus getting fried was the worst thing (and remembering their history with the romulans, although harsh there is probably some logic to this) so Spock has to steal th red mater device and tried *but failed) to prevent the supernova
Didn’t he?His housemates at the vineyard mentioned what he did for them, and they didn’t seem to be part of a massive group relocation.Maybe I’m misinterpreting it, but I figured they were part of a last, mostly failed attempt to help, and went home with him because he no longer had anywhere else to take them.
I don’t think they’ve given us any kind of timeline. They may have been rescued in an early or preliminary mission, before the mass evacuation started.I’d prefer it if it went down the way you suggest, though.
The resuce attempt was commanded and organized by Picard, and he did save A LOT of romulans, just not all of them (on Romulus) because it was called off in the middle because of the Mars attack
Well, he did. He tried what he considered the ultimate bluff – that Starfleet would never allow the former captain of the fleet’s flagships, the hero of the battle of Sector 001, the former Arbiter of Succession of the Klingon Empire, the most decorated and renowned officer of the 24th century, to resign. He had himself convinced that was the nuclear option, the one line that they would not cross. THIS FAR! NO FARTHER! THE LINE MUST BE DRAWN AT MY COMMISSION!But they called him on it and it broke him. His ideal of himself was so tied up in Starfleet, his moral compass so lashed to his duty that when they came into conflict, when he could no longer reconcile them, his sense of self was obliterated. That’s why he never tried to go back to check on the Romulans. That’s why he never went back to check on Rafi. He went into a spiritual coma for 14 years and tried to be Robert, the brother who thought that all that stuff was complete nonsense anyway.
It might help is Raffi seemed more concerned about his actions. She’s the only character that’s known him a long time, and she served with him when he was still the TNG Picard (not literally on the show, but before he resigned from Starfleet). If she was constantly questioning his actions, it would go a long way.
She has done that a lot. You can’t repeat the same things over and over in dialogue.
It didn’t really stick with me.
I think the issue for me is that I can’t necessarily draw a line from TNG Picard to this one, even taking into account the passage of time and the effect of his personal and professional failures. So it just seems like Picard’s age/brain condition have overtaken him. Or sloppy writing.
Elnor is hardly the Spock/Data/Odo/EMH/Phlox/Saru equivalent here.Hard to be the curious outsider when you have almost zero dialogue or personality.
I’m reasonably convinced by Picard’s development as a character (both on-screen and off) in the intervening years since TNG. Yes, Picard Picard is not TNG Picard, but neither was First Contact/Insurrection/Nemesis Picard, and I think we see evolution of the character through the three versions.
I have some questions of my own about whether this Picard track with, let’s call him, “JLP Classic.” I’m not sure he does, but I agree that it depends on how the rest of the season goes -I trust Chabon enough to let it play out first. My real question for each action, though, is “would JLP Classic have done this, and if not, what specifically has changed to explain the discrepancy?” I don’t think they’ve done enough yet to really satisfactorily answer the second part. If they do in the next four episodes, I’ll be on board, but if not, I concede I’ll be disappointed with the show, even if I enjoyed the rest of it on its own merits.
I remember Picard in First Contact almost coming to blows with Worf because Picard wasn’t going to sacrifice the Enterprise to the Borg.
His dialogue with Worf, and most of what he says to Lily Sloane is almost exactly “bullheaded, arrogant, and naive, charging forward into crises and
assuming other people will see the nobility of his cause and protect him”.
Yeah, and First Contact was all about him realizing that that close-minded and combative attitude of his was a result of his mostly-untreated PTSD related *specifically* to the borg, and that he was acting irrationally out of a desire for revenge on the group that hurt him. He steps down and apologizes to Worf afterwards. Why is he still stuck in that character beat after 20 years, and even before he realizes the borg are involved in any way with this situation?
Perhaps because Picard’s still dealing with all sorts of different trauma in this series and he can’t jump over his own shadow, even if he’s overcome it in the past.
That’s kind of the larger point. The writers really are, at best, only writing ‘movie Picard’, who basically went against type in every TNG movie so he could hop in a dune buggy. There are plenty of episodes of the show where Picard believes what he is doing is correct, only to realize he’s been completely wrong and then he corrects that himself. And many of those episodes take place after Best of Both. Picard being that way with the Borg makes some sense but not just as a general character flaw we’re just supposed to assume he has now for some reason.
That’s not even getting into the fact that the Federation just stopped being the Federation for some reason, or that the reunification that was both known and a goal driven by the Federations most famous Vulcan was just abandoned, or that many Romulans were working to move in a more cooperative direction with the Federation, as seen in Unification and even at the end of Nemesis since apparently the movies are where this show pulls its characterization from.
Part of me wants to keep giving this show a chance, but that effort is getting exhausting.
Elnor = Space Elrond with a katana.Now you can’t unsee it.
I think you mean, getting rid of the space elf would be a really bad idea.
“This Picard bullheaded, arrogant, and naive, charging forward into crises and assuming other people will see the nobility of his cause and protect him.”When you really think about it, it’s basically a slightly edgier take on the “All Good Things…” future Picard, and we’re actually a little past that future timeline now. He’s got the same sense of impatient urgency, the same sense that no one really understand the magnitude of the situation except him. He just wants people to trust him, but at the same time he trust these people too (probably to a fault). I don’t find it all that much of a stress for Picard, really.
Why is Elnor on the show? An episode was set aside to recruit him – so far he’s stood in the background, failing to pretend to be a bad guy in ‘Rag’ and in this he’s told to stay on the ship. He was recruited to be Picards sword, and then is barely used by Picard.
There was a bit more afoot in the diplomatic credentials scene. Raffi is clearly devastated when her friend the captain tells her never to contact her again—another relationship lost to the madness of her cause.
Yeah, she looked brokenhearted and everyone else looked like they completely missed the point.
Yeah, when Picard started clapping as Raffi was stumbling away and taking a swig, it really hit me in all the rights ways.
I felt like the officer onscreen could have said the last line more convincingly, or a more interesting personal version of the line, and we would have gotten it better. “That’s it. This is the last thing you get from me. Good luck.” That kind of thing.
The Soji/Narek/Artifact storyline has definitely been the weakest portion of the series.My solution would have been to remove all that stuff out of the previous episodes, and put it all into a full hour of “here’s what Soji’s been up to” right before this episode. The entire arc could have been restructured into a single story taking place across however long it’s been (a couple of weeks?).I felt the same way about the Klingon story in “Point of Light.” It doesn’t quite work when it shares the space with what’s going on with the Discovery crew, but might have been a cool standalone episode.Also, I think this I’ll admit to feeling ambivalent about my ambivalence; as with Star Trek: Discovery, there’s always the chance that me not being completely on board for all for this is less about the quality of the series itself and more about my inability to let go of the past.is refreshing, and I thank Zack for it.
Zack is old school AVClub. Hope things are going well for him.
Someone really needs to do a fan edit to fix all of the borg stuff.Meeting Hugh, and being introduced to the Borg reclamation stuff would have been so much more interesting if we’d learned about it in this episode, through Picard’s eyes. Instead it was dribbled out a few weeks ago, and I (for one) shrugged.I don’t know if I’ve ever seen writers try so hard to spoil all of their own big plot beats before.
If I didn’t read reviews I wouldn’t have realized it was Hugh until this episode; we were never given his name.
I think y’all are where I am though. It feels to me like a lot of what we’ve seen that’s been off could have worked with some restructuring. It’s the damned 10 hour movie format that’s messing with it. It’s made for a binge watch but coming out week to week. I wish they’d kept the dead sister for a couple of episodes before her death. And then like you said not caught up with Soj until now-ish in its own thing.
I’m pretty sure we found out it was Hugh the first time he was in an episode. Or, very early on at least.
Soji refers to him by name as Hugh in the first episode he appears. Also, the character is played by Jonathan Del Arco, who played Hugh previously. All the information was there.
I actually wonder if some of this might be on Chabon, and that it’s actually more of a novel-problem than a movie-problem.Because it would be pretty typical to spend the first chunk of a book bouncing back and forth between unrelated characters and settings, until everything finally gels midway through.But for this season it just hasn’t worked, because every episode Picard learns some amazing new revelation that the audience has known about for weeks.But finally, finally we’re at the point where our main character knows as much as we do. So maybe the show can just tell a story, now.
I think you could be right here. Just finished reading The Adventures of Kavalier & Clay, and he sets up a lot of stuff that just hangs there for the whole book.
Soji called him “Hugh” in his previous episode.
In a very differently styled telling of the same story, we might meet Soji as a medical doctor in a hospital-like facility and not really dwell on or learn about what exactly she does. We would see her hooking up with a new Romulan hottie. We are interested because they are motivating sincere characters in a cool future medical facility, with daily grind issues (think how The Orville would do it). Also she is obviously a clone/twin of the character who got blown up in the other storyline we are also following, how interesting!Gradually, we find out that her specialty is restoring patients who have been through something horrifying. The message boards go crazy with people speculating it’s former Borg.An ep or two in, we are stunned to find out the smoldering sweetie is secretly reporting to someone he appears to have some kind of sexual allegiance thing with. She’s an android and doesn’t know it? Riveting!Picard finds out where she is by coordinates. He realizes it’s in Romulan space and they go in.When they get there, they find a Borg cube! I TOLD YOU IT WAS THE BORG — The A.V. Club. Picard’s ship goes to red alert! Wait, it’s not raising any weapons. Is this where the fabled Artifact is currently parked? We zoom slowly into the cube and reveal… the doctor and her boyfriend spy (which really seemed like the more mundane and less interesting scenario) are on a freaking Borg cube! Picard acts like he’s full of strategy and wisdom. He consults books in his study. Elnor picks up on the fact that he’s bluffing; he’s freaked out. He refuses to acknowledge this.That’s when we get Episode 6.
We still don’t yet know they are brother and sister.P.S. The alcohol subplot does not exist in this universe. It’s neither funny nor interesting.Thanks for allowing me this vent, AVClub!
If Elnor actually dies,
He has a sword against disrupters.But I’m pretty sure New Trek think Romulans are Jedi, so he’s fine.
Klingons use melee weapons far less practical than swords against people with phasers.
Klingons also use disruptors. They wouldn’t be a warrior race for long if they only used bathlets against an enemy with guns that comes to them from afar and outnumbers them…
Also who cares if Elnor dies, because Geordi will be crushed if Hugh dies.
Jadzia and Pinhead would make for a fine crossover. What?
Soji’s “father” looks suspiciously like Dr. Bashir.
Now that you mention it, that suddenly dawns on me that it is true and would be an excellent twist. I kept wondering why the father we saw looked nothing like Maddox.It would also make sense because while Maddox figured out how to create the pair, they still needed someone who could the body. And that would be a fitting role for Bashir for several reasons.
Like the fact that Bashir is ALSO a ‘banned person’, and has done a lot to help genetically altered people?Also, canonically he’s currently in a “catatonic state”, so it wouldn’t be too hard a push to assume Maddox or someone working for Maddox could’ve helped him.
It’s Lore. Right? Or somehow Data.
You’re not wrong, though weirdly the voice was *absolutely* Brent Spiner.
Lore.
Yeah, however I can’t see it coming to fruition. While there have been some tiny, tiny throwbacks to DS9, the writers and showrunners haven’t demonstrated any serious hails to that part of the Star Trek universe. Not nearly to the extent that they are doing for Voyager.
I mean, there was that bar named Quark!
But I could see them maybe mining more DS9 stuff in future seasons. The whole Bajor in-or-out of the Federation political thing seems ripe for commentary these days.
Mostly, I just want to see Garak included in these shows before Andrew Robinson dies…
You’re correct about overt call backs to DS9 but the morally ambiguous tone, especially concerning Star Fleet, matches DS9.
I, Borg has always been my favorite Next Gen episode and I love that they are using Hugh and I hope there are more explorations of what it is to be an ex-borg between him, Seven and Picard. I could watch a series based just on that.
Man – there are at least 20 TNG episodes I’d put ahead of that one but I’ll admit I’m sorta biased against it because it set up that awful 2 parter Descent. Descent could have been such a great episode but was just an epic fail.
It sounds like someone had a story idea and then changed Picard to fit into it.
i appreciate that you are grappling with your bias(es) against the show. two things might help:1) you don’t need to wonder if it is the same picard from tng – it’s not. stewart talked about this a lot as why he agreed to do it. 2) man, this:Yet here we have a Picard who has spent a decade and a half as a recluse because something didn’t work out that one time.congrats on your charmed life bro, but fyi trauma leaves people in absolute ruin most of the time. data died, spock died, the rescue fleet was destroyed, and starfleet betrayed and abandoned him. plus he had left the enterprise so his social support system was gone. this is the trauma that the writers have used to both make this show different and build a narrative arc from the picard of tng to the picard on this show. if this seems trivial or inexplicable to you, maybe check out books like Waking the Tiger or The Body Keeps the Score.the show isn’t perfect, but the things you trivialize are what gives it depth, and the very premise of the show is a direct answer to the question “is this the same picard?” and the answer is: no.
The criticism with this show is strikingly similar to the criticism of the Star Wars sequels. “LUKE SKYWALKER WOULDN’T ACT THIS WAY!”It’s like how dare they show that people can change when given 30 years, and that change is never what you think it’s going to be?
The issue is always about what is earned vs. what isn’t. Every start of a story you can set the pieces any way you want to – it’s the writers choice.Legacy characters though you have a bit of an issue. The backstory exists. It “happened.” Tragedy is great, because well done it shows where something you don’t want to happen happens and the way it’s written makes it inevitable. It’s earned, but it’s painful. Walter White, Wallace (The Wire), etc. The more you show a character, the more it is on the writer to show how the thing you don’t want to see is what you’re seeing.
Both Star Wars and Picard sidestep that. They throw it out with, “this is the backstory, deal with it.” While newcomers, passive fans, or people who just like a twist may be drawn to it, in reality it is a dramatic jump of the highest order. Because even in Picard, we only know what we know. There are facts about him – but why and the inevitability of it emotionally crippling him into this just isn’t shown. The audience has to leap to follow along and in the case of people who watched original SW or TNG, it represents a massive jump in story terms.The reason I think you see such anger is the “unearned” jump. MCU is largely popular because it doesn’t make these jumps. It hews close to the source material and the changes it makes generally feel organic to the story. It’s main characters however may have different moods, but if they’re going to massively change characterization it is not shown off-screen or the jump they do make is immediately understandable.
i am also entertained by the implicit notion that there is a real future picard, against which this future picard can be judged. it’s a fictional character! people can do whatever they want. maybe i like it (and i do). maybe i don’t like it (not what i would have done with luke!). but not like there is some kind of “legitimacy” or “authenticity” or whatever quality is being questioned; we are talking about made up people!
Headcanon needs to fuck off and die.
It’s not the same Picard but it also doesn’t feel like a logical extension of the Picard we know. It feels like maybe an extension of movie Picard who was a completely different character to the TV version.
Yeah, I’m really enjoying it, and maybe that’s because I have a less rigid view of, “What Picard should be.”His admiration for Hugh at find a way to heal victims of the Borg was Picard.His loud repudiation of Starfleet’s cowardice at abandoning the Romulans was Picard.His willingness to go halfway across the galaxy for the hope of saving a small piece of his friend was Picard.If this “isn’t Star Trek”, I’m glad for that.
Perfectly put, thank you.
To add to what you are saying, the feeling I am getting from watching is that things between him and his fellow Starfleet officers were tense before the whole rescue mission came up and failed. Sure he resigned, but I think that was akin to “I resigned, before they told me to leave”.
The interactions that are shown with Starfleet Officials show people that came up after him and they don’t seem to have the moral character that he had/has. That they rather resent him for it and at one time, being in a position to dictate what they did and now that they are the ones in command are more than happy to tell him to pound salt.Particularly if there are agents working within to shape their views on what is happening in general throughout the Federation and specifically reinforcing a disdain for Picard.
Zack articulates some of things I’ve been thinking about this show. There are definitely things I dislike partly because they are different from the Star Trek of yore. One really superficial element that bugs me would be that so many of the costumes look really contemporary, similar to something you could go out and buy today. Maybe they are experiencing a resurgence in 2020 fashion in this universe, but the “futuristic” (and sometimes goofy) wardrobe of earlier Trek really set the tone for the show.On the other hand, I’m not sure I would still be watching this show if it weren’t Star Trek Picard. My overwhelming feeling is that the characters are kind of wandering around in the plot, just waiting to move on to the next twist or reveal. It’s hard to feel moved by Raffi’s personal problems because I don’t really know who she is, outside of her role of conveniently getting the things (info, credentials, etc.) that remove obstacles in Picard’s way. Same with Elnor— he exists to chop up the bad guys so I’m not too concerned about him staying behind on the cube, especially since he’ll probably show up when needed in a later episode.
Star Trek was always a character-driven series in its many incarnations but with Discovery and Picard, that seems to be the one thing the writers lack in both depth and cohesion. They check off a list of common character tropes but there’s very little beyond that in the characters themselves and thus find myself struggling to get invested or care about any of them.These would be perfectly fine popcorn sci-fi shows were they not tied to Star Trek in any way but even more so if they didn’t drag in iconic characters we’ve come to know over the last 50 years and reinterpret them in a manner that is almost completely alien to the audience you wrote them in to attract in the first place.
Exactly – One draw back of serial dramas is that if you want to do characters correctly it has to be a slow burn. See Breaking Bad, The Wire, Mad Men. Episodic TV shows like the original Trek series were able to focus on character development in one off episodes for each character so then when later on you combined two well developed characters you could pit them against each other or team them up and it could yield interesting and fun results. See the episodes of Community when Abed/Annie were paired together of Jeff/Shirley. It’s one of the reasons why the MCU is successful – individual films establish the characters enough that when you through Tony Stark and Steve Rodgers together the interaction felt genuine. Nothing in this series so far feels genuine with maybe the exception of the interaction between Seven and Picard because we sorta knew both characters well enough to know what to expect. On the other hand the Agnes/Rios and Soji/Narek romances may have well been first Tinder dates rather than actual relationships – I mean I thought Discovery’s romance between Michael/Ash were poorly crafted but it seemed like Riker/Troi compared to these pairings.The second season needs to be far more character driven for this show to ever be viewed in the same light as prior series. Right now it is a notch below ENT for me and just slightly above DIS – which is really sad when you consider they had the most interesting character in all of Trek to work with and all of the prior series IP. Also, I will say telling stories about Romulans and Borg seems tired – I’d have loved something that was more globally focused on what has happened in the 25 years since the end of the Dominion war.
Great examples!Even between Picard and Seven, there’s no context to gauge their interaction here because they’ve never shared any prior screen time together since Voyager took place in the Delta Quadrant up until the final episode.
It’s like every character is Harry Kim, but we don’t know he had a girlfriend back home, and we never see him play clarinet.
Cranston, you nailed. I have no problem with Trek being updated or different. Just like TOS was different when they starting making movies with that crew, and II, III, and IV (I even liked VI) ended up being pretty damn good, but updated, different, and of course older.Disco and Picard seem to be suffering from the same thing the current Star Trek Kelvin reboot movies suffer from: the J.J. Abrams effect he and his minions have on things. They suck, they’re hacks, and they won’t produce anything above mediocre because they just aren’t capable. They don’t care about the lore of Trek, just like Abrams didn’t care when it came to Star Wars, and we saw how well that turned out. It’s really unfortunate because I like most of the characters and the actors in Picard, but it’s like watching a beloved relative die from a prolonged illness.
“They suck, they’re hacks, and they won’t produce anything above mediocre because they just aren’t capable.”Thanks, I needed a good laugh today.
spending some time seeing the practical steps required to hide such a big crime in a fancy future ship would’ve been coolAgnes is pretty much screwed the next time the EMH comes online.
Well, assuming she wasn’t smart enough to cover her tracks by modding his memory. I think that problem is pretty easily solved.
I’m still not convinced that the person she made out with wasn’t the EMH doing Rios’ voice. Maybe it’s turned PI!
I’m really trying with this thing, but I just can’t get past this sinking feeling that it’s just all wrong and can’t be salvaged. The Red Letter Media guys are correct: notwithstanding the non-trivial fidelity of the call-backs (ship designs; plotting elements from the shows and movies; returning actors; terminology and history), the people writing this have only the most superficial understanding of Star Trek. (I don’t think it’s overblown to say that something “isn’t [franchise name]” — I think it’s actually appropriate in the case of something like Trek, where the crucial innovations, the elements that give the thing its nature and purpose, are elusive and difficult because they work on the highest and most abstract levels. The phraseology is irritating, and prompts needless semantic debates, but it’s really no different from Frank Oz saying that Disney’s Muppets show violated all the original characterizations and had the wrong tone — “Writing for the Muppets is very difficult,” he avowed — or comics fans concluding that the Snyder/Cavill Superman is so totally different from anything recognizable that he might as well not have the same name.)I’ve been watching TNG and TOS episodes interspersed with Picard and the basic difference is just overwhelmingly clear: the specific feeling you get from Trek (mainly from television — the movies are a different conversation) can be traced all the way back to Edward Bellamy and the Edwardian roots of sci-fi: the urgent present-day hunger for a hypothetical future state where basic problems are solved. Whether it’s Thomas Moore or Gene Roddenberry, the stringent insistence on that core idea is what gives the stuff its value; it’s why we get that particular feeling watching Kirk or Picard (or Sisko or Janeway) solve problems — their stories are like philosophical or spiritual parables.This show is made by people who are trying to reproduce the basic elements of contemporary sci-fi that are known to “work,” grafting those elements into a superficial reconstruction of the Trek universe. I won’t say it’s devoid of ideas — there are feints towards the kind of ontology and politics that old Trek routinely got into — but the full-bore examination of a future society that functions or fails to function as a hypothetically enhanced or improved projection of our own, is just not happening. This is basically a Star Wars or MCU universe, a wild-west free-for-all designed for maximum chaos, danger and superficial conflict, which is a totally acceptable armature for nearly all sci-fi (old and new) but has always been exactly what we run to Star Trek — and forgive its perpetual cheesiness and dorkiness — to escape from.
Cheesiness and dorkiness is a given when discussing Trek. I think you’re right about what’s missing from Picard. Trek was always the old fashioned idea of science-fi where it took an idea and ran with it to its logical extent. They just don’t make TV shows like that anymore (except The Orville). It definitely makes sense to say that something isn’t really Trek. DS9 may have rehabilitated its reputation, but even now Enterprise is still not well liked (although it grew on me).
Part of the problem here is the differences in backgrounds between the current writers and the older shows. There you had the influence of Roddenberry, and the formal restrictions of tv at time putting distinct limits on what kind of stories could be told.
We’re 30 years further now and the people writing Trek have almost no limitations and have radically different backgrounds.
Kurtzman came to Trek after writing Alias and Hercules, Beyer wrote Voyager novels, and Chabon has talked about his love for old Star Trek novels. Kurtzman’s contribution to Star Trek (for better or worse) is to take that MCU expanded universe-approach to what was formerly a more elevated franchise. Star Trek was cheesy, and dorky, but it was also always just a bit pretentious.
That’s gone now. Kurtzman has brought comic book storytelling to Star Trek, where it’s more important to hook your viewer to tune in next week than it is to tell a self contained story.
I don’t think it’s that the people making Picard have a superficial understanding of Star Trek, I think it’s more that various limitations are coming together in a way that is keeping this show from working as a Star Trek story. I think they’re all passionate about Star Trek, but aren’t really capable of reproducing the elements that actually create that quality we call Star Trek.
Kurtzman can’t keep himself from choosing flash over substance, Beyer is essentially just a fanfiction writer, and Chabon, while a great novelist, is still new at the whole showrunning thing.
They specifically chose to set the show in the margins of a Federation turned inward, that’s fine. But now they’ve gotten lost in the machinations of plot, losing sight of what these things mean.
I desperately wish they would have had someone in the writer’s room who would have gone through their scripts and just asked ‘why?’ every time they decided something. The whole show is screaming for, not so much a rewrite, as a rethinking.
Because who cares if there’s a conspiracy against the Federation that used androids to blow up ships? This show is like if in The Drumhead the issue had been who tried to blow the warp core, and not the moral slide of those looking for the perpetrator.
> but it was also always just a bit pretentious.
Ah, yes, it hadn’t occurred to me before, but you’re right that this is part of what gives TNG (the only Trek I’ve seen enough to have an opinion on) its special feel. It has ambitious cultural/political/philosophical aspirations that you have to admire it for having, even at the times when it doesn’t quite live up to them.
Picard feels preoccupied with a totally different set of concerns, and I don’t think that’s the sort of thing a show can recover from, at least not in the course of a single season. It’s entertaining enough that I’ll keep watching, but my hopes are on season 2.
It’s why the swearing on the shows these days feels so off, Star Trek always had slightly formal language. If there was any swearing it was in Klingon.In a way I don’t envy Chabon et al, making this show is may be the hardest job any Star Trek writer has ever had. They don’t just have to make a good show, they have to bring back one of the franchise’s best characters, while placing him in an entirely new situation. It has to feel part of the continuity while also expanding it, and somehow feel like Star Trek without having the trappings of a Starfleet crew or ship.Maybe if they had had more time to write it could have worked better than what it is, because there are interesting ideas there. They’re just kind of underbaked.
The earlier canon reference to swearing—Kirk in 20th century San Francisco, is played for comedy. Either because it is making a meta joke about TOS being on network TV and the characters thus being unused to cursing, or because it’s supposed to represent the tension between how (unrealistically) enlightened federation citizens are compared to real humans because they are essentially allegorical figures.Double Dumbass on you.
What you’re describing is what Iappreciate — for the first time in 25 years, Star Trek is actually moving forward. Not just treading old ground. That means a lot to me.
That’s a good point about the unique writing challenges this series presents compared to past ones (w/r/t continuity, serialized story, and having big shoes to fill w/ Picard as previously written). And yeah, lots of the ideas introduced are interesting, but thoughtful writing requires extra thinking time that maybe they just didn’t have.
I think every star trek show is overtly making socio-political points, but they just reflect the time in which the shows were made. TNG had a lot of heavy-handed stuff, like all Trek, and some of it worked, and some didn’t (Warp speed limits, anyone? UGH). But the late 80s-early 90s were more concerned with stuff like apartheid, environmentalism, etc. Unfortunately in 2020, we’re dealing with a world on fire and everyone losing their damn minds. So that’s the Trek we get.
Starred for pretentious. That’s exactly what it’s missing.
Something about Star Trek Picard feels a bit half-hearted and low-budget. Like the people in charge weren’t sure if it was gonna work or not, so they threw this season out there on the cheap as a test. The set designs are all rather boring and bland. We haven’t seen any other federation ships. And the story for the most part seems pretty meandering. The scenes on the Borg cube up this point had been a waste. This episode would have hit MUCH harder if we had only found out about the Borg cube when Picard did. Episode 6 should have been our first look at the cube, and our first introduction to Hugh, that would have been something. Imagine the end of episode 5 if Maddox whispers to Picard that Soji is on “the artifact”, and we just see horror wash over Picard’s face. To fill the gap left behind by the axed cube scenes, the writers should have devised a situation where Starfleet had sent a ship after Picard to try and stop him, maybe even make a former TNG/DS9/VOY character captain of the ship. Would have been interesting to see the ex-starfleet characters on the La Serena try to stay one step ahead of a Federation starship. I think that would have created some wonderfully tense situations, watching a Federation crew wrestle with having to stop a legend, seeing some daily Federation life in present day, the viewers getting to be on-board a starship. Ugh, missed opportunity so far!
The thing Zack brought up with archetypes/tropes has bothered me since at least the 2nd episode – so much of the story and characters are built on cliches that we’ve seen so often elsewhere. I realize not everything is going to be original or creatively ambitious – plenty of old Trek is a testament to that – but seeing these tired techniques used so liberally has really taken me out of the series. It feels lazy, at best. At worst it comes off as insulting to both my intelligence and what Trek can and often could be.
I was thinking of RLM while reading this
“What I’m looking for is a reason to engage with this story beyond familiarity, beyond it existing simply because revisiting a popular character is a good way to pull in an audience. I want a valid reason for this to exist that isn’t purely financial”
– Jay! What do you know about Picard?
– Ehm – he drinks Earl Gray.
– What about the Cardassians?
-….you mean Kim?
– ok, they’re not going to be in Picard.
-TNG-Picard is like the strict teacher you respected, who would not tolerate half-assing the assignment or complaining about the work and would give you a dressing down for having such and attitude. This Picard is like when you run into that teacher as an adult outside the classroom setting, not the authority figure you remember, a human with flaws. Picard here is not “the boss” of anyone, he’s hired a pilot and the rest are there with their own agenda in some way(not counting Elnor’s oath). This seems like a character study about Picard getting his mojo back.-I am starting to think that Dr. Jurati could be a synth as well. This could be because I watched Blade Runner yesterday and her mannerisms looked like how some Replicants were so maybe I’m misreading it. She likely doesn’t know it like the twins(she may have her own). Perhaps the real one was captured in that meeting with Commodore Oh and replaced, programmed to kill Maddox. Or she herself was and couldn’t stop herself to kill him.
I agree – I think Agnes is a bot. When she tells Rios her father had a beard and liked books and then saw Maddox has a beard – I felt like Maddox created her but then they fell in love (creepy).
Ah, I missed the bearded dad thing, but I did forget to add that I suspected Maddox created her to be his lover. In TNG, he seemed like an awkward guy who probably didn’t do well with the ladies so this does not seem too far-fetched.
I have to look back at the previous episodes, but the way she describes their work together, it dates back well before he would have known how to build someone that advanced.
They could be implanted memories like Soji/Dahj.
That’s what I thought this show needed – more incest!
I think that either Starfleet Intelligence or the Tal Shiar showed Dr. Jurati something that made her very afraid of whatever Maddox did. She’s now a plant for them. She’s not intelligence, so she’s really bad at this.
This was my thought as well. Do we know how long it has been since Agnes saw Maddox last?
I want a valid reason for this to exist that isn’t purely financial.Ha. Good luck with that.
Every single instance of Trek since (including?) the original has been made for commercial reasons. TNG was made because TOS and its movies were popular. DS9 was made because TNG was popular and nearing its end of life. Voyager was made to launch UPN. Etc.
Not that ds9 wasn’t an excuse to extend IP, but I think the post-occupation setting made it about something more than just “What if Lost in Space, but Starfleet?”When Bajor was first introduced in tng it seemed like they were trying to tackle a serious subject. (even if explicit Israel or Balkan allusions weren’t really ds9’s thing)
I felt that the Israel allusions were VERY explicit in DS9.
Exactly. I don’t remember Star Trek being on PBS.
Yes and, Willie Wonka was made to sell chocolate bars. Person of Interest was sold as a cop spy procedural. What you do with your platform, once you get one; that’s up to you.
While I completely agree with Zach’s overall criticisms regarding characterization and the overall vision for the series, I found this episode to be….actually good.I was surprised as hell, especially after last week’s utter shit show of an episode.And, yeah, there are some dumb things here, like Picard inexplicably getting stranded on the cube for a flashback-appropriate amount of time.And plenty of cliches, like Elnor and Hugh inexplicably staying behind to “cover” Picard’s escape when the safest way to do that would just be to leave with him. But I guess they didn’t want those extra characters loitering around next week for the Picard/Rikers reunion. But it felt like writerly fiat for sure.Still, for the first time, storylines started to converge, there were some real thrills and finally, finally 6 episodes in, this show started to come into focus. They just might salvage this season after all.
Hugh and Elnor stayed behind to make sure the Romulans don’t just immedaitely use the trajector to get to Picard.
But, again, because the writers want it that way. You could easily have made the “rules” of the device such that they could escape and “wipe the log” so they couldn’t be followed.
Everything in a story is the way it is because that’s how the writer wrote it.
Picard survived the assassination attempt that destroyed his artificial heart because the writers wrote it that way. They could have easily wrote that Q wasn’t messing with Picard and that he really was going to die with the artificial heart, and had Picard killed off in that episode.
The Klingon Empire almost collapsing after Praxis exploding is that way because the writers wrote it that way. The writers could have easily said that the Klingons have thousands of ships and dozens if not hundreds of worlds they could have evacuated to.The Borg only sending one Cube at a time against earth because the writers wrote it that way. The writers could have easily written it so that the Borg sends 10 Cubes, assimilates the Federation, and ends the Star Trek franchise.Also, why would the Borg have the ability to wipe the logs? They’re the Borg, they’ve never shown any concern for that kind of security. They don’t care when people board their ship and study their equipment. They have no reason to erase any logs for their drones.
“Everything in a story is the way it is because that’s how the writer wrote it.”Yes, obviously. I pointed out that the “two guys stay behind to make sure the hero escapes!” is a VERY old cliche that “Picard” trotted out and your defense of that trope was to say, “well, they stayed to make sure they couldn’t be followed.”You used the “in universe” explanation to refute my “real world” analysis of the show. But, as you yourself point out, any “in universe” explanation is subject to the whims of the writers. So they didn’t HAVE to resort to that cliche, which was my point.
If they could just wipe the logs to hide where they went, people would have been complaining about that and how it was too easy.
Exactly. Someone had to stay behind to shut it down and hide it, that was Hugh. Elnor stayed behind to protect Hugh.
If the Borg Queen ever needed to escape from her secret chamber, wouldn’t she automate the system to blow up, disable itself, password-lock itself, or at least physically retract and hide itself immediately afterward?Aside from this dumbness, and the dumbness of Picard looking through an image of himself which must have been flipped to make that visual make sense, I actually liked this episode the best of the series so far since the pilot. Stuff is happening, people are interesting/complex, I’m much more interested in it now.
Why would she bother? One assumes that if the Queen is retreating the ship is probably going to blow.
I think that’s a leap. Unless she knows she’s in a sci-fi adventure movie. Then sure. But in (slightly-more-)real-life, I think if you have a super fancy getaway door, with what appeared to be an advanced combination lock to reveal, it locks after you slam it behind you. 🙂
Not only that, but the Romulans didn’t even know that area of the cube existed and Hugh certainly didn’t want them finding out about it.
Agreed—-yes, there was some cheesiness in the first half, but the second half was easily the best moments of the series so far. Not sure what people were really expecting here——a Westworld-level scripted drama?Overall, A minus episode. And the women are putting out the best performances on the show to this point, particularly Michelle Hurd.Great to see Hugh again, too.
I’m not sure why we need to have such low expectations? There’s no reason at all that Picard couldn’t be at “Westworld” levels.Or even higher.( I’m not a huge fan of Westworld myself.) But if you had said that the cheesy 70s movie was going to be reinvented the way it has been, no one would have believed it would have been that good. Just as there’s no earthly reason why you couldn’t reinvent TNG into some next level shit.
Beware, this will be long, lol.TNG was only on the level of a premium HBO production in effects and writing at very infrequent times. Offhand episodes like Yesterday’s Enterprise, BoBW, Inner Light are the ones that come to mind. And Picard only has a fraction of the budget of Westworld from what I understand.
“Just as there’s no earthly reason why you couldn’t reinvent TNG into some next level shit.”Well, for one, the actors alone would probably cost more money starring in every episode than the ones they have on the show now. Second, TNG was far less serialized than most streaming dramas nowadays. It was a procedural about exploration and optimism, which I do not believe will work in the 10-episode format (for the former) and modern TV dramas for the latter. Third, I’m not sure how you would have Picard captaining a ship when he’s pushing 100 in canon years.To me, that they’ve (seemingly) found their footing with this week’s very good-to-great episode so early, with a complete departure from TNG, is a pleasant surprise. I love the cast, even relatively useless (till now) Eldor and really the only weak character so far (still) is the captain, IMHO.Honestly, I couldn’t even say that about TNG—-I didn’t like either Crusher, LaForge’s character was mediocre at best, Troi was about as pointless a character that ever existed, and Riker was a cartoon.
I’m not really sure what your point is here? Yes, TNG was made during a very different time period and its cast consisted of some characters who, to put it charitably, weren’t particularly dynamic, especially by modern standards. But you don’t need to cast A-list actors like Ed Harris or Anthony Hopkins to have a great series. In fact, most of what we consider true, modern “peak TV classics” featured casts that were relative unknowns. Whatever “Picard”’s flaws, a solid cast is not one of them.“Picard” is heavily serialized, like many (most?) prestige dramas these days, but it’s serialized in the dumb way, where every episode is literally just a piece of a larger story and the episodes (rarely) have a specific identity of their own. This has gotten slightly better in the last couple, but at the beginning, the narrative was just broken up into tiny bits and the episodes were all just links in a chain.But, again, the best modern shows are also serialized, but in a way that also respects the art of the episode. The best shows feature episodes that are their own specific stories, with a beginning, middle and end, which are still part of the large narrative fabric. There are many mediocre shows (of which Picard qualifies) which just have one, long story that is just chopped up lazily into “chapters” as opposed to chapters.But my larger point stands. We live in a world where there is some absolutely terrific TV out there and there’s no reason we should lower our standards and expect “Picard” to just be mediocre because, “Well, it’s Star Trek, so how good could it be?” It actually COULD be great. It’s just not.
My first point here is that Star Trek as it existed in the TNG era does not seem to be a type of show that would lend itself to the 10-episode serial drama format.
Secondly, putting aside the vast difference in funding between Westworld (or other HBO prestige dramas) and Picard for a second:
To basically do “Picard” the showrunners had to take what was an iconic and well-defined character from a completely different structure and feel of show, then transplant him into current canon universe and structure of a serial/story-arc type drama.The universe of Trek in the current TV canon is completely different from the TNG era (blame that on JJ Trek, Discovery, whatever), so the writers have to figure out how to take said beloved character and figure out how how he would not only fit into this universe, but what the last 30 years or so would have changed this character. AND make it into the kind of show that will get people to shell out money for yet another streaming service (i used to be heavily into Trek and never subscribed for Discovery—I’ve had enough of these pre-quel series where you already know largely how things will turn out).
Its an enormous undertaking, especially with the non-forgiving nature of Trek fans, and frankly, I’m not shocked the show has had teething problems, but I am hopeful that with Ep. 6 being a huge step forward that they are on the right track now.Besides, TNG season 1 got off to a far more rough start than Picard, and they had well over 20 episodes to figure it out. You can make the argument that it wasn’t till well into Season 2 that they figured out where to go.(puts on flameproof suit) and Pulaski>>>>>Crusher.
Westworld isn’t very good at all, it’s just complicated and has a high budget. What I expect from Star Trek though is something more like the Westwing, than Westworld. I want stories that pose moral dilemmas to our characters, and give you the satisfaction of watching them fix, or solve things.
Agreed.
It took them six episodes for anything to happen. Sounds like Westworld to me.
2nd season was even worse—not much of anything happened for the whole 10 episodes. Pretty weird for a Jon Nolan show.
Yeah, there’s some stuff there that’s just not very good like the Soji/Narek relationship, and the show doesn’t know how to play Rafi’s issues (you can’t go from funny drunk to tragic drunk that way).
But overall this was an improvement simply because stuff started happening.
The show is still too thin and shallow to actually support this slow storyline, but just getting a bunch of the characters to finally meet up is something.
The thing I keep thinking about is how would this story have been told on TNG, and every time the answer is: a lot faster. Though really the big difference is that TNG used episodes to tell whole stories. Picard is like a comic book, it gives you just enough to keep you coming back for the next issue, when it wouldn’t have been impossible to turn the season so far into an actual set of satisfying stories. The key would have been to find some moral dilemma in each particular part of the larger story. Something to make each part of his journey distinct and its own thing.
“you can’t go from funny drunk to tragic drunk like that”Clearly you have not been around a lot of real alcoholics. It’s exactly like that.
And that kind of storytelling is a problem across many modern TV shows, not just Picard. But the best shows find a good balance. Look at Mad Men, Breaking Bad, etc. Each episode has its own distinct story while being part of the larger narrative.
The Raffi stuff was pretty bad this week. Here substance abuse has been much discussed and then she just kind of randomly falls into a pit this week for no real reason.
No real reason? Did you miss the scenes of Raffi and her son last week? Raffi falling “into a pit” is direct fallout from her meeting with her son and him rejecting her.
Didn’t she just find out her son is having a kid and wants nothing to do with her?
“she just kind of randomly falls into a pit this week for no real reason.”Yeah, it’s not like she had a traumatic reunion with her son last week where he totally rejected her.
I actually thought last week’s episode was better. Felt snappier, good dialogue, and the actors seemed to be having fun. While things definitely move forward in Ep 6, a lot of the scenes felt about 80% baked to me. Or maybe I just liked Ep 5 because it showed zero minutes of Soji and Narek. That kiss between Rios and Dr Jurati came outta nowhere for me. Obviously there is a lot going on with her character right now, but I feel like the writers have made a mess of it. I miss having consistent contact with Starfleet. I think throughout all of the shows its underestimated just what a huge character Starfleet/Federation is. So far its kind of just been there lurking in the shadows instead of in our face every episode. It doesn’t feel like Star Trek without Starfleet.
Episode 5 was the worst so far. Embarrassingly bad!! 🙂
This episode was fun, but I wouldn’t go so far as to say it was good; it was well-made and easier to watch than most of the rest. But it’s still filled with lazy tropes and weak re-treads of things we’ve already seen; again, Zach identifies the many critical problems of the show but goes soft; he also makes a straw man out of the “not Star Trek” argument, which Jordan Orlando goes into beautifully above.
I’m definitely grading on a MAJOR curve. I’ll take “fun” over the utter mess that this show has been so far. Actually “good”, though? Eh, not really.
I also need to mention that yesterday late afternoon, while I was literally on my laptop in a cafe actually reading a “Picard” discussion on another forum, Michael Chabon and his wife sprinted out of the cafe I was working it. I only had a second to register that, yes, this was Chabon and I’m pretty sure he and/or his wife only came into the place to use the bathroom and make a very hurried escape afterwards.Sadly, there was no opportunity to accost him and ask him why the fuck they didn’t bring back the original Maddox and for that I’ll never forgive myself.
The original Maddox is an acting teacher now, so I suspect he couldn’t get away, and has maybe retired from acting.
If he’s an acting teacher, it’s not like he suddenly gave up his old profession to become a therapist or something. He’s still in that world.And he’s a teacher in Pasadena, which would have made it ridiculously easy to appear in “Picard.” I firmly believe they just never approached the guy, which is a shame.
Man, you’re more mad about this than the actor who doesn’t givea shit.
Where did Brian Brophy say he didn’t give a shit? Would love to see that, if true.
On his FB
It’s an odd obsession. I’ll say that. Or, wait, LaurenceQ is that actor’s burner account. Now it all makes sense.
That wasn’t the original Icheb getting his eyeball torn out either which is odd considering he’s still on the convention circuit.
Actors are as much a PR representative as performer. It’s always been true, but I think it’s a hell of a lot more important now than it’s ever been. I’m betting they probably thought his social media presence was a liability.When Anthony Rapp revealed that Kevin Spacey tried to pressure him into having sex when Rapp was 14 and Spacey was 26, Manu Intiraymi called Rapp a “liberal whiner” who was part of a “PC witch hunt” against Spacey. He retweets a lot of people who complain about “SJWs”. Plus he keeps baiting Trek fans for the clicks, posing questions like “will Trek fans unfollow me if I say I sexualize (women in profession)“ and talking about trying to hide his boner in his Icheb costume.
Fuck Icheb.
He certainly did at the end there!
The original Icheb wasn’t asked back because he posted a lot of nasty stuff on twitter about another Trek actor being a “baby” about being sexually assaulted by Kevin Spacey.
yah I just found out about that, yikes! Still, whoever they cast they did a good job cuz I totally recognized it as him instantly and assumed it was the same guy. The nose implant helps to ID him and the fact he was bloodied and missing an eyeball covered up it wasn’t the same actor.
Oh yeah, they did pretty well. If original Icheb’s actor hadn’t been complaining up a storm, I wouldn’t have even known.
Cool story, bro.
I only know from what I’ve read, but these reviews’ opinion of these recent Star Trek series is indeed about their quality, not the writer’s nostalgia. They’re exceedingly rare in that regard, with maybe one or two peers as exceptions. Most writing on these two shows has either wasted its time obsessing over their connections to the franchise’s past at the expense of measured perspective on the show itself (with the shows’ own dubious encouragement in many cases), or it’s been brainlessly celebratory or denunciatory pap by writers who either aren’t equipped to write commentary or pretend they aren’t because it’s not SEO.I don’t understand the hesitation elsewhere to approach these shows over the reasons they’re so lackluster as TV shows, instead of engaging exclusively with how “faithful” they are to a corporate franchise. It does no show any favors to be “good Star Trek” if it’s not good TV.
I think this was the first time I really cared about Soji. Don’t get me wrong, torn loverboy spy still feels far too… convenient I guess to really work for me, but here watching Soji try to understand who she is and go through the dream made me connect with her journey. Even more than with the sister during her awakening.Something I also appreciated here was that after Picard’s journey in to the failures of dreams, here he was able to see the power of idealism. Both with Hugh’s great work and also with Elnor’s willingness to sacrifice himself for those he cared about. I thought those decisions carried real power after Seven’s fall last episode.
I have to keep reminding myself this is network tv, and people who write for network tv don’t give a shit about security guards just doing their damn job. You don’t even have to feel bad about killing them.
Your site redesign sucks!
if you’re enjoying this, please take my frustrations as not an attack on your enjoyment, or as an attempt to convince you out of liking something While I appreciate the consideration, I’d hope that any piece of entertainment can still be discussed critically without fans being personally offended.
I get how exaggerated reactions can be on the internet, but it’s just unhealthy if your mind actually reacts similarly.
Michael Chabon on his instagram has done several extensive Q&A’s, big ones off the top of my head was the Icheb violence in the last episode was that torture has been a reucring thing in Star Trek (true) and that they had to show quickly how rough things are for Seven (debatable). there were references to the Dominion War in the scripts that got cut as too incomprehensible for new viewers (also debatable since the show deep dive easter egg references all the time) so it is more “implied” but he said absolutely that the Feds isolationist attitude is a consequence of the Dominion War. Plus, y’know, all that other stuff.
Interestingly, there was an interview with Frakes who said Roddenberry wouldn’t have let a scene with Seven and Picard discussing their trauma fly in the TNG era which does stand out as probably one of the best scenes in the series so far. I am an eternal sucker for Borg stuff so I loved this episode, Picard’s trauma at the Borg and how it comes back when he gets around them is always kind of fascinating. The XB having their implants removed and tearful reaction was really heartfelt. But there’s still active drones on the ship, right, cuz they have to keep reclamating them and we saw one open it’s eyes when Picard was having his freak out (also random clips from First Contact in there too and that scene of Picard looking at Locutus was absolutely heartbreaking). His meeting with Hugh was also so great. “They’re making sure you don’t fall!” And, y’know, random XB going “Locutus?”
I always maintain that Picard has never really “gotten over” it, which is totally understandable (and even explicitly stated). He has some small breakthroughs, recognizing Hugh as an individual back in TNG after his assimilation is a big one, but it can come crashing back to him especially when he’s around Borg anytime. If this cube had been connected to the Collective, god knows what his reaction would have been.
His speech about the Borg at the start wasn’t quite a “the line must be drawn here!” moment but what is? Got close, though. Also Chabon basically posted a shut mouth zip it can’t say emoji when asked about the Borg Queen and with two references here I think she may show up.
DelArco as Hugh had some great moments, there’s a bit when Picard is talking about Soji and Hugh does a trademark Borg head tilt which is still there. Also I loved his line delivery about even though they’ve never seen the Queen’s chamber he says bitterly and wryly “It’s all… just there.”
I find the non-Borg stuff with Soji and the Romulan agent guy compelling if not riveting, I mean the gal screams and cries quite a lot so you kinda feel bad for her and her going full Terminator was sorta of awesome. Raffi didn’t actively irritate me this episode, her sweetalking her friend scene was great. Agnes is all a ball of waiting to explode hidden emotions which could be nuts (and I love Allison Pill doing anything). Also Hugh and Romulan Sword guy are too badass to go out like that (closing with the cut to black “Please friends, chose to live.” was awesome). They were probably left behind for a plot reason to keep cutting back to The Artifact now that Soji has bailed. Hopefully next time we see them they’re just atop a pile of Romulan croonies and all bloodied up “Phew, that was interesting. Now let’s use the Artifact for the betterment of all species quality of life! Yay!”
And then the Borg wake up and assimilate everyone. Cuz it’s gonna happen dangnabit! be totally sad for the XBs though but what are you gonna do. Hugh being re-assimilated could be downright horrifying.
Hugh was in next week’s teaser (“You let them go”).
Cool, I didn’t know that up on Crave in Canada we don’t get teasers, just the credits music at the end which I’m down with (the episodes go live at 3 AM EST though the same time which is good because I work nights, little odd that it airs on Space cable channel at 9 PM Thursday but it’s already been on Crave for 12+ hours) The downside is they region locked on youtube the Wil Wheaton hosted aftershow (and the Disco S2 BTS stuff) so I can’t watch those. And I watched about 2 or 3 full episodes of After Trek in Discovery S1 too!
The random XB going “Locutus?” like he just saw an old college buddy is my favorite thing.
Reminds me of that airport scene in Donnie Brasco when Depp’s cover was nearly blown.
As a fan of DS9, I’m glad that the writers were at least cognizant of the Dominion War. It does make me feel that there was a missed opportunity to world-build around the aftermath of that war – hundreds of millions dead, a quadrant devastated – instead of the Romulan stuff, which feels less, hmm, ‘organic’ or emergent from the story of DS9 and Voyager. It’s not like Picard doesn’t have a connection to Bajor (and boy, bringing back Michelle Forbes could have been awesome) and Cardassia (some non-Star Trek fans might even be aware of ‘There. Are. Four. Lights!’). Oh well. Idle thoughts.
Actually quite liking this series so far. Yeah, the artifact part of the story drags, but the rest of it has a subtlety and depth that Discovery lacks.
A lot of complaints about how Picard has really lost his edge since TNG. (Similar complaints about an old Luke Skywalker. Apparently age is no excuse for dropping baddassitude.) Part of that is age, part of that is losing both his Starfleet commission and his rescue mission 14 years prior. But I seem to recall the medical diagnosis mentioning his ability to make judgments as well. And finally, it has been pointed out that when it comes to the Borg, Picard was a little unstable even in the TNG days.
For the record, though, Patrick Stewart is still the man. I will fight, with a battleth, anyone who says differently.
Romulans have three names.Cats have three names.Romulans are cats.Vulcans would probably whine about the undistributed middle, but you know in your heart that this is true.
Feels right. Regarding cats, deductive analysis is useless anyway. A pointy fluid that really loves and wants to kill you but really loves you (and wants to eat you).
I don’t think Elnor is dead, if only because there are scenes from the season promo of him interacting with characters that we haven’t seen yet.
Letting people with only a surface level understanding of Star Trek run the franchise is something of a recent tradition. JJ admits he was never a Star Trek fan, and details like calling a Klingon ship a Warbird is the result.
Essentially, you’re saying the character work (as far as the writers’ input goes) is rote, blandly archetypal, and lacking specificity of purpose except to move the plot along. I say, yes. This whole CBS Star Trek universe seems to suffer from an inability to even make an effort to try and pretend that they are interested in creating characters we should care about. Everything is in service to the big moments. Picard is in better shape than Discovery only because someone put the work in 20-30 years ago to make us care about some of these people and the world they inhabit (oh yeah, the world building in Discovery is the worst, btw). I’ll keep watching. It’s better than Discovery, which I will not be watching anymore, and nostalgia goes a long way for me where Star Trek is concerned.
OK Let’s go find a planet with two moons and electrical storms…surely can only be one of those in the entire known universe of billions of planets…BTW, I always wondered why, in a hive-mind collective that robs all assimilated people of their individuality, that Picard got a unique name? TV, I guess
I like to think the opening credits are symbolic of the theme of the show, and it’s about putting Picard back together from the broken, and more bitter than he’d admit, man he has become. Hence his many mistakes. I’d also suggest that the federation split is more than the one time something didn’t go right for Picard, it’s the leaving Starfleet and losing his purpose, which is common when suddenly finding yourself outside an institution that’s shaped your entire life.
Holy crap. Evan’s great as Elnor. And kudos to the producers to let him keep the ‘Strayan (well, Melburnian, but nobody’s perfect, least of all Melburnians). They need to keep him around.
A friend on Twitter recently pointed out that saying something “isn’t Star Trek” isn’t really an effective criticism. I’d like to subscribe to your friend’s newsletter
The funny thing about Picard now is that he’s such an *actor* now – between hamming it up with an eyepatch and literally applauding Raffi’s performance. I don’t remember him applauding Riker’s undercover improvs.
I got the feeling that the applauds were his sad attempt to show that he appreciates her, because intellectually he gets that he screwed her over in the past, but it completely ignores the actual emotions Raffi is dealing with, because he doesn’t actually comprehend the heart of her issues.
It’s just actorly “business” to make us care about the camaraderie of this group, but the bad way (actors are always being asked to do this; contrive little gimmicks to make it look like the central main characters are an amusing little gang of buddies who “razz” each other, etc. — it goes back to the Bowery Boys and earlier). You can always tell when the burden is falling on the actors; when they have to do the work of making us believe in the dynamics of a close-knit groupTNG had a far more robust and meaningful set of relationships between its characters, but that takes time and consistency and depth of characterization — not just “chemistry” but good writing, too (meaning, beyond these sorts of broad stereotypes) to achieve. People gave George Lucas a hard time in ’77 for the stiff dialogue, etc. but by the time Luke, Ben, Han, Chewie and the droids were in transit to Alderaan, we knew exactly who each of them were (even Chewie; the chess gag ensured that) and were ready to cheer them on and enjoy their banter and arguing…and they hadn’t even met Leia yet. By the end of the movie everyone was beloved and Ben was mourned. Picard has had six times as much screen time and these people are still strangers with “attributes” — the Captain and the ditzy scientist hooking up showed how arbitrary and thin it all still is (despite, as I’m saying, the actors doing all this “business” to sell it — busy performances always means weak writing).
Basically 100% agree, just adding, Discovery is even worse. I do feel like I know who these (exceptionally Star Warsy, now that you mention it) characters are in Picard. Discovery leaves most of its characters even flatter.I posted this under STD but I think it’s worth saying again: I want to hang out with the original Star Wars crew. I want to hang out with the Orville folks. I do not have any interest in hanging out with Discovery, and I am ambivalent about the folks on Picard. (I’d also hang out with The Good Place for that matter, even in the clown house.) I would have hung out with Kirk, Spock, McCoy, Chapel, and Rand. I would have totally had fun watching classic movies or having a sunset beach wine picnic with the TNG bunch.Solve the hangout problem and you’ll have a lot less griping.
“I do not have any interest in hanging out with Discovery”You don’t want to hang out with Tilly? Blashphemy!
Picard has been a civilian and out of Starfleet for ~15 years. He will act and respond to things, like applauding Raffi, in ways he never would have done when he was captain of the Enterprise, where an entire crew reported to him and looked up to him.
I might be the last person to get to this particular epiphany, but it dawned on me during the “Last time, on Picard” cut scenes that at Picard’s core is a repackaged Battlestar Galactica: synthetic humans who don’t realize they are synthetic humans. And who (apparently) have a plan.
I took Picard’s “hubris” in this show more as a common failing for people as they get older. Time doesn’t work quite the same as it does for someone in their 20s or younger. As I’ve gotten older, I notice the passage of time less, things that are clear as day for me are in reality, 10 years ago, when I stop and think about it. When you’ve been away from somewhere as long as he has, sure, I believe he’d accept that things aren’t exactly as he left them, but there’d be enough for him to reconnect. He didn’t realize things were that different, that so much had changed. I felt bad for Raffie after her conning her “friend” into doing Picard’s bidding. You could tell she was destroyed having to do this to someone she considered a friend and she was disgusted with herself. The rest of the members of the crew just sit their and clap for her as she’s breaking down and trying to run away. That felt rather tone deaf, especially as I always believed Picard to be an empathetic character.
A friend on Twitter recently pointed out that saying something “isn’t Star Trek” isn’t really an effective criticism.This is entirely dependent on how you’re defining what ‘Star Trek’ is. Star Trek is many things, but one bit thing has to be present for me to qualify something as Star Trek: a mirror. I don’t mean a mirror universe, I mean, a mirror, as in, held up before us so that we can see ourselves. Episodes like “Let That Be Your Last Battlefield” and movies like “The Undiscovered Country,” where there is an exploration of the issues of our time set in the narrative of the future where we have warp drive to get around and alien races to fill in for our adversaries.
Picard is doing a great job of that. JJ Trek? No so much. My take on 2009’s Star Trek is that it is a great Star Wars movie, but not really Star Trek.Picard though? Best Trek since DS9.
THIS COMMENT AGED POORLY AND I WISH I COULD STILL FEEL THE WAY I DID WHEN I WROTE IT.
“Yet here we have a Picard who has spent a decade and a half as a recluse because something didn’t work out that one time.”Horrid take. The Federation’s abandonment of the Romulans broke Picard. He had believed in the Federation and in Starfleet his entire life up to that point.I am open to the argument that this Picard is more arrogant than the original and you can see that even before this break in Picard giving Starfleet that ultimatum, but a lot of where Picard is now traces directly to the Federation’s abandonment of its principles, Picard’s loss of his place in the Federation, and the death of Data. It’s not coming out of nowhere.
So as I read about this…it sounds more and more like this was a Star Trek show that they shoe-horned Picard in to make people interested.
They’ve said that he has a neurological disease, and I’m curious how that’s going to factor into things. Because if your title character is dying / has dementia, that means it shouldn’t be possible to just shoe-horn them into any ol’ story.It reminds me of Roslyn’s cancer in BSG, which really informed everything she did for the first few seasons. Except that Roslyn wasn’t the title character, and so there was always a chance that they could have killed her. (before they magically saved her…and then actually killed her)So I dunno. Is this all just Jean-Luc trying to go out in a blaze of glory? Or is this building to a story where borg-tech magically cures him? Patrick Stewart can’t be planning to do this forever, so maybe Picard is going to die, and then we will follow these characters for 5 more seasons on a ship named “The Picard”.
Valid criticisms. I am liking the show, but it’s obvious where the writing is weak. And in such cases, I always wonder if it’s just because editorial corners must be cut. For example, yes it would be better if the relationship between Narek and Soji were more “earned”, but on the other hand, I can’t stand the guy, really, so no big loss. An editorial decision.As for Picard seeming less perfect than classic “what would Picard do?” Picard, all I can say is that Patrick has clearly aged tremendously. And knowing how much age has diminished my own parents and the ways in which it has, whether or not they intended on portraying him this way, his growing weakness and short-sighted decision making rings true.
As someone who is aging myself, it’s easy to read Picard’s character here.
Picard of yore was enabled by relative youth & physical fitness, the best crew in Starfleet, the best ship in Starfleet, and securely buoyed up by the collective adulation of thousands throughout the Federation. All these let him bring his Best Game in TNG. He was determined and confident. Now, as an old man with lingering PTSD (not just from the Borg, but from Data’s death and a whole lot more), an illness, and a stupendous failure to cap off his career, and NOT with the best crew and ship, etc., those qualities read as bullheaded, arrogant, and naive.
Take away someone’s power and their leadership qualities will appear as flaws.
Look at how awkward he is! Decades of command instincts and skills are screaming in him to take over but he has to check himself, defer (rightly) to Rios, sit down as an equal with peers instead of assuming command. It’s like if Paul McCartney just went and joined a band as bass player and tried not to be Paul McCartney. Picard is out of his element. Given all this, I think he’s doing superbly to adapt to this weird, unprecedented mission.
In one para:“I’ve appreciated its efforts to present a more morally complex few of the Federation”“stripping anyway the utopian vision of the earlier series for a more complicated view of a feature where people” Jesus get a copy editor.
I have been trying to unsubscribe from CBS All Access for 3 days now. It’s a very difficult process.
I actually like the way they portray Picard. In the past he was most accomplished officer and saved the federation on multiple occasions. However in the end his advice was ignored and he went into moping in seclusion. Now he’s old with a bone to pick and a chip on his shoulder (I was right), while totally being a John Snow. This is why he is the way he is, an old slighted man who thinks he can be a hero once more. He will walk the path to Hell thinking he’s there to save some poor soul who doesn’t deserve to be there. I really hope the story will end with Picard having caused massive destruction for righteous reasons.
But it feels off to me. The original Picard (excluding the movies which are, to be kind, a bit of a mess character-wise)That’s the thing, really; this show seems to be more a continuation of the movies than a continuation of TNG. Which is unfortunate, but inevitable (after all, Discovery is best taken as a halfway point between a ‘real’ Trek series and the Abramsverse reboot).Even the criticism of the Federation feels rote; none of it is harsher than what we saw in Deep Space 9, and even Next Gen had its share of bad politics getting in the way of good behavior.Frankly no Trek post-DS9 has really made a convincing argument that it needs to exist when we already have DS9. It’s just a long, depressing list of “DS9 did it better”. But oh well.
I think Narek fell for Soji because she’s a better person than he is. He just can’t admit that due to his prejudice.
I think he’s been under his sister’s control all his life and he feels lost and secretly very similar to a robot who doesn’t know who she really is. That plus protective hormones, plus he’s always kind of been unhealthily in love with his powerful warrior “could go off at any time” sister and she’s basically the same but nicer; that’s like his zone.
I think the writers have been re-watching the Hellraiser movies that the Borg seem to have been shamelessly copied from to do more stealing. The “impossible” puzzle box is a dead ringer for the one in the movies that leads to the Cenobite dimension. The ocular amputation in the previous episode seemed like a deeper dig into the Hellraiser vibe. I supposed mimicry is flattery and geniuses steal.
Everytime this show introduces new technology it pushes my suspension of disbelief.I get that it was important for the plot and for the big dramatic reveal but I would really like to know how that magic wand works that can approximate the age of inorganic objects like photos, a diary and a necklace. IN TERMS OF MONTHS.Is there some residual radiation from when they were replicated? Because that’s the only possible solution I can think of and even that’s a stretch.
You can buy a medical tricorder which can scan your body and tell you what’s wrong with you, but a device that can scan an object and tell you how long it’s existed is too magical for you?
At least you could extrapolate a medical tricorder’s capabilities based on existing science (heart rate, x-rays, sonar…).Aarcheologist can extrapolate an objects age (usually, at best, in decades) based on the materials that were used to make it and how deep it was found underground.Aadditionally geologists can (very roughly) age centuries old fossils based on the amount of radiation it contains.How you can expand that to “this modern day necklace is only 30 months old” is anyone’s guess.
Besides carbon dating, modern science has lots of ways of determining how old an object is: https://www.mentalfloss.com/article/21623/10-methods-scientists-use-date-things It’s no great leap to extrapolate these methods into the Star Trek universe of a device that could scan an object and could tell when it was manufactured. No more than current medical scanning technologies extrapolated into a handheld device that could scan the entire body and tell you anything that’s wrong.
This Picard bullheaded, arrogant, and naive, charging forward into
crises and assuming other people will see the nobility of his cause and
protect him.This Picard works for me because this is exactly how someone like a Picard becomes when for one reason or another they’re no longer to captain of a Galaxy-Class star ship out on the edge of the known universe. You’ve spend the majority of your career giving orders, having them be executed, and for the most part everything working out. You know, leadership.
I’m really enjoying this show. To the extent that it’s a valid criticism to say that something *is* or *isn’t* “really Star Trek,” “Picard” feels a lot more like “Star Trek” to me than “Discovery.” The callbacks and returning characters aren’t completely shoe-horned in, like they seem to be in “Discovery” (*another* Spock semi-sibling? No one learned a lesson from ‘Final Frontier’?) and the evolution of Picard’s character as an old man seems pretty reasonable. Sure, any fan could quibble with some of the choices they made (the swearing someone mentioned elsewhere in the thread seems forced and incongruous) but you know, like Scotty himself said in ‘The Voyage Home,’ if his grandmother had wheels she’d be a wagon.
So many black tanktops. Did they just blow the wardrobe budget on the Pimp Planet ep?
I’m really glad I’m watching this as a casual fan and not a diehard Star Trek fan (I don’t know if the proper term is Trekkie or Trekker these days.) I’m really enjoying it and I apparently wouldn’t be if I was a diehard.Also, I don’t mind it being more serial than story of the week. I guess most of the episodes of previous shows have been story of the week with maybe some light serial stories added in, but I don’t feel like it’s a necessary element of a Star Trek series.
I don’t get the criticism of this version of Picard. To me, the character’s progression feels much more realistic and in-character than, for example, Luke, Leia and Han did in the latest Star Wars trilogy. Yes, he’s a little arrogant and more impulsive but he’s now an old man at the end of his life. It’s normal to see some big changes at this stage. And being in charge of this small rag-tag team is very different than being captain of the Enterprise.As for the show not feeling Star Trek enough, I don’t think it’s supposed to. It happens in the Star Trek universe but this feels more like a Rogue One situation, where the creators are experimenting with a different tone.
Why would Elnor be dead? “Please, my friends, choose to live” is not something a guy says if he’s about to get killed.
Anyone know of a weekly review that is as detailed and well written but less, well, harsh? Zack is super knowledgeable and has strong views, which makes him a good critic, but as someone who is a Trek fan but maybe not as critical a fan, and who is actually enjoying the show for the most part (although Raffi doesn’t work for me at all, nor the weirdly contemporary clothing), it’s a bit bummer to read these reviews each week. Obviously no one is making me do so, but just curious if anyone has a recommendation for other critics they like? Thanks!
I’m giving ST:Picard the benefit of the doubt because it’s the first ST TV series whose central character is from a prior series, only now with his entire support system and team yanked away. Yet like TNG, so far it hasn’t fallen down the trap of relying heavily on the franchise’s other series to build it’s foundation. It’s making a genuine effort to realistically (re)introduce Picard with the same actor, to current generations without him or the story lines being redundant/repetitive.
JL knows he’s dying. Of course he’s bullrushing through things: He’s working on borrowed time.
I have to say I disagree about Picard. I think one of the themes they return to in Star Trek, and particularly in DS9 is the idea that ‘it’s easy to be a saint in paradise’. It’s easy for Picard to be the moralising action hero when he’s sitting on the deck of the Federation’s flagship and armed with tons of torpedos and the Federation’s best officers at his side. This is just how people react to that same approach but with a bunch of alcoholics as his posse instead. The difference between how seriously you take your principal when he’s telling you off in his office and when you see him at a supermarket in slacks and a sports jacket.Now the challenge is to put those same principles he’s always had into action but without the flying cruise ship of death to force home whatever point he’s trying to make.
“They play goofy comedy music as a drunken Raffi strongarms a Starfleet contact into getting Picard diplomatic credentials, and then everyone applauds when she succeeds. Hurd is excellent in the scene, but everything else is pushing way too hard to make it a bonding moment.”
– weirder than than was playing the TNG theme as she staggers away drunk having burnt a friendship. Like that was supposed to be an uplifting win?
“the less the character he plays seems to be written as an extension of what we saw in Next Gen, and the more he looks like a representation of someone’s idea of what “Picard” represents”This just in – characters change when you haven’t seen them in ~15 years!
They play goofy comedy music as a drunken Raffi strongarms a Starfleet contact into getting Picard diplomatic credentials, and then everyone applauds when she succeeds.Oh my god. I hated this moment so much. At the end of her conversation, when her friend tells her never to call her again, Raffi looked completely broken, hurt, and defeated. And there’s Picard clapping in her face like an asshole.As each episode goes by I find it harder to recognize this version of Picard and see him as a natural extension of his character from TNG.
I am not the biggest STNG fan, or of Star Trek in general, since I was never a fan of procedurals and always liked serialized storytelling or, at least, a constant serialization of character development. I did watch some of it, because I love sci-fi, but only random episodes.I mention this to explain why I probably like this and STD (This acronym is just too funny not to use it) a lot better than most. I also mention it because I find it interesting that, eventhough I dont have any close understanding of STNG nor of the characters relationships (I know the broad strokes of them, but thats it), I found this episode by far the best yet and extremely touching.
Yes, every second of each scene with Picard and the old friends felt emotional, personal and touching, but that is expected when it comes from a 10 year history of built-in storylines together and development of their relationship, plus the nostalgia that comes with the 20 year wait for this reunion.
It is obvious that this crew wont feel like a crew yet. It is the 7th episode of a highly serialized series, with the first 3 episodes being a pilot where they havent gotten together yet and this one barely showed them. I feel the show has got a good grip of characters and none of them is a barely developed archetype (like most people thought Pills character would be) and thats a great start. With time, I can see this crew building some really strong and interesting relationships (I really enjoyed the scene with the two of them eating in the kitchen).
Also, no problem with Hugh dying. He was a guest actor on the show (He was on what? One episode? Two tops) and it was amazing they brought him back for as big a part as they did. They have a shitload of characters to keep coming back to.
One criticism I do agree with is the villains. The biggest problem with this type of storytelling is that by making the reason the °bad guys° want to destroy the protagonists a mystery that can only be revealed close to the finale, you inevitably oblige them to be stock villains with no personality, even if the reason is a good one, because you cant reveal their motivation till the end.